Kind of complicated. Last year we had a derecho, which is a fancy spanish sounding word that weathermen use for goshdarn big thunderstorm with high wind that came out of nowhere. This place is getting a new roof paid for by insurance. It has bats coming in along the entire gutterline. (Insurance is not paying for bats.) It is an old standing seam roof, they are replacing it with the five v style screw on roofing. I think some new drip edge might solve the problem, but my question is, how would you exclude bats from a gutterline that is being repaired?

Some thoughts are wait until they figure their way out from under the 5-v, and then seal up all but a limited amount of those and then put tubes on somehow. Or maybe this is a good application for using mesh to exclude? Maybe cut some holes in the soffit and hang tubes?

The building is one of those ancient fraternal organizations, and since I am a member, there is no running away from this one. Even though it is like a hundred year old building it only looks like the bats have been there a couple years. But it is a sizable colony from the looks of it. Lots of guano, just not very deep.

Hard to know on one like this. I had a similar job last Spring, in
which a building was getting new roof, fascia, etc. I did the Phase I (seal-up + one-ways), then customer backed out of the rest. My plan was to finish the job before the workers started, then bat-proof their work.
Ron Scheller might have some ideas on this.

The roof is a flat pitched roof with brick facades. Instead of gables the brick runs up past the roof. I am going to look over the flashing on the ends real good when I get up on it. I am recommending that they pay special attention to the ridge. The 5-V ridge caps are kind of like a bats welcome sign from what I have seen.

I didn't see any bats but they say they start making noise when they cut the heat on. Where are they? Under the tin?

Your going to have to work in concert with the roofers. If it were me I'd recommend nothing be moved until I had done a full temporary seal and exclusion. Since the roof is to be replace this frees you up to use field expediant methods that ordinarly wouldn't pass muster visually such as stripping the gap with hardware cloth or foam. Then once the bats are out have the roofers in to start the tear off but be sure that they only tear off what can be replaced in a dy's time, leave nothing open overnight. You'll need to be on site and do a daily inspection of their work each afternoon.
I've done more than a few of those type jobs and I hate them with a passion. A couple that come to mind are a masonic lodge that I basically had to take over the entire soffit rebuild as their guys kept letting the bats back in and another was a historic AME church that couldn't follow directions and let the roofers come in after a full exclusion and tear off the entire roof without bothering to give us a call and the bats moved in immediately. That one got ugly as there was federal funds involved (historic building) and the NAACP (AME) and we basically ate it on that one.
You mention the ridge cap. A new roof is the perfect time to go ahead and staple a two foot wide piece of hardware cloth down prior to installing the sheets, I wish all metal roofs were done that way.

Looking at the weather, I think they are going to have the roof on before the bats move much. They are doing it in the next couple of weeks. If they do a good enough job they will seal the bats in. If they don't it might take a while to figure out where the new holes are. I'm wondering if I could work with the roofers, and make sure it is a good seal and drop tubes through the soffit somehow, to be removed later. I suppose yo would have to make a screen "floor" out in the edges of the attic to funnel the bats into the excluders. Seems like it would be hard to get them to use an exit they weren't using allready. Has anyone ever tried the bat lure in such an application?

You're asking for a sure fire way to back the bats up into the occupied areas of the structure. Bats are creatures of habit and don't learn new tricks.
If you can't do it right the better option would be to have the roofers rip everything open as violently as possible and attempt to flush everything out as they go.

I'm with David on this one, and if you haven't had them "back" up on you before, you are in for a real treat. I had my first "blow back" I think a good friend
calls it, it will suck!! The more noxious and invasive the work being done or timing/scheduling of the work in relation to where the bats typically spend their time and their emergence/exit holes the worse it might be.

A good statement is "we don't want things to be worse than they are already" in this case. None of us can see your site, but what David says I think will keep
you out of the weeds and have the best chance for success.

Good luck either way, hope it turns out well,

Justin

I don't want to see a bat back-up ever again, I have seen it and fortunately didn't do it. Amazing where bats will turn up when you set a piece of sheet metal over a stone chimney.

What is the best way to properly exclude a long gap where the roof meets fascia? Would the gutter need to be removed? I'm thinking netting from the roof down the side of the building. The soffit is only about a foot overhang. It appears that a wind storm picked up the sheeting boards and tin, and then set it back down leaving a gap. The job needs a lift to be done properly but I know they cant afford renting one. I would run, but they know where I live. Considering telling them I can't kick the bats out because they are brother masons now.

It sounds like the ideal method would be a custom bent drip edge installed as the new metal is installed.

Do you mean a custom drip edge bent and gapped in such a fashion as to vent bats out? Or a custom drip edge with holes in it for one way valves?

Custom installed new with the new roof. You could snatch the gutters do a field expediant drip edge if you can slide the top edge under the existing metal sheet roofing leaving a gap between the bottom flange and existing fascia and valve that gap.

You just need to think it through and use finesse.

You will notice in the above reply that there is a picture of two people on the cover of WCT magazine. One of those people is DaveK and the other gentleman is my best friend, Al Krier. These are the only two people I know that have "finesse", so lots of luck.

Me...finesse? Heck no....I just have a team with finesse and good eyesight. You have to have good eyesight....

without reading the other resonance,,,,,,,,,,,,, net is a simple solution but expensive.............

why are they not credited for the bat work by the insurance?????? bats are not rodents?

I don't know if this helps but they make a gasket/weatherstrip that fits the exact contour of the metal roofing that is put down at the same time as the metal.The roofer should put this down on the bottom edge and I liked the hardware cloth idea along the ridge.

I'd start with verifying that the bats are present. If they aren't then as long as the roofers quickly start the job you don't have to worry about it. Point out to them that drip edge is needed and make it their responsiblity to install it, especially if you aren't getting paid for the job.

If no bats are present and work won't get started until after bats may be highly active again, seal off the ridge openings (and any others you can find) with any cheap material you can (cardboard, duct tape). In most cases you don't even have to worry about air flow with these temporary seals. This will buy the roofers some time to get the project underway. Talk with them to see how long they bid the job for and make sure they understand that openings will need to be temporarily sealed at night (again, a great place for duct tape).

If bats are present, talk with the roofers and let them know you can do a simple bat exclusion first to protect the crew. If they say no, you don't need to focus on this as you offered them a solution and they didn't take it. Should they accept the offer, netting shines as the preferred product for these types of applications (long runs of openings) as it is quick to install with velcro and highly effective. Compared to paying for sealants and the time it takes to install them netting is very cheap. You can buy it from WCS at a reasonable price and remember it is reusable so use some care taking it down and folding it up (netting doesn't like to be wadded as it does have a memory and won't lay as flat the next time).

Can you explain how your using Velcro to fasten the netting ? I have used tons of netting but never heard of using Velcro as a way to anchor it .

????????........

Lol! Nice pile Vinke! I agree with Eric, that net loves to make you spend time stretching it out if you wad it into a ball and stuff it.

1st, will let Eric address your question on the velcro, learned from him myself and like it as well.

Justin

Vinke,

I think we're referring to different types of netting based on your picture. I am referring to the 1/2 or 1/6 inch plastic netting you can get from Wildlife Control Technologies, Inc. (in CA) or from WCS (in CT). That materials is very stiff and comes rolled or folded unlike a bird style netting (aside from Nixalite) that comes waded up and needs streched before installation.

Adam,

First, make sure you have the proper netting. Velcro will not easily support a woven net due to its weight. Next, look at what material you will be adhering to. If it doesn't have a smooth surface or there is material that will not allow adheasion (grit, sand, pesticide application, etc.) don't expect it to work. For cases like this, especially with stone or brick I use hercules putty instead.

I like to use industrial strength velcro (which can be purchased about anywhere) which I then cut into 1 - 2 inch strips. I adhere the felt side to the structure first then hold the netting in place while pushing the hook piece into the felt to secure it. Based on the building materials you may have to put a piece every couple of inches. You can see netting installed with velco here WCT Group. You can just make out the velco on the sides and top holding it against the building.

Stuff I use is very expensive uv rated,,,,,(sold by the pound)... primary use is in the commercial fishing industry

aprx 20 feet wide and up to 750 ft long

Looks like we are going to use the "sudden and violent" approach. Yours truly is the designated bat beagle. Then I will go back and check their seal-up job and proceed from there. When and if they are all out then I get to do the clean-out.

Looking at the video above was very interesting. They behave alot like ants. I wonder how much they use scent to find openings. Has anyone tried using the bat lure they sell at WCS make a trail out of an exclusion device? I guess there is a fine line between a trail out and a trail in.

I will say a prayer for your customers. At least the bats will be fine.

andyva,

I personally don't believe that insectivorous bats specifically use scent to mark openings or travel pathways and I've yet to find any research work proving that they do. That's not to say that I could be wrong, just that in my observations and such that I don't feel scent is that greatly developed in them especially when compared to other animals. Nature has a reason to either develop or not develop an attribute for survival. With insectivorous bats, the primary hunting sense that has been developed is echolocation but they also have good auditory senses as well as decent to excellent eye sight.

What the video is showing is the very end of 40 minutes of bats leaving the opening and reacting to the netting. Some of them fell straight down and went right out while others "paniced" and began looking for an escape. While most exited at the bottom, several exited out the sides. One of the last bats to leave the netting was actually the second or third bat to exit the opening that night. It would crawl around for about 30 - 45 seconds coming close to the edge but would then back away and rest a bit before moving again. What was really interesting was the number of bats that actually went up instead of down or sideways looking for an opening.

What has been scientifically proven with bats is that they have great memories (can't think of the scientific term used to describe this in them right now) and are able to return to favorable areas after being briefly introduced to them.

I'm sure that Justin will chime in here if he knows of some research that I'm not aware of.

I concur with you Eric, many folks for example with bat boxes think that spreading guano on them would be enticing. This has been proven to
be ineffective in this regard and again goes to what Eric eluded to about primary hunting mode and traveling mode. While there are a heap of unknowns what is known is that they have amazing homing abilities, these are published and well documented.

How bats find a new roost after being excluded probably is a mix of visually seeing a structure that looks similar, whether for tree bats using exfoliating bark, or cave bats looking for a new entrance, or house dwelling that see a similar dormer, soffit, chimney, etc....

Again much of this is "habitat selection" too. Like a raccoon giving birth to a litter in a chimney as a good den site, and then her offspring doing the same as they recognize that structure as "den" versus chimney.

All critters right down to the petri dish, select where they live based on a variety of factors that suit them, with bats it is thought to revolve around thermal dynamics or suitability, predator avoidance, social structure and others.....

Ok, I threw salt over my shoulder....and sent prayers.

Well Justin, I guess you probably could conquer with Eric too but I think the word you're looking for is concur. ( I just love doing this to all you college grads. I have three of them and I get some kind of perverse pleasure out of correcting them. I'm sure a Shrink would call it jealousy )

Dang it!

Good thing my grammatically correct wife didn't see that! Ha!

Good catch Paul!

They have been warned of what to expect if things go bad. And they realize that the roofers may not make it batproof. They also have been advised that no cleanup should be done until we are positive that the structure is batproof. From what I have seen, I think that the roof damage might have made it too drafty for bats to winter there.

Don't worry Paul, sometimes you don't need papers to prove that you are a mental giant. Unless you're not!