X2

If this is a difficult answer for many Americans we now will quit due to pain feeling our pain is a bigger deal then someone else's injury or death. Another aspect of that question may be that many of us have know idea how complicated a commitment may be and we either say no from the get go or drop out early.

Bryce

If I understand this right . No one let go of the ladder . It was completely out of yours and your wife's hands . Neither of you had a choice . I can feel your pain ! So I understand what you're trying to say ! How could you let go!

In your case you had made a commitment to each other . There is no commitment in cases of rape or incest. There is no free will involved. Who holds the ladder when it is a 12 year old child that is the victim of incest and is from a dysfunctional family?

in WI when they were making laws they were down to health of mother , rape and incest , now the zellots pushing it hard could have taken a huge win but would't let rape an incest go.

this is why for my example I used a consensual exchange

any way the data of rape and incest abortions was so ridiculously low it was basically not statistically relevant to the question

I only used the death of my daughter to as the experience of holding a 17 week gestation baby in my hand. that affirmation that I was definitely holding a person , well a deceased person.

I don't know if anyone else on here frequents the Survivalistboards.com website but abortion is such a controversial subject the word is not allowed to be used on the site.