Interested in learning which caliber (centerfire or rim) you think is most effectively suppressed and why...(as it pertains to a Nuisance Wildlife application.)

Feel free to PM me if not comfortable in open forum.
I might not be able to get back to you as I don't check that often.

Thanks,
HJ

HJ, the only people that I've heard of to legally use noise suppression in our area are the deer shooters. I would really like to meet one of these guys because I've heard that their equipment is superb and they shoot right in the middle of subdivisions so it would have to be. Our shooters come from Chicago so you might want to Google companies that shoot deer in that area.

Not going in depth but here are the facts

.22 rimfire with silencerco sparrow ss is very very quiet.
300blk for big game with a quaility suppressor take your pick from top companies. .

Oh and I will add...there is not a company on earth that makes a suppessor that is movie quiet, its a thing of myth.

One thing you need to account for is the crack made on super-sonic ammunition when it breaks the sound barrier. For instance, the 5.56mm or .223 breaks the sound barrier after 32ft.

So we're talking about a much longer silencer in that case?

HJ, Have worked with a variety from .17 and .22 for things you'd imagine, to .223 and others for feral hog etc....

I agree wholeheartedly with Dale, if the movie version is what is in anyones mind, go ahead and pass this by!

Ultimately you likely have an idea in mind for what type of wildlife damage situations you'd like to use this for. If it
is small furbearer species you'd be in one bracket (check out the amphibian from AWC in AZ), I can say that having
been around that one in many settings it is the closest to the "movie" effect. You will hear the action of the pistol and
that is about till impact.

On the rifle end if you are looking at big game (deer, hogs), ultimately the advantage of the suppressed isn't so much
in being "silent" but rather related to the effect of where the sound goes. The AWC products are mostly what I've seen
and used as they had pretty much a sole source deal with my old agency for quite some time. The "thundertrap" was the
model on most large caliber.

If you are looking to do small game and want silence at a bargain, using .22 shorts is good way to go for many up close
situations without being too specific.

Spending the dollars for the tool always has to pay off or at least should if making a business decision. Though I'd love
a suppressed .22 pistol and a light rifle like a .223, I don't have any contracts that require this type of tool and therefore
I haven't purchased any of them.

I would call one of the manufacturers and speak with them about your specific needs in detail and they can help guide you
based on the thousands of these they sell.

(disclaimer - naturally we all know that our state and federal laws pertain to any purchase or use of these tools for our industry)



Justin

Having the barrel of the firearm about a foot inside your car or house window really does a great job of silencing the noise outside.

I have just walked off 32 feet in case I get a .223. ( I would have to seated at the kitchen table to quietly shoot out of the patio door )

As noted, the SUB-SONIC loads will give you a big head start on quiet. I have some WW22lv's (no longer made wouldn't you know) that ARE as quiet as a movie gun when shot out of a long barrell rifle, and will kill small game reliably to 100 ft or better. (I'm Bogarting them as best I can). If you need a center fire rifle to shoot quietly, try handloading to low Velocity's.
Speed of sound is roughly 1100 FPS depending on air temp, humidity etc.

I have been able to shoot a couple of suppressed 22 rifles that were very quiet, much less noise then any pellet gun, also a 44 mag rifle that was fairly quiet. The key is to shoot subsonic ammunition. Some guys just "load down" a gun to keep it subsonic and that will work also. A good suppressed high power rifle will be reduced enough that a shooter doesn't need ear protection.

I disagree my friend.

It is all in the load, so if you are a hand loader you have an advantage

For factory ammo,,,,cb 22 quiets are 60db at the shooters ear without a can with a 40 gr bullet

For wildlife work I would recommend a 22 cal can
Threading runs 35-60 dollars here depending on who I take it to.

Make sure you purchase a thread protection cap, it will save you some trouble in the long run

For the money I believe the 22lr is probably the best buy of suppressed rifles. I use an AWC integrally suppressed 22lr for Urban work on Beavers, Coyotes and Hogs. This has been a great piece of equipment. I have also had favorable experiences with a 17hmr suppressed. But the 22lr finds its way in my bag more and more these days.

Has anyone compared noise and ballistic differences between a PCP .22 and .25 to a .22 with suppressor? This is a great thread for those with experience to write an article for WCT.

I think that the .25 caliber Benjamin air rifle should also be put into the mix. It sounds like a fun experiment. With my keen sense of hearing I would be the perfect guy. No ear protection necessary and if I can hear it all, it's too loud!

I think a quality crossbow should be put in the mix. This tool can get you around firearm laws in some cities

Throw this one in too! Lots of utility and versatility have used these for bird and rat project in dairy barns, very very quiet.

http://www.airforceairguns.com/TalonSS-s/38.htm

HDW: Those Talons look interesting. The link you gave says nothing about price, and what kind of ammo do they shoot, Regular pellets? And do you know what kind of operating preasure is required?

Terminal ballistics need to be in the discussion as well. For instance while many of the air rifles are already legally suppressed and require no paperwork the smaller weight of an airgun pellet versus the same caliber but heavier subsonic long rifle round have different impacts on target.
Prime example is the 300BLK cartridge. This round was designed from the get for suppressed work on larger targets, man sized and similar. The standard suppressed loading uses the heavy 200+ grain projectiles to retain enough mass at low velocity for penetration.
A similar loading is the Aguila 60 gr Sniper Subsonic 22lr load. This one though runs into stabilization issues needing a tighter rate of twist than is common in standard 22lr barrels.

Hey BigBob,

If I remember right the outfit with an extra air tank (so you can head afield with two charged tanks at the ready) ran somewhere under $700.00.

Not necessarily cheap, but an excellent tool. They shoot pellets, we used the "crow magnum" if I remember right, though any pellet does work in them. They have a couple of choices in caliber.

Operating pressure I am not aware of, when I worked with these the technician on the project kept an air tank with him that he had refilled at a local shop. I think in the manual they list what the pressure of the can is and how its filled, there is a little kit for filling them. I was going to buy one when we launched our shop for bird work needs but ended up saving my dimes for other tools as I do mostly exclusion with very little outright removal.

The dairy projects were related to starling and norway rats and I can't tell you the last time being covered in cow manure and being up 18+ hours straight finishing with performing necropsy on over 100 of each species for disease samples was so enjoyable.

With the scope they sell (or you own add on) you can get amazing results from the accuracy. The air is adjustable on the rifle as well, so you can modify the pressure based on the limited area you are working in, for example if you would prefer not to blow a tiny hole in a tin roof, you can dial down but still remove pigeons, starlings, rats, etc...

Was one time I can say that work shouldn't be that much fun, plus the tech who was a good friend of mine till his passing was about the best guy you could spend time with in the field, just loved what he did and the people he did it for.

Justin

If anyone has actual field experience please weigh in. My knowledge is purely theoretical of the armchair type. I have read as much as I can find on the Web on the subject but for some reason some aspects of suppressor work isn't openly discussed.

Thanks, am gonna look into it more.

Field Experience: The Crosman .177 caliber American Classic air pistol. I was feeding the turkey and had 10 pumps in my trusty air pistol when I pulled it out and shot the turkey in the head at about 6 inches away. The result was not what I expected. The turkey ran and then flew away and I think it flipped me the bird as it was leaving. I might just as well have used a rubber band and a paper clip. I am not making this up.

this guy's you tube page is good info for high end air rifles

http://www.youtube.com/user/EdgunUSA

Field Experience: Gamo CFX .22 caliber air rifle. Same turkey, one shot to the head at 25 yards and we're eating turkey sammiches.

P.S. I watched a couple of the YouTube clips that Vinke recommended and they were really good. Which means that now I'll probably have to get myself a Benjamin Marauder.

Just a friendly reminder....cans (suppressors) are a NFA regulated item, my last Nfa Item took around 8 months to process on a personal living trust.

So you have the cost of a can...399.00 to 1500.00
Nfa will be 200.00 for the tax stamp.
A NFA gun Trust if legal in your state can be made by a lawyer that is familiar with nfa weapons laws for around 500.00.


So be prepared to wait a long time and spend money..

Thanks, Dale. I knew all that but you are right to bring it up. The legal issues can be a royal pia. I hear of guys running afoul of the chief law enforcement officer approval in areas where cans are otherwise legal but the cleo is an anti or otherwise opposed.
I also think folks need to know how the stamp works far as safekeeping and traveling with the can.
Please fill us in.

You got screwed dale,,,,,,89 buck and we can add as many as we want to the trust..........

I actually use an AirForce Talon made by Airforce Airguns out of Fort Worth, Texas. I had been using Benjamin pump-up for years for pigeons because I could control the velosity so as to kill the bird but not punch a hole in the roof/ceiling of the building I was working in. Due to a shoulder surgery I wasn't able to pump the gun so thats when I bought the Talon. It has an adjustment wheel that you turn with your thumb to change the velocity from around 4oo f.p.s.to 1100 f.p.s. I set the velosity of the Talon with that of the Benjamin by using a chronograph and it is a great tool. I paid close to a thousand bucks for the gun and scope and wish I had bought it sooner. Oh, that also includes two barrels, .22 & .177 cal.

Nope mine was free...


Other things you should also note.

Travel with a NFA item inside your state may or may not be regulated, BUT transport over state lines has to be approved by the Batfe. You must submitt a letter stating your intentions/plans well in advance of your trip, anytime you deal with Batfe be prepared to wait a while.

Possession of a Nfa item is only permitted to those on your trust or auctual owners of the item.

Ownership of nfa item is a open invite for the batfe to visit you and inspect how your items are stored. They strongly prefer to see them locked up in a safe with limited access.

Paul your comments and post are one of my favorite things to read on the ADC forum hahaha

Don't ask me how I know but firing a few times from inside a truck and you will have no need for a silencer for your own sake.

You bet! Lol!

So have you ever heard the rugger 10-22 that comes with suppressor barrel ? All you hear is the action when it cycles.
and whatever the bullet hits. I don't own one yet but have shot a couple that belong to friends.
Awesome gun

My experience is with suppressors from LaneLLC in South Dakota. Like has been said, keep your ammo sub sonic and all you will hear on a bolt action is the sound of the firing pin and the impact of the bullet. With standard velocity if your running it through a pistol with a barrel shorter than 5.5 inches, most will be subsonic. It's really weird/cool how you can hear the action on an AR when your shooting and hear the impact a spilt second later.Right now, at least here, Dealers are filing E-file and its taking about 90 days. They also are setting you up with a free Trust with purchase of any can. I forgot to mention, on bigger calibers, a Suppressor really reduces the recoil on your hard recoiling guns. I know a few guys that put them on for that reason alone to get their wives/kids into bigger rifles.

That wouldn't help me on a job but thanks for the info.

The 44mag is on my list as I can handload down for further effectiveness.

Good feedback guys.
It seems I may not have given the new breed of airguns a fair shake. However if the cost was the same of getting the paperwork through on a can for one of my existing rifles I think I may go forward with it. Mostly Small Game applications but up to and including close range head shot whitetail.

I recently shot a De Lisle Carbine silenced in 45 ACP. Bout the coolest thing Ive shot in awhile. Beats my 10/22 all to . It should too for how much my friend paid $1600.

Just watching some of the vid reviews on UTube of the high end air rifles and they look like they would fill a lot of niche in urban pest control situations.