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Can the Roth survive..? #7361948
09/22/21 05:36 PM
09/22/21 05:36 PM
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 507
midland, michigan
M
midlander Offline OP
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midlander  Offline OP
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Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 507
midland, michigan
I suspect this administration is gonna try and raise taxes every chance they get in order to try and pay for this nonsense stimulus . I cant help but wonder how long it is before they try to change the rules on Roth investments. I read an article that was critical of Roth backdoor rollovers by 'wealthy people'...their term, not mine. My Edward Jones advisor speculated over 20 years ago that he did not think it would last long since it was a great investment tool for the common person and did not benefit the government. Well, obviously he was wrong and it has lasted quite awhile, but its not gonna surprise me to see them try and 'tweak' it to their benefit. Whatcha think..?

Last edited by midlander; 09/22/21 05:38 PM. Reason: Misspelled
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7361953
09/22/21 05:44 PM
09/22/21 05:44 PM
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 764
IL
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ILcooner Offline
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ILcooner  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2020
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IL
A couple has to be over $208,000 MAGI/yr to do the backdoor roth. Thats pretty high incomes in most areas of this country.

I sure hope they dont restrict ROTH IRAs I utilize mine annually. For a young person, maxing that ROTH out with $6000/yr is a no brainer.

https://www.aarp.org/retirement/pla...4_T04jtbeoaAih7EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Last edited by ILcooner; 09/22/21 05:46 PM.
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7361969
09/22/21 05:53 PM
09/22/21 05:53 PM
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 507
midland, michigan
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midlander Offline OP
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midlander  Offline OP
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Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 507
midland, michigan
I dont disagree , 208k is great income, but i worry that once that loophole is eliminated, they will then try to tweak or eliminate the Roth for the rest of us. They need every tax dollar they can get...they dont make money on a Roth.

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7361970
09/22/21 05:54 PM
09/22/21 05:54 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,664
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"
HobbieTrapper  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,664
Eastern Shore of Maryland
No, they need money and it has to come from somewhere. They are working toward having everyone’s money so it can be distributed fairly.


-Goofy-
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7361989
09/22/21 06:09 PM
09/22/21 06:09 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,545
Western Shore Delaware
SJA Offline
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SJA  Offline
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Western Shore Delaware
Current ROTH accounts will be "grandfathered" in without penalties. Future accounts MAY BE changed in their restrictions and policies.


"Humans are the hardest people to get along with."
Dr. Phillip Snow
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362004
09/22/21 06:38 PM
09/22/21 06:38 PM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,900
meadowview, Virginia
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EdP Offline
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,900
meadowview, Virginia
There are other ways to get your money than directly taxing your Roth earnings. For example, increasing the cost of Medicare for those over a certain retirement income or total wealth level. Another option is to decrease your SS payment if your have over a certain retirement income. The 2nd strategy already exists but the threshold is quite high. It could be lowered. The government has a plethora of options for taking money from those that earned it and giving it to those that didn't. The truly wealthy have lawyers and accountants helping them find the loopholes. Those in the middle get stuck with the bill.

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: EdP] #7362010
09/22/21 06:46 PM
09/22/21 06:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,953
East-Central Wisconsin
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bblwi Offline
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East-Central Wisconsin
As stated there are a multitude of ways that we can be taxed or charged a fee to garner more revenue for the government and or lower deficits etc. We need to talk about deficits first as it will be a long time before we start working on lowering our national debt if we politically and socially want to even try. My wife and I are re-characterizing or deferred accounts into ROTHS during this lower tax period. For us that do not earn enough in retirement to pay into ROTHS if we get grand fathered in that will be good. It is still quite amazing to me with the market having done very well the last 30 plus years more tax payers have not chosen to participate in investing for their future.

Bryce

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362012
09/22/21 06:47 PM
09/22/21 06:47 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,411
Magna, Utah
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GritGuy Offline
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Magna, Utah
Any one thinking that anything is not attainable to be changed by this party in charge, is hiding under the sand !!

Everything and anything can and will probably be attacked in some way for funds for their program, it can't be pulled out of the federal treasury with out notice or more money printed.

Things are really going to get icky in this country the longer Biden stays in office !!


[Linked Image]

Sorry if my opinions or replies offend you, they are not meant to !

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362017
09/22/21 06:55 PM
09/22/21 06:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,840
SW PA
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white marlin Offline
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SW PA
there is talk in some circles about "appropriating" private retirement accounts and distributing a "fair" monthly stiped to the confiscees and beneficiaries.

(I mean, it's not FAIR that you accumulated a large nest egg, while others have NOT!)


"necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." William Pitt the Younger
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362063
09/22/21 08:01 PM
09/22/21 08:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 14,677
North East Kansas
Marty Offline
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Marty  Offline
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North East Kansas
what are they going to do when everything crashes?


Live/Die with Integrity and Honor.
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362101
09/22/21 08:32 PM
09/22/21 08:32 PM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 4,623
Kansas
Pawnee Offline
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Pawnee  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 4,623
Kansas
Bernie Sanders has stated many times he wants your 401K. Marxist surround us


Everything the left touches it destroys
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: Pawnee] #7362139
09/22/21 09:20 PM
09/22/21 09:20 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,953
East-Central Wisconsin
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bblwi Offline
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bblwi  Offline
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East-Central Wisconsin
I put my first $'s in the market in 1975 and as of this year we have the 9th executive administration, about 23 different Congresses, many changes in the Supreme Court and way too many state and local changes to count so I don't by into all this the sky if falling and everyone is out to steal my money. A huge and healthy market helps fuel a strong and growing economy and be it capitalistic or more socialistic the fact that companies have good places to find capital or gain leverage for loans to grow is important. The two largest dairy marketing firms in the world or French companies, and those companies are growing and successful. Sure many countries have a more socialistic culture then we do but it does not mean that the government wants or intends to take over unless, unless many businesses would invite them to do so. Several nations have joint private and public ownership of many major firms, most dealing with energy. Here in the USA we choose to subsidize or partner with business through our tax laws and codes.

Bryce

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362274
09/23/21 04:59 AM
09/23/21 04:59 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,664
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,664
Eastern Shore of Maryland
The sky may not be falling but the tax code is about to get a makeover shortly after 2022. The table is set and menus passed around to see what will be needed in 2022 to secure it. I’m certain the “we gotta be liked by all” government will take into consideration Global company partnerships when deciding what is best.


-Goofy-
Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362334
09/23/21 06:33 AM
09/23/21 06:33 AM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,900
meadowview, Virginia
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EdP Offline
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meadowview, Virginia
I don't see anything major happening to the tax code after 2022. The conservatives like the tax code as it is and are very likely to hold either the House, Senate, or both after 2022. If there is going to be a change it will happen in the next 13 months.

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: SJA] #7362358
09/23/21 07:10 AM
09/23/21 07:10 AM
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 764
IL
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ILcooner Offline
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IL
Originally Posted by SJA
Current ROTH accounts will be "grandfathered" in without penalties. Future accounts MAY BE changed in their restrictions and policies.


As soon as kids/grandkids have taxable income ie first job they should open a Roth IRA.

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362359
09/23/21 07:11 AM
09/23/21 07:11 AM
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 764
IL
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ILcooner Offline
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[Linked Image]

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362383
09/23/21 07:49 AM
09/23/21 07:49 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,986
Asheville, NC
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charles Offline
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Asheville, NC
Surely it is in the governments best interest for every American to save for a rainy day. The Roth money is still circulating.

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: charles] #7362470
09/23/21 10:01 AM
09/23/21 10:01 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,953
East-Central Wisconsin
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bblwi Offline
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bblwi  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
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East-Central Wisconsin
If I were young I would be saving as much as I could as down the road it is much more likely that individual retirement programs such as ROTH or traditional will be the major later in life funds as to me the government is more likely to play with SSI stipends, age limits etc. then personal accounts. Even if taxed down the road they are going to be a better revenue source. If we continue to have Medicare as similar to what we have now it could be that a greater percentage of the SSI tax be going to that fund and less to the SSI stipend and individuals need to save more. The responsibility to save for retirement is even more important today with far fewer pensions and profit sharing funds by employers. I don't see this trend changing either. A lot of post on here have stated how the government will take over with socialized insurance. I worked in the public sector for 40 years including the military and I saw many take jobs in the public sector so they could get the HC insurance benefits, even if they could earn more at other places and this allowed many small business owners to operate w/o the cost of buying insurance, so our capitalistic system has been milking public supported HC for decades already, so continuing that process is not surprising to me and very likely to increase.

Bryce

Re: Can the Roth survive..? [Re: midlander] #7362543
09/23/21 11:16 AM
09/23/21 11:16 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,782
shelbyville, illinois 50years ...
foxkidd44 Offline
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foxkidd44  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,782
shelbyville, illinois 50years ...
thought you was referring to this guy at first...


Stand by your principles, Stand by your guns, and victory complete and permanent is sure at last.
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