The best way to deal with the mentally ill with gun rights is make sure you can get to yours first. lol

Truth Hobbie.

Chris Kyle messaged the shooting range that he was bringing someone who was "straight up crazy" to do some shooting. He should've read his own words before handing the guy a gun.

Regarding the Chris Kyle thing, he probably should have exercised a little more discretion, but I wont judge a dead guy too harshly, I don't know enough about the situation. but nobody, regardless of their level of training, is guaranteed to win a gunfight. The only guaranteed way to win a gunfight is to not get in a gunfight. I know I would never hand my own gun to someone I wouldn't trust, but I also wouldn't want the government to restrict any of my rights because I *might* misuse said right.

No I don’t think so, not everyone that’s depressed are going to kill them selfs either. I am a vet and served 3 year’s in total overseas during my 6 years stint, I do not feel that I have PTSD but I have seen dramatic things that change a person. I am also a police officer and I work with a guy that is also a vet and he has been diagnosed with PTSD. We have been to some pretty serious calls together were there was a real possibility we could have used our weapons and he was not effected by his PTSD. On the other hand there are people who could not, so I think it’s more of a case by case deal.

I also think people throw around the term PTSD like it’s a fix all for weak people who can’t handle life. I know it’s real but don’t think most people with it really have it.

I agree completely !!

Me too!

A WW2 vet who hunted out of our camp would jump outta bed at least once during the week from a dream he would have. Once he was awake, he was ok and I never thought twice about him having a gun. Today, they would say he has PTSD.

Would you sell him one?

I agree also , the sad part being that ones who use it as an excuse dilute the seriousness of others that do deal with variations of PTSD.

Not all PTSD is military connected.

My son "fathers" two boys whose biological father is little more than a no-good junkie. He supposedly suffers from PTSD, and has figured out a way for the government to give him money, little or none of it goes to support his children. Like Sharon said, this dilutes the seriousness of those who truly suffer. The only bright spot in my son's situation is that they put the s** of a b*** back in jail a few month ago.

No, hippie, if I thought someone was "crazy" I wouldn't sell them a gun. I would hope that any dealer with a brain wouldn't either, though I know there are plenty that would sell to anyone as long as the check clears. But I still wouldn't support a law preventing them from doing so, because like I stated before, you're taking rights away because of what someone might do, not what they did do. Also, if someone is too dangerous to be trusted with deadly dangerous tools, they shouldn't be walking the streets.

Your last response is interesting considering you also wrote this.

Kudos to your son ! Tough job

I understand that, hippie, I said mentally ill have a need to protect themselves, and then said I wouldn't sell them a gun. I'll clarify. Mentally ill encompasses a lot of things that leftists would say should exclude someone from owning a gun, but I (we?) wouldn't. PTSD, bipolar, depression, anxiety, etc. By "crazy" (I purposely put it in quotations because crazy isn't a diagnosis), I mean someone who might obviously pose a risk to themselves and other people, with or without a diagnosis. Example-Someone who suffers from true PTSD and has occasional anxiety attacks comes in to my imaginary gun store in a land with true gun freedom and wants to buy a pistol because they find it relaxing to punch holes in paper, sure, I'd sell. Someone comes in and says hey man, I need a shotgun to take care of the blue squirrels that crawl on my ceiling at night, they don't get a gun:) Does that seem clearer?
In real life, I don't loan or sell guns to anyone I don't personally know and trust, but I don't want the government to decide who is and isn't mentally ill enough to practice any right.

changing the question a little bit.

I had a training I attended last month active shooter event training , it was interesting.

the very first thing they covered is there is NO BLUEPRINT for who becomes an active killer. they share only 3 things a deep sense of entitlement and a strong belief that hurting others is justified and will bring them the revenge or retribution or justice they seek and a plan the plan may take hours , days, months or years to plan and set in place. it may be simple gather supplies locate a target and act or it may be 2 years of slowly plotting researching and gathering supplies.

that said you could identify 50K people who fit profiles of previous mass shooters and less than 1 in 50K will be one , there is just no list , no profile , not litmus test for who will and who won't pull the trigger one day.

we now have to include government workers , federals security officers , police , sheriffs deputies , students , school board members , politicians , foreign nationals , US citizens , Veterans , students , white , black , Asian , Native american , liberals , kids , seniors , women, there is just now way of knowing.

one person may have a multi page list of risk factors and never act out in anger violently in their whole life and the next shows hardly a sign and kills many people.


anyone who thinks the can identify who pulls the trigger next , before the person has a plan in place to act is just lying to you and lying to themselves research just keeps proving it can't be determined till the plan is in motion even at that point you have them on some crimes likely but until the trigger is pulled still know way to know if they will.

being that this is a reactionary game , it only makes sense that the only answer is quick re-action.
stopping the threat quickly.
slowing down the shooter.
reducing the body count.
denying access to victims.
quick educated medical care.

the people who want to decide who is and isn't with a list they have other intentions.
they want to convince the public they are safe because some list exists. they spend millions of dollars a year on lists that do no good because they in their complacency don't even keep them updated none of it is going to keep you safe it just helps build a level of perceived safety while programming control into minds.

a persons right to own a firearm is different than my choice to sell them one , I can choose to not sell to any one for any reason.

Greencountypete your last sentence is exactly the point I was trying to make, you put it a lot clearer than me though. Also, interesting info. I was under the impression that there was a definite profile (white man/kid with little to no criminal background, previous mental issues that either "fell through the cracks" are went undiagnosed, etc). Would it be fair to say that the profile points I listed are most common, or is that not even the case? I know it's true for the highest profile mass shootings, but mass shootings by definition are 4 or more victims, and there are plenty that get no coverage at all in the national news.

2 or more makes mass in some peoples/agency/organizations definition , they also now call them active killer because they are recognizing the weapon does not need to be a firearm to be very effective like the media would have you believe.

an active shooter/killer is a person who is in the act of or actively attempting to kill/shoot. one of the ones you never heard about was because it had no deaths , school shooting stopped by the female PE teacher in seconds or less. if the safety plan worked or the good people succeeded in stopping it with out loss of life you never heard about it on the news.
if it was stopped very quickly by a school cop or something similar it maybe made 1 24 hour news cycle.

these people are selling fear and selling all gun owners as the ones to fear , there are more guns than people in this country , it just simply isn't a gun problem.

Loudspeaker in the NRA bus: "PTSD'rs, stand up and shuffle to the door, you're the next class we're throwing under "

"Fatbodies, you're next. The political winds have shifted after Clem's pistol fell out of his sweatpants at Walmart and shot someone's support puppy."