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Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6363758
11/02/18 11:06 PM
11/02/18 11:06 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,793
OK
Aaron Proffitt Offline
trapper
Aaron Proffitt  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,793
OK
“Mental illness” is way too vague . Sought help to quit smoking from a health professional? You’ve been treated for a mental health issue ex. anxiety. Sleep meds ? There’s another .

Something to keep in mind when a shooter is dubbed by the media as having been ,”treated for a mental condition.”

As far as PTSD as a stand-alone diagnosis, again, it’s way too subjective. What triggers one person ( and their reaction to it ) may be completely different for someone else .

Lastly, I generally call bs on the stories of war veterans who hit the ground at the mere sound of gun fire WHILE HUNTING. Story gets thrown around so much you’d think it was a mass stroke event. But introduce something subtle like an odor, you might see some very uncomfortable folks .


Honor a Soldier. Be the kind of American worth fighting for.
Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6363795
11/03/18 04:44 AM
11/03/18 04:44 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 30,995
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
danny clifton  Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
D

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 30,995
williamsburg ks
nightmares and/or anxiety because of a smell or sound are not reasons to take someone's self defense rights.

I said before and still say, people who can not be trusted to be armed should be in prison or a mental hospital. dangerous felons or mental patients need caged


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6363815
11/03/18 05:51 AM
11/03/18 05:51 AM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 5,114
Beatrice, NE
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loosegoose Offline
trapper
loosegoose  Offline
trapper
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 5,114
Beatrice, NE
Danny I agree. Once someone has served their sentence (prison time, parole, restitution if required) for any crime, all rights should be restored. If we can't trust a former felon to walk around our kids with a gun, why would we trust them to walk around society at all?

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6363876
11/03/18 07:18 AM
11/03/18 07:18 AM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 225
PA
Charles2 Offline
trapper
Charles2  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 225
PA
Mental Health issues vary by those that have them. Some are labeled an emotional disorder. PTSD as stated already varies greatly by day, response and trigger for those that have it. PTSD is about what happened to a person.......not what is mentally or emotionally "wrong" with them. The symptoms ebb and flow everyday. Sudden noises or movements can startle anyone.........but anything that reminds a person of an event can evoke a variety of physical and emotional responses as well as recurring dreams. Understanding and support go a long way.


Charles2Trap
Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6363878
11/03/18 07:21 AM
11/03/18 07:21 AM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 11,522
Iowa
T
trapdog1 Offline
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trapdog1  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 11,522
Iowa
Originally Posted By: adam m
What I find interesting is everytime there's a mass shooting people on here say that people with mental illness shouldn't have guns. But this thread has a majority in favor of someone with ptsd too keep their guns.

With that said, for those in favor, what mental illness(es) qualify someone to lose their right? Would you want your health info out for anyone to look at too?
Could you imagine the delay if the government has to go through everyone's health record to see if they are barred from buying a gun? The current background system is flawed it would only get worse if they had to go through medical records.

If mental health is qualifier to buy a gun the government can start discriminating for other health reasons. Let's say those with arthritis or diabetes lose their 2nd where does it stop?


It won't stop until everyone is disarmed.

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6363895
11/03/18 07:47 AM
11/03/18 07:47 AM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 225
PA
Charles2 Offline
trapper
Charles2  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 225
PA
I agree with Trapdog. Once it starts, then it will be a runaway train.


Charles2Trap
Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6363978
11/03/18 10:37 AM
11/03/18 10:37 AM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,697
nm
A
adam m Offline OP
trapper
adam m  Offline OP
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,697
nm
Exactly. The train won't stop.

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6364027
11/03/18 12:13 PM
11/03/18 12:13 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 20,123
pa
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hippie Offline
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hippie  Offline
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You guys do realize there have been laws on the books for years against someone considered mentally ill from having a gun don't ya?

Federal and state laws?

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: hippie] #6364033
11/03/18 12:34 PM
11/03/18 12:34 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 9,132
SWMo.
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tjm Offline
trapper
tjm  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 9,132
SWMo.
Originally Posted By: hippie
You guys do realize there have been laws on the books for years against someone considered mentally ill from having a gun don't ya?

Federal and state laws?
There shouldn't be. Mental illness is too easily diagnosed and too hard to prove you aren't- something about proving negatives.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and so is "crazy"

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6364039
11/03/18 12:48 PM
11/03/18 12:48 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,758
kansas
H
Hal Aggers Offline
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Hal Aggers  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,758
kansas

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6364040
11/03/18 12:49 PM
11/03/18 12:49 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 20,123
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hippie Offline
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hippie  Offline
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Here's the best link i could find that has both federal and state laws on it. It will be a long row to hoe to get all these laws reversed. That said, i don't know how PTSD is considered into this? I'm of the belief that PTSD is different than bat-crap crazy like the guy who killed Chris Kyle.

http://www.ncsl.org/research/civil-and-c...ntally-ill.aspx

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: Hal Aggers] #6364043
11/03/18 12:52 PM
11/03/18 12:52 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 20,123
pa
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hippie Offline
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hippie  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2010
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Originally Posted By: Hal Aggers


I'm suprised that link didn't bash Trump for reversing Obama's policy for the SS office to report who can't handle their own finances.

Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: hippie] #6364142
11/03/18 03:56 PM
11/03/18 03:56 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,500
Kenai AK
K
KenaiKid Offline
trapper
KenaiKid  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,500
Kenai AK
Originally Posted By: hippie
Here's the best link i could find that has both federal and state laws on it. It will be a long row to hoe to get all these laws reversed. That said, i don't know how PTSD is considered into this? I'm of the belief that PTSD is different than bat-crap crazy like the guy who killed Chris Kyle.

http://www.ncsl.org/research/civil-and-c...ntally-ill.aspx


Thanks for posting that. You’re right, there are already plenty of laws prohibiting people who have been diagnosed with mental illness from owning firearms. As you’ll notice, most of these laws are very vague and undefined regarding what constitutes “mental illness”, meaning that a liberal prosecutor/investigator/judge could and would push to charge ANYONE who has been diagnosed or treated for any mental condition whatsoever, including stress and anxiety.

All of these laws were, of course, billed as “common sense gun control”, the left’s favorite term for it. And most likely a lot of moderates and even conservatives voted for them, because alone it doesn’t seem like a bad idea. But you have to look at the big picture. We have to remember that every small “common sense” gun measure is only a small piece of a puzzle, and those pieces build up quickly. We’re watching it right now.

Now that the above laws are on the books, what’s the leftists’ next “common sense” measure? Universal background checks of course. And since mental health is now a criteria for gun ownership, the background check system will inevitably have to be linked to universal medical records. Goodbye HIPAA privacy.

Of course, we know what the inevitable next step would be: encourage the health community to expand mental health diagnoses whenever possible. It’s already common practice (and legal) for doctors to ask you and your children if you own firearms, because the CDC decided that a doctor is responsible for both health AND SAFETY; and of course leftists believe guns are unsafe. Doctors are also allowed to make diagnoses based on their feeling or inclination in many cases, and to make diagnosis based not just on your health but also for your safety. And remember, you can very rarely sue a doctor for a false diagnosis, especially if the doctor believed it in good faith.

Do you see where this is going? With mental health/gun laws already on the books, and universal background check systems gaining steam, and doctors able to ask you or your kids about guns, and then make a diagnosis based on their feelings for your safety, we could very easily see the medical establishment become a pivotal vehicle in disarmament. If the system gets put in place, don’t be surprised if liberal doctors start putting a “mental illness” diagnosis on the record of everyone who admits having a gun. They don’t even have to prescribe medication or send you to treatment, they could just put the diagnosis on your record and it would bar you from legally owning a gun in many states.

So the next time you hear someone promote a small “common sense” gun control law, remember that the pieces add up to a very ugly puzzle.


Originally Posted by Dirt
Originally Posted by Rat Masterson
Boco couldn't catch a cold.

But if he did, it would be Top Lot.
Re: Ptsd & the 2nd [Re: adam m] #6369121
11/09/18 08:32 AM
11/09/18 08:32 AM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,758
kansas
H
Hal Aggers Offline
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Hal Aggers  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,758
kansas
What is going to happen now?

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