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Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: ] #6973247
08/25/20 09:10 AM
08/25/20 09:10 AM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 5,214
Crivitz WI
Sprung & Rusty Offline
trapper
Sprung & Rusty  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 5,214
Crivitz WI
Originally Posted by Trap_Hunt_Fish
Anybody who feels it’s necessary to exercise their “constitutional right” by reaching for their gun while talking to a cop is quite simply not too bright. That’s the only point I’m seeing being made

^^^^^this^^^^. The guy played a stupid game and won a stupid prize.

Last edited by Sprung & Rusty; 08/25/20 09:11 AM.

No Jab.
Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973248
08/25/20 09:10 AM
08/25/20 09:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 1,269
Indiana
C
concrete man Offline
trapper
concrete man  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 1,269
Indiana
If you're driving down to the street coming up to a green light and a 18 wheel is to your left it's going to run the red light and hit you its your constitutional right to go on green . I'm stopping . IDIOTS!

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: HobbieTrapper] #6973280
08/25/20 10:01 AM
08/25/20 10:01 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
trapper
Finster  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper
Originally Posted by Finster
It is meant more for checking for weapons for the safety of the officer.


So now we are back to the question does the officers RIGHT to safety trump a “suspect’s” RIGHT and who granted that?

If that is the law in your state then that is the law. If you don't like the law, you work to change the law. What else can I tell you?


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: concrete man] #6973281
08/25/20 10:03 AM
08/25/20 10:03 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
trapper
Finster  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
Originally Posted by concrete man
If you're driving down to the street coming up to a green light and a 18 wheel is to your left it's going to run the red light and hit you its your constitutional right to go on green . I'm stopping . IDIOTS!

laugh


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973311
08/25/20 10:45 AM
08/25/20 10:45 AM
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 169
Llano, Texas, USA
H
Hills of Texas Offline
trapper
Hills of Texas  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 169
Llano, Texas, USA
This has nothing to do with color. You could be green and be shot for your actions just as easy. What is it? 20 seconds worth of video.... there’s more to the story and a lot more to the investigation. The people rioting and acting like fools are just using it as this weeks excuse. White people are shot doing the same crap only that’s not news worthy because it doesn’t fit the narrative. Don’t buy into the divisive crap people. The story is if you spend a large portion of your time acting a fool, chances are your going to die foolishly.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Finster] #6973319
08/25/20 11:03 AM
08/25/20 11:03 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Originally Posted by Finster
If that is the law in your state then that is the law. If you don't like the law, you work to change the law. What else can I tell you?


State law does not trump the 4th Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. But that is irrelevant in this discussion.

The political agendas pushed in debates like this lead to a misuse of the Constitution. Most have not read it and even fewer understand it beyond what they skimmed on the internet or were told by the media.

The real answer is this: You generally have a right to not get shot in the back by a police officer. You however do not have a right to cuss, argue, run, resist or fight your way out of a police encounter or arrest. A police officer has a right to operate within a spectrum of reasonableness and to protect his/her safety and the safety of the public. If you have an outstanding warrant or if you committed a crime, our laws and society dictate that you get arrested. The place to protect your individual rights is at the courthouse.

Liberty is really easy to defend when people are productive and act reasonably. I lean very libertarian on most issues. However, the Michael Browns, George Floyds and Jacob Blakes of the world are not patriots protecting our existing freedoms or pushing for more freedom. They are useless drags on this country. While they have basic rights guaranteed by the Constitution, I'm not interested in doing any legal or mental gymnastics to ignore the fact that they caused the encounter and the use of initial force and then they got the effect. Ignoring those facts only erodes the rights I have.

Liberty is dying a quick death in this country. Those pushing the agendas of BLM and, frankly, some of the conservatives on the other end are doing their best to destroy it. We need to save our right to resist for when we really need it and not spend any capital on these distractions.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Finster] #6973324
08/25/20 11:11 AM
08/25/20 11:11 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,079
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"
HobbieTrapper  Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,079
Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by Finster
Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper


So now we are back to the question does the officers RIGHT to safety trump a “suspect’s” RIGHT and who granted that?

If that is the law in your state then that is the law. If you don't like the law, you work to change the law. What else can I tell you?


Regardless of the law, from a “Right” stand point, the suspect granted it by taking actions that placed that safety in jeopardy.


-Goofy-
Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973325
08/25/20 11:11 AM
08/25/20 11:11 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
trapper
Finster  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
New video. Here Mr. Blake can be seen fighting with police and resisting arrest. He manages to shake them off and that is sort of where the other video starts.


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Finster] #6973328
08/25/20 11:17 AM
08/25/20 11:17 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Originally Posted by Finster
New video. Here Mr. Blake can be seen fighting with police and resisting arrest. He manages to shake them off and that is sort of where the other video starts.


Another problem is spectators or resistance helpers coming up behind the officers. They are at best a distraction and at worst another threat. In my opinion, this goes into the reasonableness test.

Someone needs to sit the entire "community" down and explain cause and effect.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973400
08/25/20 01:33 PM
08/25/20 01:33 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 527
Wis. up North!
2020 Offline
trapper
2020  Offline
trapper

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 527
Wis. up North!
Here's what I see, Small built man in my opinion, calmly walks away from 2 men , His back towards 2 other men, no threat, not putting the 2 other mens in a life threatening position , opens up car door, the police feel that instead of the old head lock move to subdue the man, decides to Pump several bullets in his back.

I guess i missed the part where the polices lives were in danger and they had no other means to control the situation but with their Pistol- I hope someone can point out the facts to me how this wouldn't be declared a attempted murder charge or something to that effect.

Be Kind to Others !

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: 2020] #6973403
08/25/20 01:39 PM
08/25/20 01:39 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 6,552
east central WI
K
k snow Offline
trapper
k snow  Offline
trapper
K

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 6,552
east central WI
Originally Posted by 2020
Here's what I see, Small built man in my opinion, calmly walks away from 2 men , His back towards 2 other men, no threat, not putting the 2 other mens in a life threatening position , opens up car door, the police feel that instead of the old head lock move to subdue the man, decides to Pump several bullets in his back.

I guess i missed the part where the polices lives were in danger and they had no other means to control the situation but with their Pistol- I hope someone can point out the facts to me how this wouldn't be declared a attempted murder charge or something to that effect.

Be Kind to Others !


After fighting with the cops, see the new video.

What was in the door of the van? On the seat?

Way too little information in the first video. But judge away.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973404
08/25/20 01:40 PM
08/25/20 01:40 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
This will be the first and probably last time I say watch Finster's video.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973412
08/25/20 01:45 PM
08/25/20 01:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694
nm
A
adam m Offline
trapper
adam m  Offline
trapper
A

Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694
nm
I've seen both videos yesterday, I am curious how long were the 3 of them fighting before the videos started? All the spectators had some time to come out watch and then record.

The suspect played a stupid game won the prize.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: adam m] #6973418
08/25/20 01:51 PM
08/25/20 01:51 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Originally Posted by adam m
I've seen both videos yesterday, I am curious how long were the 3 of them fighting before the videos started? All the spectators had some time to come out watch and then record.

The suspect played a stupid game won the prize.


While how long is potentially relevant to the reasonableness of the officers' actions, after Mr. Blake walked away (after resisting) and at the very moment he stuck his hand into that car, a reasonable officer could conclude that his life and those of the other officers and the other people in the area were at risk.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973423
08/25/20 01:54 PM
08/25/20 01:54 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 527
Wis. up North!
2020 Offline
trapper
2020  Offline
trapper

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 527
Wis. up North!
Quote
after Mr. Blake walked away


LOL

Be Kind too Others !

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: 2020] #6973427
08/25/20 01:58 PM
08/25/20 01:58 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,079
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"
HobbieTrapper  Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,079
Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by 2020
Here's what I see, Small built man in my opinion, calmly walks away from 2 men , His back towards 2 other men, no threat, not putting the 2 other mens in a life threatening position , opens up car door, the police feel that instead of the old head lock move to subdue the man, decides to Pump several bullets in his back.

I guess i missed the part where the polices lives were in danger and they had no other means to control the situation but with their Pistol- I hope someone can point out the facts to me how this wouldn't be declared a attempted murder charge or something to that effect.

Be Kind to Others !


Can’t grab ‘em by the head anymore because if they lunge and spin you now have them by the neck, which you have to release and try and get another hold. That may be all that is needed to get the drop on you. lol


-Goofy-
Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: 2020] #6973432
08/25/20 02:07 PM
08/25/20 02:07 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Originally Posted by 2020
Quote
after Mr. Blake walked away


LOL

Be Kind too Others !



If you're going to quote me, use the whole quote.

Good luck living in a society where criminals can just walk away because they decided not to be arrested.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: Howell Bros] #6973435
08/25/20 02:10 PM
08/25/20 02:10 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,079
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"
HobbieTrapper  Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,079
Eastern Shore of Maryland


-Goofy-
Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: HobbieTrapper] #6973436
08/25/20 02:11 PM
08/25/20 02:11 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,031
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper


I was thinking the same thing.

Re: It’s about to get crazy again in Wi [Re: 2020] #6973438
08/25/20 02:12 PM
08/25/20 02:12 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
trapper
Finster  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 17,114
Fredonia, PA.
Originally Posted by 2020
Here's what I see, Small built man in my opinion, calmly walks away from 2 men , His back towards 2 other men, no threat, not putting the 2 other mens in a life threatening position , opens up car door, the police feel that instead of the old head lock move to subdue the man, decides to Pump several bullets in his back.

I guess i missed the part where the polices lives were in danger and they had no other means to control the situation but with their Pistol- I hope someone can point out the facts to me how this wouldn't be declared a attempted murder charge or something to that effect.

Be Kind to Others !

What you are not seeing is a man that had an active warrant for his arrest for the crimes of 3rd degree sexual assault (of a 15yo it turns out) and domestic violence. who just assaulted at least two police officers,(another felony) resisted arrest (Felony) by "walking away" he is now trying to elude arrest (Felony) and walks to his car ignoring lawful orders the entire time (more offences) Now this upstanding citizen opens a car door still ignoring lawful orders and reaches in the car for something. Yup, sounds like an upstanding citizen to me. Perhaps when he gets out of the hospital you can have him over for tea?

Last edited by Finster; 08/25/20 02:12 PM.

I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
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