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Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7572571
04/29/22 09:51 AM
04/29/22 09:51 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline OP
trapper
TEJAS  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country


Here are a few of the more 3 inch hole sets from the same season made on level ground.

The attractant list was bait down the hole, lure and urine in the backing, and a little wool for a visual.

[Linked Image]


I think the addition of a visual like wool or hair can really help sell the deal on some coyotes.

As with any attractant it should not be overused.

[Linked Image]


These did produce a couple of coyotes, but the set itself was easily defeated.

With so much area to protect, side digging was always an issue with the bigger holes.

That alone may be why lt has not produced like other sets.

[Linked Image]
I believe most of the catches with this look were younger coyotes.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7572585
04/29/22 10:09 AM
04/29/22 10:09 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Northern Mn
rick olson Offline
trapper
rick olson  Offline
trapper

Joined: Apr 2012
Northern Mn
Big holes like badger holes etc produce the least up here also,like stated earlier harder to keep misses down to guard the hole,making a u shape trench helps,but it's way easier to just make a flat set.Hole's do have there place on a trapline,double punch holes,peep holes or 1 to 2" holes,post hole set but some of these take more effort to make,I also think more hole type sets catch more of the younger coyotes so yes they do work,a dead coyote is a good coyote no matter what set it was caught in!

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7572670
04/29/22 12:26 PM
04/29/22 12:26 PM
Joined: Apr 2017
SE Kansas
L
Len Dunham Offline
trapper
Len Dunham  Offline
trapper
L

Joined: Apr 2017
SE Kansas
I use a 2in hole a lot of my sets look like the ones in pictures.I think from the time that they come out of the den they learn a hole could mean food.Grasshoppers, moles , mice ,rats, snakes and what ever some else has buried.Dirt hole sets are my go to set.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7572750
04/29/22 03:05 PM
04/29/22 03:05 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Nebraska
silkyplainscoyot Offline
trapper
silkyplainscoyot  Offline
trapper

Joined: Apr 2012
Nebraska
This thought might raise some disagreements but I don't feel that holes mean much for food to a coyote. They peek interest but coyotes are hunters and opportunists. I don't feel they expend the energy or effort to dig for something they'll never be able to get to. Sure they may scratch or dig at something they feel is shallow but I don't see them digging up holes ground squirrels, rabbits, or kangaroo rats run in. Coyotes will catch those critters off guard in the weeds or in the open.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: silkyplainscoyot] #7573376
04/30/22 08:52 AM
04/30/22 08:52 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline OP
trapper
TEJAS  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country

Originally Posted by silkyplainscoyot
This thought might raise some disagreements but I don't feel that holes mean much for food to a coyote. They peek interest but coyotes are hunters and opportunists. I don't feel they expend the energy or effort to dig for something they'll never be able to get to. Sure they may scratch or dig at something they feel is shallow but I don't see them digging up holes ground squirrels, rabbits, or kangaroo rats run in. Coyotes will catch those critters off guard in the weeds or in the open.


I agree 100% Silky.

The visual of the hole itself is not where the magic lies. If that was the case, every rodent hole in the area would be blown out. I see hundreds of active ground squirrel holes along fence lines where coyotes pass every night and there are zero digs. They don’t dig because they know they can’t get to them on their own.

Even with an added visual like wool, hair, or feathers, it still doesn’t have the power to hold a coyote’s attention for very long as a stand-alone.

In short, the purpose of the hole is to guard the bait.

I discovered early on that a coyote will only dig in earnest if they truly think they can get to the prize.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7573468
04/30/22 11:05 AM
04/30/22 11:05 AM
Joined: Apr 2019
Texas
S
Squash Bucket Offline
trapper
Squash Bucket  Offline
trapper
S

Joined: Apr 2019
Texas
Appreciate the pictures and information, following closely and plan to apply some of these tactics on an upcoming job this Summer.

What county in South Texas are you trapping? I'm currently in Hidalgo County visiting family.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7573817
04/30/22 07:55 PM
04/30/22 07:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2014
E central Il
G
Golf ball Offline
trapper
Golf ball  Offline
trapper
G

Joined: Dec 2014
E central Il
I don’t have rats , at least not like I’ve seen in Kansas in the sand. But I do have mice and know that coyotes actively work them . Maybe that’s why I have confidence in a hole set . Or maybe it’s because of a guy named Bob that we can’t talk about , or a guy named Robert that caught nearly a thousand coyotes a couple years ago in one fur season . I know both of them use exclusively hole sets all year every year in all regions of the country. Don’t get me wrong I have nothing against a flat set , I’m not going to knock it nor ignore it. But it’s pretty hard for me to put all my eggs in one basket knowing that holes produce numbers for the two largest producers of coyotes of our time . By all means use what works best for each situation. For me it’s a hole with a fresh piece of natural bait or a mouse nest.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7574272
05/01/22 11:28 AM
05/01/22 11:28 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline OP
trapper
TEJAS  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country

I couldn’t agree more GB.

You make a great point. All situations are indeed different.

I believe everyone would agree that jumping from location to location skimming the cream verses predation trapping where you are trying to kill every coyote you can are two totally different things.

When you run and gun you’re not there long enough for the coyotes to catch on. That same tactic may not apply to folks that trap the same ground all season, or ADC men working the high pressure crew.

The flat a far cry from a one dimensional set. It’s so versatile you can easily go without repeating the same exact look in a day’s worth of setting. That is what makes it so deadly.

My experience has been that the same does not hold true with the hole set no matter what the variation is. Pressured coyotes catch on to repeated patterns extremely quick. That is a fact that can’t be ignored.


All the trappers that have taken the time to post here are just sharing experiences, observations, and what they have learned on their own individual lines.

Nothing in coyote trapping is absolute.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7574284
05/01/22 11:45 AM
05/01/22 11:45 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline OP
trapper
TEJAS  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country

Originally Posted by Squash Bucket
Appreciate the pictures and information, following closely and plan to apply some of these tactics on an upcoming job this Summer.


You Betcha' !

A lot of solid coyote trappers have helped make this thread worth reading.

There's some good information to be had for those that keep an open mind and want to up their coyote game.


Good luck on the line this summer Squash!


Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7574418
05/01/22 03:38 PM
05/01/22 03:38 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Northern Illinois
M
MChewk Offline
trapper
MChewk  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Northern Illinois
Tejas good thread ...it allows Trappers to consider a wide variety of conditions and options.
My take on successful dirtholes and not so successful...my best luck back when I first started on land was a stake wobble hole with Hawbakers red fox lure in it....caught reds grays coon possum and skunk...no coyotes back then. Found out later that EVERYONE was using standard dirthole dug out with shovel...so my success MIGHT have been due to something different. Later when coyotes showed up in the late 80s early 90s I continued to use my stake wobble hole but added one due to information gained at a Fur Takers convention demo...so double stake hole two different attractors. My problem was my equipment as I was poor and didn’t have much in traps or trap mods. So #2 sq jaw Victor traps or low lever # 1 1/2 coils didn’t hold many of our big coyotes. Held a few and mostly all of the other animals but experienced lots of wrecks.
Later, my go to dirt hole was O’G influenced big dirthole with a bigger stronger trap both bait and lure down hole and catch went up and stayed up. Love the big badger holes with loud bait.

Last edited by MChewk; 05/03/22 10:33 AM.
Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7574717
05/01/22 09:43 PM
05/01/22 09:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2014
E central Il
G
Golf ball Offline
trapper
Golf ball  Offline
trapper
G

Joined: Dec 2014
E central Il
Lol, Tejas you must not know who I’m talking about as they both do coyote work year round .

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7574803
05/02/22 04:41 AM
05/02/22 04:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Pa
W
Wright Brothers Offline
trapper
Wright Brothers  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Dec 2006
Pa
Wonder how many DHs an elder Pa. coyote has seen.
And how many trappers he has encountered.





Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7574901
05/02/22 07:54 AM
05/02/22 07:54 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
SW Pa
B
Bob Jameson Offline
trapper
Bob Jameson  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
SW Pa
That is a true statement Wright Brothers. In Pa. early on with all the pups out and about D Holes work well. Coyotes get considerable trapping pressure all across the State. Once the weather goes South many call it a day. At that time the air is filled with skunk odor, call lures, food lures, baits of all kinds and various urines.

Then in a few short weeks that new interest trend will slow and in many cases cease considerably depending upon the pressure. I call it the great awakening. It happens yearly. Those coyotes that made it thru so far have a different view of their world, and what they perceive as each week moves along in the season.

Suspicion and caution becomes more evident in their decision making process in how and if they commit to a set.

Those trappers that stick to dirt holes, big patterns and high eye appeal sets say that their lure or bait doesn't work anymore. Not understanding fully what is really taking place. Those that transition to flat sets, trail sets, walk throughs and scent post type sets will continue to connect. The others not so much.

Most don't have access or the opportunities that feed lots and dump stations provide. Those animals are conditioned to grub and compete for food opportunities as a result of the draw these places have provided. Given the vast agricultural and cattle rearing areas some animals will travel many miles to visit these sites. Multiply catches are quite common and expected with these conditions and the basic dirt holes are quite effective due to the opportunity competition between these animals.

You just have to understand what is taking place in your region or on your trapping grounds. Then make your adjustments accordingly. Tejas and others have shared good information which brings to light how different areas and conditions may need to be handled for continued success.

Coyotes are still coyotes, however the conditions under which they are exposed on a regular basis may be vastly different from what we are working with locally. Coyotes are remarkably adaptive animals and they will continue to evolve along the way. We have to do the same if we are to have continued success.

At some point we all will have to learn to live beyond the Dirt Hole when circumstances reveal that is what is needed. If not, I guess as some would say, they are leaving seed for the next year.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: Bob Jameson] #7574934
05/02/22 08:58 AM
05/02/22 08:58 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Northern Mn
rick olson Offline
trapper
rick olson  Offline
trapper

Joined: Apr 2012
Northern Mn
That sums it up,great response Bob.

Last edited by rick olson; 05/02/22 08:58 AM.
Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7575606
05/03/22 05:58 AM
05/03/22 05:58 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline OP
trapper
TEJAS  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country

Originally Posted by Bob Jameson

That is a true statement Wright Brothers. In Pa. early on with all the pups out and about D Holes work well. Coyotes get considerable trapping pressure all across the State. Once the weather goes South many call it a day. At that time the air is filled with skunk odor, call lures, food lures, baits of all kinds and various urines.

Then in a few short weeks that new interest trend will slow and in many cases cease considerably depending upon the pressure. I call it the great awakening. It happens yearly. Those coyotes that made it thru so far have a different view of their world, and what they perceive as each week moves along in the season.

Suspicion and caution becomes more evident in their decision making process in how and if they commit to a set.

Those trappers that stick to dirt holes, big patterns and high eye appeal sets say that their lure or bait doesn't work anymore. Not understanding fully what is really taking place. Those that transition to flat sets, walk throughs and scent post type sets will continue to connect. The others not so much.

Most don't have access or the opportunities that feed lots and dump stations provide. Those animals are conditioned to grub and compete for food opportunities as a result of the draw these places have provided. Given the vast agricultural and cattle rearing areas some animals will travel many miles to visit these sites. Multiply catches are quite common and expected with these conditions and the basic dirt holes are quite effective due to the opportunity competition between these animals.

You just have to understand what is taking place in your region or on your trapping grounds. Then make your adjustments accordingly. Tejas and others have shared good information which brings to light how different areas and conditions may need to be handled for continued success.

Coyotes are still coyotes, however the conditions under which they are exposed on a regular basis may be vastly different from what we are working with locally. Coyotes are remarkably adaptive animals and they will continue to evolve along the way. We have to do the same if we are to have continued success.

At some point we all will have to learn to live beyond the Dirt Hole when circumstances reveal that is what is needed. If not, I guess as some would say, they are leaving seed for the next year.



Thanks for your input Mr. Jameson.

"Well said" would be an understatement.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7575617
05/03/22 06:12 AM
05/03/22 06:12 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline OP
trapper
TEJAS  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
South Texas Brush Country

Folks need to keep in mind that the dynamics of the line are ever- changing.

What is happening at a particular location in week one will not remotely be the same a month later.

The most savvy and effective trappers pick up on even the slightest changes and adjust accordingly.

I believe a lot of trappers go on auto pilot and do the same thing over and over again with little thought put into what they or the coyotes are doing on their line.

Part of my objective is to challenge folks to think outside the box a little more in all aspects of coyote trapping.

When you limit your options you reduce your effectiveness.

In many cases small changes can make a big difference.

When you are on the line class is in session. Pay attention in class.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7575701
05/03/22 07:50 AM
05/03/22 07:50 AM
Joined: Dec 2017
Central Texas
C
Centex Trapper Offline
trapper
Centex Trapper  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2017
Central Texas
Right on. This forum is a great source for information, tactics. But it really shines in making me think about my trap line and animals.

My advice to anyone on this forum is to take what you like and apply it to your area, and leave the rest. There are no absolutes in trapping.

There is a little bit of arguing, back and forth. There are a few sore-heads. But most are generous with their experiences and information. Those are the ones to listen to. Thank you trappers. You know who you are.

The smart trappers will use ANY and EVERY trick they find. I have learned so much on this thread in particular.


Bridges Predator Control
Serving Central Texas
Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7575802
05/03/22 10:32 AM
05/03/22 10:32 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Northern Illinois
M
MChewk Offline
trapper
MChewk  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Northern Illinois
Good advice Centex.

Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7576360
05/04/22 07:23 AM
05/04/22 07:23 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Southern Michigan
T
trappergbus Offline
trapper
trappergbus  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Apr 2012
Southern Michigan
The big producers go to where there's lots of coyotes, so the greed factor is epic. If you trap where the populations are lower variation in set types and attractors pays off big time. Besides that, I get bored doing the same thing over and over. For myself every set is a work of art that we create to fool the coyote, no two are alike. Your imagination is the only limit. Ounce you learn the animal it all makes sense. With less coyotes and less permission to trap on you have to squeeze the lemon. I trap for fur with a control trappers' attitude. I've studied the coyote since the first arrived here, still a ton to learn. That's the magic!


Common sense catches alot of fur..
Pay homage to all you harvest..
Re: COYOTE CARNAGE – SOUTH TEXAS BRUSH COUNTRY [Re: TEJAS] #7576465
05/04/22 09:53 AM
05/04/22 09:53 AM
Joined: Dec 2014
E central Il
G
Golf ball Offline
trapper
Golf ball  Offline
trapper
G

Joined: Dec 2014
E central Il
I think your 100 percent correct, when it comes to coyotes you never quite learn it all as they are probably the smartest predator we face. When it comes to trapping I never put all my eggs in one basket. I never use just dp’s when dealing with coon , 160’s in trails , 220’s in boxes and even a 1.5 in a trail or a pocket. With beaver in my area that is made up of a network of creeks and drainage ditches, it seems like they show up educated. If you go at them with one type of trap or set construction you will find yourself humbled very quickly. I use 2 types of sets for coyotes unless you count all the variations then it would seem more like 5 or 6 lol.
All of that being said I use a lot of different flat sets and 3 types of dirt holes . Yet my dirt holes seem to out perform all others . Yes I have confidence in the dirt holes but I can’t help but think it’s more than just confidence. If so many of you think the flat set is far superior to the dirt hole then maybe I need to work harder on perfecting the flat set. Maybe I’m a little off in my trap placement or maybe it’s the urine or lure placement. The other side of the coin would be that you folks that are not having any luck with dirt holes are doing something wrong , lol I’m not trying to pick a fight here and I mean that. I would love to be more productive but I can’t catch more coyotes than what my area will produce . Last year I was out of coyotes by Christmas, I can’t catch what’s not there. I’ve been at this for over 50 years and over 30 years of it has been geared toward coyotes. I still get asked to trap a few beaver and coon every year . And it should be stated that I don’t keep notes, that being said it’s pretty easy to remember that I set 3 traps at each location at the beginning of season . One flat set , one dirt hole and maybe a different dirt hole or a toy ( pipe ) set and yet it’s pretty easy to say two thirds of my catches come from dirt hole sets while maybe 20 percent come from a pipe set. I should point out that the pipe accounts for close to 20 percent of my catch it is only about 50 percent on the first approach by a coyote.
Have I had coyotes approach dirt holes without a catch the first time ? Yes but it’s probably less than 10 percent of the time , it is almost 100 percent affective when it’s a double dirt hole. I’m not trying to brag about my double dirt hole I’m trying to figure out why one third of my sets are flat sets but they don’t account for one third of my catch ?

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