? For Veterans?
#6764011
02/09/20 10:29 AM
02/09/20 10:29 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,570 La Crosse, WI
Macthediver
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,570
La Crosse, WI
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So Trump fired this general that testified against him in the impeachment hearing. Also his brother who is a soldier too..Collateral damage..Guess that is to be expected would happen at any job my guess..No current war front to send him to so he can get whacked.. I'm not a veteran don't know much about military law.. My question is.. Should this guy face court marshal? be dismissed from military? demoted? which guess kind of like he was.. will he be moved to some remote work station no one wants to be at?? kind how I seen it work in fire service.. Wonder why he wasn't court marshaled, maybe face fire squad or be locked up for while at Leavenworth? What rules did he violate? was he order not to comply with the congresses subpoena? was it treason he committed? Did he break public trust or just the bosses?? Seriously I'm curious what most military guys and veterans think.. Can we keep replies to this to comments that won't get it whacked??
Mac
"Never Forget Which Way Is Up"
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: Macthediver]
#6764042
02/09/20 10:43 AM
02/09/20 10:43 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,888 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,888
williamsburg ks
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Anybody in the military from e-1 to general is in violation of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, if he or she makes a political commentary in a public setting. Especially to a reporter. They can say anything they want in a private setting or in a direct communication to the politician.
I suspect no charges were filed and instead they were forced to retire to avoid political fallout. There have been quite a few commanders over the years forced to retire rather than be brought up on charges. Usually an enlisted member will get called in front of his/her commander, read the riot act, get letter of reprimand in their record, and have some sort of in house punishment like extra duty, confinement to barracks or something. It will eventually blow over so long as it doesn't happen again.
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: Macthediver]
#6764068
02/09/20 11:04 AM
02/09/20 11:04 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,204 Armpit, ak
Dirt
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,204
Armpit, ak
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They should have given him an Article 15 and busted him down a rank and made him clean toilets for two weeks.
Who is John Galt?
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: Macthediver]
#6764135
02/09/20 11:59 AM
02/09/20 11:59 AM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 830 West coast of Iowa
iaduckhntr
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 830
West coast of Iowa
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Should have been part of trump's housecleaning of bama's left overs to began with !!! Dennis
Old 8 toes~~ life ITA and NRA member Life in the fast lane is no place for a tricycle!
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: Macthediver]
#6764190
02/09/20 12:43 PM
02/09/20 12:43 PM
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Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 464 N.W. Pennsylvania
JTaddeo
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 464
N.W. Pennsylvania
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A pawn in a game of chess. What he hoped to accomplish, aside from being reassigned or discharged is beyond me.
My guess would be book writing?????? Maybe his morality and beliefs came into play? IDK
As far as I remember one has the duty to obey lawful orders and to disobey unlawful orders up to and including arresting those giving the unlawful order(s), at least that was my indoctrination from my service.
UCMJ is as grey as the myriad of military officers and NCO's executing it....but it is military law.
The way they will screw with him will come in promotions (or lack thereof), and then retirement benefits, LTC is a field grade career officer, his fate will depend on who controls the purses.....
I think the president has a say so in it eh? IMHO he might as well have resigned and went fishing...
Keep your boots dry and your powder too.
I remember when a fur check was reality.....now I'm just trapping for the love of it.
Best Regards,
JT
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: Macthediver]
#6764194
02/09/20 12:45 PM
02/09/20 12:45 PM
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 245 New Mexico
Desertambition
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 245
New Mexico
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This is a multifaceted question. My bottom line is a reasonable person should do what is right even if someone tells you it is wrong. I think if, in fact, he would have violated the UCMJ he would be facing court-martial, which he is not. Additionally, the Pentagon, when asked if the Pentagon would welcome back Vidman, issued a statement "it will protect its service members from retaliation," which further tells me there was no violation. No one is questioning if he was telling the truth or not, since there was a recording of the telephone conversation in question. In my opinion, patriotism is standing up for ideals, not for protecting one's boss whether you are an E-1 or a general, or a civilian. I am a Veteran.
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: white17]
#6764276
02/09/20 02:18 PM
02/09/20 02:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,643 Georgia
warrior
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,643
Georgia
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His brother is also a Lt Col. Jag officer
I suspect he will be passed over for his next promotion and then retired quietly.
Then a job at MSNBC or CNN.
This removal will show in his records as well as the verbal reprimand from his superior in 2013 . I didn't realize he was a jag officer. I've only heard of him reported as a shyster. In that case all of the above expect court martial unless he abetted his brother in insubordination.
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: bblwi]
#6764285
02/09/20 02:28 PM
02/09/20 02:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,643 Georgia
warrior
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,643
Georgia
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He is not a general. He is a colonel in the Army. He he testified due to being subpoenaed and thus testify under oath. Evidently the WH did not feel it necessary to order him to not testify or he defied the WH order to not to testify. No one contested the fact that he gave false testimony during the hearing. As to being demoted that is at the luxury of those above him, but I don't personally feel he committed any crime or was being unfaithful to his oath to up hold the Constitution.
Bryce He did way more than just respond to a supoeana. He crossed a line by first discussing the phone call with a third party, the whistleblower, which may constitute a violation of his security clearance. When testifying he offered his personal opinion not just facts and openly acted against command authority in doing so.
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: Macthediver]
#6764298
02/09/20 02:40 PM
02/09/20 02:40 PM
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,898 michigan,USA
seniortrap
trapper
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trapper
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,898
michigan,USA
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What he "testified" about was his opinion. Not fact. Also, why did he jump the chain of command and talk to a "lawyer" rather than his superior ? He may have been an Army LTC. But that does not escape the chain of command you must travel. A court marshal in the least should be enacted. 6 months in Leavenworth then discharged. And directed to "NOT" write a book. He had a high clearance to be there in the White House. Too much information to disclose publicly.
Vietnam--1967 46th. Const./Combat Engineers
"Chaotic action is preferable to orderly inaction." "After the first shot, all plans go out the window!"
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Re: ? For Veterans?
[Re: Macthediver]
#6764588
02/09/20 07:20 PM
02/09/20 07:20 PM
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Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 1,553 Saucier, Mississippi Harrison ...
turkn8rtrapper
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 1,553
Saucier, Mississippi Harrison ...
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This guy should have been court marshald for several reasons. One as an officer he is held to a higher standard. I know if he had jumped the chain as he did in the field he would have been. Letter of reprimand at a minimum. He called a third party and discussed highly classified information who is the whistle blower. I'm betting the fix was already in from someone politically connected. He had already been reassigned to the War College where he is going early. Once he is under the radar and the dust settles he's done. Don't for one second believe he's going to slip by this untouched. His career is over for sure. No commander in his right mind will ever trust this back stabber and not want to be within a 100 miles of him. He is a gone pecan as they say in the south. I hope he got some good offers from the lib news folks but now that the dems are done with him I'm betting he's hanging out there on his own. He is just a Lt Col. not really that high on the food chain so pretty much he is screwed it will just have a time delay.
"Skin that smokewagon and see what happens"
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