Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: joepennanti]
#6426426
01/12/19 01:37 PM
01/12/19 01:37 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
bctomcat
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
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bctomcat: You say that Long Tail body length = 16" and that the tail is more than half the length of the combination of the head and body. So that means LT total length from tip to tip must be >24" Do you have a photo of a 24" weasel? I'd like to see it. I got 10 more days to trap weasels, if I get anything >20" it's going on the wall. No I do not have a photo of a long tail but have caught a few over the years. They are not to common in the north, but do exist in central and southern BC. For info from the experts just google "weasel indentification"
The only constant in trapping is change so keep learning.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: joepennanti]
#6426437
01/12/19 01:59 PM
01/12/19 01:59 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Montana
Taximan
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Montana
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I have enjoyed the thread as well.Lots of good information and photos.Good discussion as well. One point I forgot to bring up was on the subject of body lengths.BCtomcat posted body lengths for short tails and long tails.What you have to be aware of,is that field guides and technical literature are talking about total body,including tail but that is what they call "body length".I find that confusing as I bet others do.After that,they give the tail length so you have to subtract the tail length from the so called "body length" if you want to know how long it is,nose to base of tail. This is where The Audubon Society's field guide explains their measurement system.Other fields guides I've looked at recently,seem to be the same though measurements vary a little. ![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2019/01/full-2531-434572-trapping_2018_2019_012.jpg) So the 13" body length that most guides give as the high end for short tail weasels,is the total,overall length including the tail.That jives with my experience.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: PmbnaTrpr]
#6426442
01/12/19 02:06 PM
01/12/19 02:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Montana
Taximan
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Montana
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You mentioned that a female longtail has different preportions than a male and that could be. But here is a pic of a 24 inch longtail from tip to tip. I've never caught a female longtail that I'm aware of. ![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2019/01/full-49404-434573-_img_000000_000000.jpg) You probably know that we have been talking about real carcass measurements which don't correlate to a green skin,off the carcass.A 32" male bobcat will go 42" on the stretcher without undue pulling.That's why taxidermists go by carcass measurements whenever possible.That bobcat will not go on a 42" manikin but has to go on a 32" one.(I'm not including tail measurement here).
Last edited by Taximan; 01/12/19 02:15 PM.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: Taximan]
#6426743
01/12/19 08:42 PM
01/12/19 08:42 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
bctomcat
trapper
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Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
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Yes I get it, total length includes the tail; tip of nose to tip of tail. To eliminate the confusion the ID of species by tail size refers to the actual tail length compared to the actual body length from nose to base of the tail, ie:
Least: Smallest of the weasels, little more than mouse size. Has a very short tail (less than one quarter the combined head and body length nose to base of tail. Tail has no black tip.
Short Tail: Best identified by its black tipped tail that is less than half the combined length of the head and body length nose to base of tail.
Long Tail: The largest weasel. Tail is also black tipped, but is more than half the length of the combination of the head and body nose to base of tail.
Last edited by bctomcat; 01/12/19 08:51 PM.
The only constant in trapping is change so keep learning.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: Taximan]
#6426901
01/12/19 11:10 PM
01/12/19 11:10 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
bctomcat
trapper
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Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
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[quote=Taximan]And I get what you are saying but you must not have read my link. [quote] Yes I read your article and it quotes "Long-tailed weasels have a tail longer than half their body length with a black tip, ermine have a tail length around a third of their body length with a black tip, and least weasels have a tail length around a quarter of their body length and lack a black tip." Yes that specific female of Joe Penannty's may have a shorter tail than most but, freaks do happen in any species. In that report when they talk about specifics I take it that total length is body and tail not head and body. Thus the tail of his female weasel is just sightly short for a long tail. But, the GENERAL ID factor for determination of weasel species is length of tail compared to combined head and body length to base of tail/butt is generally correct.
The only constant in trapping is change so keep learning.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: Taximan]
#6427007
01/13/19 01:27 AM
01/13/19 01:27 AM
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Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
bctomcat
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jul 2009
100 Mile House, BC Can
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You are correct.They are talking about total length,including tail but read again,the female that measured 14",including tail,had a 4.2" tail.
14 minus 4 equals 10".The 4.2" tail is less than half the 10" head and body length (in females).This mirrors the proportions of Joe's female longtail weasel. Yes I agree and believe I stated that freaks, or pardon me , exceptions do occasionally happen! In any event the general rule applies in most every situations IMHO! The only thing that would confirm that it is a long tail, is that if it had turned totally white, head, body and tail its feet would remain brown!
Last edited by bctomcat; 01/13/19 01:39 AM.
The only constant in trapping is change so keep learning.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: bctomcat]
#6427284
01/13/19 12:32 PM
01/13/19 12:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Montana
Taximan
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Montana
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You are correct.They are talking about total length,including tail but read again,the female that measured 14",including tail,had a 4.2" tail.
14 minus 4 equals 10".The 4.2" tail is less than half the 10" head and body length (in females).This mirrors the proportions of Joe's female longtail weasel. Yes I agree and believe I stated that freaks, or pardon me , exceptions do occasionally happen! In any event the general rule applies in most every situations IMHO! The only thing that would confirm that it is a long tail, is that if it had turned totally white, head, body and tail its feet would remain brown! I'm not sure what you mean about the brown feet.Longtail,s feet turn white,just like other weasels and it happens before they are fully white.Refer back to pictures in this thread to see that.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: joepennanti]
#6428942
01/15/19 09:02 AM
01/15/19 09:02 AM
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Joined: Dec 2017
Kingston, PA
TheBig1
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2017
Kingston, PA
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Great write up Joe! I enjoyed reading it. I like your setup with the can. After reading your initial post it got me hooked on trying to trap some weasel. So I have you to thank for getting me excited to do so.
One question, what's in the can for bait? Is that a squirrel that was caught? It also looks like it could be a weasel but I don't think that you'd do that.
Joe, another quick question, what size trap is that please?
Chad
Last edited by TheBig1; 01/15/19 09:28 AM.
You can't cheat the mountain pilgrim. Mountain's got its own ways.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: joepennanti]
#6428996
01/15/19 09:59 AM
01/15/19 09:59 AM
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Joined: Oct 2012
ID
bob1454
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Joined: Oct 2012
ID
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Love the write up Joe. great pics too. Glad you are having a good session. Bob
Last edited by bob1454; 01/15/19 09:59 AM.
SGT USMC 72-75 Member DAV,MTA,ITA,NRA
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: joepennanti]
#6429821
01/15/19 11:50 PM
01/15/19 11:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Idaho
IDTrapman
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2012
Idaho
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Holy cow! You're the weasel master Joe!  What do you mean by this?: "Weasel boxes, rat snap-traps, culverts... that's not Long-tailed trapping." I was thinking of messing around a bit to see if I could catch a few weasels and made a 1/2 dozen boxes and bought some rat traps. You saying this won't work for the Longtails? Maybe they're too big for the rat traps or...? Appreciate you sharing your knowledge.
Roads? Where we're going, we don't need roads.
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Re: New York State Long-tailed Weasel (M. frenata)
[Re: joepennanti]
#6430248
01/16/19 01:34 PM
01/16/19 01:34 PM
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Joined: Dec 2017
Kingston, PA
TheBig1
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2017
Kingston, PA
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Thanks for the explanation Joe, I appreciate it. I know that it may sound silly but I couldn’t tell if those were paint cans or just regular veg/fruit cans with the closeup of the picture.
I’m going to get things ready for next season and while I’m out trapping other animals place these about every 100 yards.
Keep going, I’m still watching and learning
Oh, and it hit me yesterday as I saw a squirrel go across my front porch. I’ll be practicing my skinning skills on him and his family while simultaneously enjoying some squirrel and dumplings.
Last edited by TheBig1; 01/16/19 01:42 PM.
You can't cheat the mountain pilgrim. Mountain's got its own ways.
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