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Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5041221
05/08/15 08:22 PM
05/08/15 08:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline
trapper
warrior  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
From a literal reading of our regs there is no choice in the matter if a coon or other RVS ends up in my trap it must be euthanized.


[Linked Image]
Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5041323
05/08/15 09:24 PM
05/08/15 09:24 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
mequon, wisconsin
P
Paul Winkelmann Offline
trapper
Paul Winkelmann  Offline
trapper
P

Joined: Jul 2008
mequon, wisconsin
I wish some of your state DNR agencies could explain how killing everything does anything other than keeping some softies from

becoming your customers. Does anyone really believe that killing several hundred raccoons is going to effect the overall population

one iota? I've listened to all the right slanted views by the "kill everything extremists" and left slanted views by the "don't kill

anything" extremists. One is just as ridiculous as the other. I am really glad that we can decide what to do with nearly all the

target animals and birds that we catch. We probably release more birds and animals than the majority of you, and I'm not ashamed to

say that. Of course, we also probably euthanize more birds and animals than most of you and that doesn't bother me either. If you're

licensed to do ADC work you should be intelligent enough to not have your DNR tell you what you HAVE to do with your catch.

Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: warrior] #5041472
05/08/15 10:41 PM
05/08/15 10:41 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Dudley NC
M
Muddawg Offline
trapper
Muddawg  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jun 2012
Dudley NC
Originally Posted By: warrior
From a literal reading of our regs there is no choice in the matter if a coon or other RVS ends up in my trap it must be euthanized.


That's us. Anything in the order carnivora must be euthanized.

Just as well. The animals I go after are already a problem or I wouldn't be after them. I don't think anyone is served by simply relocating a problem.

With that said, there are still many critters I catch and release. All the non venomous snakes I catch and possums come back to my house and are set free. Turtles and flying squirrels take a long ride and are turned loose where someone else wants them. If I catch domestics with no collar, they wind up at the animal shelter.

Anything edible, such as beaver, nutria, gray squirrel, muskrat, and such as that, I'll not lie to you, it goes in my freezer eventually winding up on my supper table.

Gray squirrel, coyote, coons and such, we have an abundance of them. What I take out will never be missed.


Muddawg
Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5041561
05/09/15 12:48 AM
05/09/15 12:48 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline
trapper
warrior  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
Even though I grew up on squirrel and dearly love squirrel dumplings I haven't eaten tree rat in years. They go in attics and I know what people put in attics.


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Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Paul Winkelmann] #5041804
05/09/15 10:55 AM
05/09/15 10:55 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
St. Louis Co, Mo
B
BigBob Offline
trapper
BigBob  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
St. Louis Co, Mo
Originally Posted By: Paul Winkelmann
I wish some of your state DNR agencies could explain how killing everything does anything other than keeping some softies from
becoming your customers.


FWIW, As explained to me:

Missouri doesn't forbid translocating, but it's "Highly discouraged" because,

A. It's screws up biodiversity by unnaturally mixing DNA around.
B. Can introduce a disease into populations with no immunity.
C. Can spread Rabies etc, for which there's no immunity.
D. Removing a problem animal from one area to dump it in another so it becomes a problem for someone else.
E. Could just come back, educated.


Every kid needs a Dog and a Curmudgeon.

Remember Bowe Bergdahl, the traitor.

Beware! Jill Pudlewski, Ron Oates and Keven Begesse are liars and thiefs!
Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5041826
05/09/15 11:17 AM
05/09/15 11:17 AM
Joined: Jun 2013
Florida
B
bjansma Offline
trapper
bjansma  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Jun 2013
Florida
I euthanize 99% of what hits my truck for those reasons. Another good reason: the survivor rates of relocated animals, especially in winter.Studies vary but none of them are great.


Bob Jansma
Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5041857
05/09/15 11:41 AM
05/09/15 11:41 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
mequon, wisconsin
P
Paul Winkelmann Offline
trapper
Paul Winkelmann  Offline
trapper
P

Joined: Jul 2008
mequon, wisconsin
Let's just take a single species, the red fox. Life became a lot harder when the coyote moved in. I've caught a bunch in raccoon

traps. Most people love foxes in their area, because they do for free what I charge for. Now I can legally release him or if infested

with mange or obviously sick, I can euthanize him. I can also take it to a rehabber; the chioce is mine. Relocating adult foxes is

not a great idea normally, but again, the choice is mine. This is just one example of an animal that I am glad I can release. Killing

a healthy red fox because you caught him by accident is just plain ignorant. And if I read some of these posts correctly, that is

exactly what some of you must legally do.

Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5041894
05/09/15 12:06 PM
05/09/15 12:06 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Dudley NC
M
Muddawg Offline
trapper
Muddawg  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jun 2012
Dudley NC
I should clarify my statements just a bit.

Non target animals are released on the property. It's the "Problem" animals that I'm called to remove that get euthanized. Even if I were to take an animal from inside the dwelling, I do have the choice of releasing it on the property so long as the property owner agrees. I usually try to discourage this by informing the client that there are no guarantees that it won't find another way in.

Say, I catch a coon in the attic. If the property owner doesn't want it euthanized then I can release it out in the yard. Which is cool, cause they'll call me back to come get him out of the attic again next week. But, let's say I'm trapping for a coyote that's eating baby goats. If I find a fox in one of my traps, I release it unharmed.

Generally speaking, they want the problem animal gone. Then is when my guarantee comes into play. The only guarantee I try to make is, if I haul the critter off, it will not be back.


Muddawg
Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5042233
05/09/15 07:52 PM
05/09/15 07:52 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
mequon, wisconsin
P
Paul Winkelmann Offline
trapper
Paul Winkelmann  Offline
trapper
P

Joined: Jul 2008
mequon, wisconsin
Speaking of relocation, are any of you following the "Ed Crankshaft / Black Squirrel" episodes in the comics. I would swear that one

of you is writing that scenario. In today's episode Ed relocated the squirrel but it beat him home. Sound familiar?

Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5042460
05/09/15 10:41 PM
05/09/15 10:41 PM
Joined: May 2014
Southwest Michigan
M
Michigan Trappin Offline OP
trapper
Michigan Trappin  Offline OP
trapper
M

Joined: May 2014
Southwest Michigan
I'm amazed by what seems to be the "law" in each state, what the heck are animals different in each state, biologist different.

Here's what michigan law says about wildlife captured as nuisance animals. In a nut shell:

Beavers ca not be relocated unless by special permit/permission by state

Raccoons can only be relocated in county they are captured in

Released animals must be released at least 10 miles from capture site

The property owner and the agent capturing animal should agree upon the fate of the animal

Contracts/agreements of wildlife removal do not have to be in writing

Wildlife must be released or euthanized within 24 hours

There is also a list of which animals the agent can capture and remove based on their judgement of situation

Other animals you need a biologist to issue a permit for

If trapping is allowed during fur season on property (out in the country) you can only trap animals that are in the curtilage (house, yard and out buildings)

Beaver are excluded in above rule in the southern half of the lower peninsula

Coyotes are to if the are doing or are about to do damage (this is anytime a coyote is breathing)

This is a short version of the latest regulations per the paperwork I have

But I have talked to several guys in michigan that treat some of the suggestions as law, not that they are breaking law they just choose for instance that ALL trapped animals must be destroyed. This is what some tell customers is law but it isn't.

There is also on one companies web site a statement that the LIVE TRAP BEAVER AND MUSKRAT UNDER WATER and relocate. That's a crock

Anyway that's what I know of regulations as of 3 months ago


Every day is a gift from GOD, don't waste it!!

If they have plenty of food, give them something interesting to smell
Re: Neighbors conflict [Re: Michigan Trappin] #5042768
05/10/15 09:22 AM
05/10/15 09:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2013
OH
Eric Arnold Offline
trapper
Eric Arnold  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2013
OH
Paul,

You need to stop giving away upcoming articles, lol.

When dealing with this issue remember that it is about managing a population in a state, it is not about managing the population in a single county/neighborhood nor is it about managing a single animal.

For management purposes, you need to look at multiple factors such as disease risk to like species, other species, pets, & humans. You also need to look at both biological and sociological carrying capacities, habitat requirements and availability, food sources, species behavior, cost and other factors.

Imagine that you have been hired to be the wildlife manager for a 10,000 acre property. Ask yourself how you would ensure that the clients goals are met. Now expand that situation into a 65,500 sq mile area (basically the size of Wisconsin). How would you approach a disease outbreak to control it? Would you make a general policy dictating that those vector species be euthanized, would you still allow relocation and the potential spread of the disease, would you instigate a preventative program, or would you do all of this as well as other things? Now ask how you will maintain biodiversity on this property. How will you control over population of certain species that are forcing others out, creating disease/human issue risks, or are creating economic/environmental issues.(Look at the problems Snow Geese have created for themselves).

Each property will have it's own unique goals and will then need to be managed independently of other properties. I'm not saying that everyone's got this right or wrong, just that you need to look at the big picture and not just a corner of the image.


Eric Arnold
Publishing Editor W.C.T. Magazine
Editor The Fur Taker Magazine
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