I'm going to get a few details wrong because I read the article many years ago.

Guy rents the basement apartment in a house. Police raid the house in the middle of the night looking for the owners, not the basement tenant. The police did not know the basement was a rental unit. Guy hears the ruckus upstairs, does not know what's happening upstairs and gets his handgun ready. He finds a place to hide in the basement, and points the gun at the top of the stairs just in case.

After a few minutes, the police kick through the basement door and 12 swat team officers start down the stairs. Tenant does not realize they are police since they are all in black and did not announce who they were. He shoots the first 6, killing one of them. The wounded and others return fire. Over 100 rounds fired by the police, two hits, neither lethal. 36 rounds fired by the tenant. 1 dead officer, 5 others wounded, all retreat up the stairs.

Seems like a very bad idea. Surveillance and patience and you can just pick the guy up in the Walmart parking lot tomorrow.

They should not be allowed. To many stories of them hiting the wrong house. They should be held accountable for that. Hitting the wrong house is the same as breaking and entering.

My wife comes from a rough family, her grandfather has spent over 30 years in prison all for selling cocaine, one night when my wife was 5 yr old and her sister was 3, the police came looking for one of the family members, they kicked in the door without saying a word and my wife's 3 yr old sister just happened to be walking by the door when they kicked it in, it knocked her across the room putting a large laceration on her face that required a lot of stitches. She's carried the scar her whole life. So they are definitely times when innocent people are hurt. And the guy they were looking for was not there.

No knock warrant/assault team raid, should only be done with cause to believe a real threat exists. Not just because the cops want to scare everybody in the neighborhood half to death and play with their toys. Risk the lives of the people they claim to protect, because they think a family man might be smoking marijuana. If they assault the home of someone looking for a real bad outlaw, that isn't even there, its time to fire people and have a judge remove their enforcement credentials. Plenty of jobs out there. This militarizing of law enforcement is not a good thing.


END THE WAR ON DRUGS> IT AINT WORKING

There is a time and place for a no knock!



From a former door kicker.

For cops to end up at the wrong house says they are not familiar with the place, and must be working off some bad tips from their drug user friends.
Its a bump in the road that needs to be fixed. A danger to kids, yes. Probably not the danger the drugs, particularly meth, is to your kids when you have dopers in your neighborhood. Not only do cops make bad hits, but when there are dopers in your area, they have enemies within their market franchise (so to speak) and in order to keep them out they hire thugs to put the fear in them and sometimes they get the wrong house.
If you haven't ever had to deal with a meth head, try it you, you won't like it. Try renting a house to them unknowingly, besides constant traffic all night and all the crazy things they do is unbelievable. Would even an insane person try to catch anhydrous ammonia in a open 5 gal bucket? If they could get rid of the dope then all other crime would drop. Stealing to support their habit is a big one, besides car wrecks.
Somebody needs to smarten up on their house raids.

Yup. Same cop hating crap I left this sight for. If you guys don’t think the judge issuing the no-knock doesn’t take all factors into consideration you obviously have no idea of how your legal system works.

Been on countless NK warrant services and just to inform you there are VERY rigid criteria on identifying as an officer. Cops are not slipping through the house like ninjas or cat burglars. Lots of yelling identifiers and very clear instructions. We know what risk is involved and if there are not significant threat issues there is no grounds for a NK. I have logged back on for a grand total of less than 24 hours and ready for another couple year hiatus.

Foxcatcher no clue what goes on where you are. None of what you said is true here. except for the yelling and big firecrackers. scaring people and getting them angry. trespassing and trying to order people around on their own properties. out of control reckless and senseless. who cares if the madman running around dressed in battle gear is yelling police officer? is that supposed to make it all ok? what do you do if your up against a dangerous criminal? what I saw for a guy less dangerous to the health and safety of the community than a mosquito looked like a raid on osama's compound.

In my daughters case, it was local police. Instead of being at xxx East Hamilton Street, they were at xxx West Hamilton. It had nothing to do with a bad tip. The police just goofed up.

The one I watched was in 2000-2001. Whole neighborhood complained to the sheriff. The sheriff tried to blame the chief of police in the county seat who was blaming the sheriff. Haven't seen anything like it since and still cant comprehend how men who took a job to provide for public safety could have done such a thing. That was the day it dawned on me that there was a real and valid reason for the 2nd amendment beyond just protection from thieves and rapists.

I haven't read any comments of anybody cop hating.

Ha, read anything posted by danny clifton, whose experience is 19 years old yet he seems tk be an expert in law enforcement.

You do if you want a new door.

I wouldn't let some cranky old buggers get you all riled up.

Truthfully, I think most here would like to learn more about the factors the judge considers when issuing the warrant and what risks/threats the police evaluate when deciding on the best way to serve an arrest warrant. Instead of getting upset and defensive, you sound like someone who could help us out by dropping some knowledge on us.

It seems to me that even if the cops come in yelling instructions and shouting their identification as police, all the yelling and shouting by multiple individuals would only add to the confusion and panic of the people inside. Honestly, if someone busted down my door and came inside yelling orders, I don't think I would immediately surrender and comply just because somebody was shouting "POLICE" and wearing a vest with those words printed on it. That's just the kind of ruse I would expect a home invader to use.

There was an incident a few months ago in the city I work where some goons busted in to their dealer's house screaming "police!!!", they were there to steal weed and money. The dealer's woman got shot and killed on the mayhem.

The fact is that there have been multiple "no knock raids" (NKR's) that have gone way, way wrong, even if the majority of them are necessary and well executed. It's a pretty big deal when an innocent person's house is "stormed" and people and pets are hurt, or killed, in the process. It isn't "anti-police" for free people to be concerned about actual happenings perpetrated by government employees that are so potentially destructive...it is plain common sense to the draw back and do a risk/reward assessment.

If the judge takes all factors into consideration then how can a NK be issued for the wrong address ? Maybe not real stringent oversight by the judge? It is a fact that wrong address are raided and innocent people are killed every year, that's not hating on the cops that is undeniable fact.Not to hard to figure out how to fix the problem but to some people that is just the cost of doing business.

You are laying in bed asleep with the air conditioner running and at 2 in the morning you hear your door busted open and guys with guns yelling and shouting. You've been startled awake out of a deep sleep and what the cop hears as " yelling identifiers and very clear instructions", the innocent homeowner hears as unintelligible screaming by home invaders. At this point both sides are amped up on adrenaline, no good is going to come of this. A lot of guys on here are going to reach for a gun, you are protecting your family after all. Home owner gets shot or maybe cops get shot but whoever gets shot it's a needless tragedy for the families affected because of a NK at the wrong place. This exact scenario has happened every year since NK's were allowed and I for one think it's time to do away with them. Too many things to go wrong and innocent people end up dead as a result. If that makes me a cop hater so be it.

I thought you were a cop K52?

Nope, not me. Retired brick and stone mason.

The county sheriff used a state swat team to serve a warrant in Palisade NE a few years ago. A town of about 200 people.