Anyone used?

How much to use?

Placement for best breach?

Success vs cost?

I'm already aware of the safety concerns (I've seen the many YT videos....I'm not wanting to blow up refrigerators) and I'm familiar with the federal legalities of transporting it mixed and using it commercially, so no need to post any parental-type concerns.

I would be using it commercially so will pursue federal permit if I decide to use it. Timber Company has advised they approve of its use as we can't get heavy equipment to many of the dams in these backwater swamps.

Sent you a message

Someone was posting the other day about making it yourself cheap. May be worth looking into if you're needing a lot of it.

a friend of mine who fancied them-self a chemist was doing just that and blew themselves up

had to have their intestines put back in

had crab looking hands for a while

a whole bunch of surgeries later looks almost normal again

was mixing it on the tailgate of the truck at the gravel pit

Doubt I'll do that. Will buy the actual Tannerite or another commercially-made brand.

Your friend, the chemist, was messing around with components other than the 2 in Tannerite.

Boss Dobbins is the expert here but if I can share what little I recall from my basic combat engineering you want the force contained and focused as much as possible to maximize effect.

A charge planted inside the dam in a small tight pocket will focus force better than a charge sitting exposed on top of the dam.

Also water is an irresistible force, let it do the work if you can crack the structure holding it back.

Around here, we use 'Car Rollers'

( you might have to be a hillbilly to know what that is )

Was thinking a 4 inch (maybe 6 inch) pvc pipe about 3 feet in length, capped on one end....driven down into dam center. Tannerite mixed and poured into pipe and capped. Leave only a few inches of pipe visibly exposed for target.

Using this method would eliminate me having to dig into a snakey dam to place a container. If I had to do that I just as well go ahead an tater rake a large breach.

With this pipe method I just walk/wade to dam center and tap pipe into dam, fill pipe, cap it, walk many yds away, get behind a large tree, and shoot.

I’ve got a few dams that a customer wants opened. I’ve been looking for the same answers to the questions you asked.

Use another device to "punch" the hole in the dam then push your pipe or other delivery device in that hole The dam is so unpredictable you might need to attempt a couple times to avoid large debri, which may damage your explosive delivery pipe.

True^^^

very possibly but they though they had it close enough
and tannerite was what they were working at making so the warning of trying to make your own you really want to know what your mixing

they were lucky their grandson was there to load them in the bed of the side by side and drive them out of the gravel pit deep in the woods and meet the ambulance at the road

I have sent you a message on it Swamp… when a guy runs out of C4 ya gotta make do. Kidding, I think.
Follow the instructions carefully.

Osky

Never got it...

Resend...

We used pillow packs on the RR.
Cant use explosives anymore.Letting large amounts of water wash downstream all at once is against DFO regulations nowadays.Same with heavy equipment-have to let the water down gradually.
Pillow pack,stumping powder and amex from the mines was used a lot back in the day for all kinds of stuff.
For dams it was tied to the bottom of a long pole and shoved down into the dam base in a reamed out hole.

My cost, plus an extra fee for this service, will be passed along to landowner, so $$ is no real concern.

Get yourself certified and I think you will find that there is a lot better and more economical materials available to get the job done. You will most likely need to upgrade your insurance too.

Not sure how it is in your neck of the swamp but just applying for a permit to use explosives in the county I live in is more expensive that the actual material and labor to do it in many cases. And the rules and regs are anything but straight forward and clear. And if the permit is denied, you lose the application fee.

Have you considered finding someone already certified to sub out that part of the job? Depending on the work load, that may be a viable alternative.

I've had the necessity of a slow water release situation a couple times, especially to save road culverts.

Every situation is different, but most of the beaver problems here a large and immediate breach can be safely done. A lot of my beaver work is to save drowning pine timber.

I haven't checked on the explosives permit due to exactly what you described....permit costs, higher insurance, complex regs, safety concerns, etc.

Plus, I care not to handle higher grade explosives, detonators, etc, ....just not my thing. Cost of Tannerite is not an issue for me as I'd probably use it less that 10 times and customer pays all that.

I know of no one around here to sub that out. A certified explosives guy probably won't like walking/wading/toting that gear into some of the places I go to get to the beavers.

I was certified and used explosive on beaver dams for the state. Started with dynamite (ditching powder) but switched to water gel and det cord because it was safer to transport.

The dynamite was easier to place and did a good job. Poke holes down into the base of the dam on the upstream side and put the sticks a foot apart for as big a hole as you want to blow. Put a cap and fuse in only one stick and the rest would chain react. You do not want to position yourself downstream of the dam because that's where the majority of the heavy stuff will go (amazing how big a rocks you can find in a beaver dam!). You also didn't want to be downwind and inhale the smoke. Nitro headaches are not fun!

Water gel was a lot harder to detonate. You layed it out the same way as dynamite but you had too string all the sticks together with det cord (basically an high explosive cord) to get them to all blow at the same time. You capped and blew the det cord which blew all the sticks of water gel simultaneously. Kind of a pain - but again safer to transport and work with.

Explosive force blows outward from the most dense backing toward the least dense backing - hence more force goes through the dam than the water (water doesn't compress). Taping a bag of saline solution over a charge on a door will cause the explosion to blow through the door.

So the tannerite on the downstream side would be very inefficient. Using enough to get the job done would be pretty dangerous and very loud.

Thanks for the info.....set on upstream side of dam and ignite from upstream side.

I just watched a YT video where 1.5 lbs of Tannerite in a 2" pvc pipe pushed down into dam blew a very large breach all the way down to base of dam.

2lb and 3 lb pipes did just as good a job on larger dams. I was impressed!!

In an area with widespread beaver problems, a trained and certified explosive handler that advertised dam removal could probably do pretty well. Although, bureaucratic BS in some jurisdictions may make it not worth it.

We are trappers bud! kill the beavers and get an excavator to come out. Or some motivation and a shovel!

Your "idea" probably works in Iowa, but you obviously know little about southern US timberlands. Things are a little different here in these large swamps of the deep South than they are in those cornfield drainage ditches.

An excavator can get to some dams here, but not all of em. There is no bottom that will support an excavator in these cypress swamp bogs. I've seen an excavator stuck where water was over knee deep in the cab. Takes a while and bigger equipment to get that out....especially when a road has to be built thru the swamp just to get to it.

The beaver are trapped first, Bud! Then the water needs to be released so the valuable pine timber won't drown or continue to drown. I guess yall don't worry about a few corn stalks drowning.

"Motivation and a shovel".....that's laughable!!!

For sure^^^^

Would likely have a need for the "boom" about 10 or 12 times a year.

I have some beaver work near homes where a big boom is a no-go.

But, I have some work that is more than 20 miles from any residence...just miles and miles of plantation pines and cypress swamps.

Ought to invite a few folks down to see what we deal with.

"Motivation and a shovel".....that's laughable!!![/quote]

I've ripped thousands out by hand for years right down to natural flow.Some big ones too.
Still do but its a little harder when your older.
Ripped out 7 the other day finishing off a contract.

Anyone ever use Kinepak. A 2 part explosive so it is very safe to transport.

It would be interesting to have someone from “up there” come down and see the gators and cottonmouths, and even experience the humidity and gnats.

If you're looking to do this as part of your job on going, I'd advise you to get ATF certified. You will need storage bunkers for the explosives with regulations on distance, security, etc. David Denton, varmintshooter on here, did that. He's the trapper who took over my timber company contract. He does a great job blowing dams using such binary explosive charges as dam busters or other such charges. http://www.omniexplosives.com/Land%20Mgmt.html

This timber company required insurance that covered using explosives. They were strict about this.

David is home now recuperating from a surgery, so you may be able to get up with him. I'll PM his phone number to you if you want it.

Not to mention the sweat and physical discomfort from all day in saturated drawers.

Those are childsplay compared to blackflies,horseflys,mosquitos,and noseeums.And bears if you dont haul out the dead beaver.

im from "up here" in minnesota, and ive spent alot of time in the mississippi swamps over the years. blew some dams down there with a buddy who used kinepak. used to buy it at the local coop by the case, before the 9-11 fiasco. now its pretty highly restricted, and more requirements needed to get it. it was very stable, and worked well with a 3 minute fuse and det cord. swamp wolf describes the southern swamps very well. no comparison to north country.

LOL, we've got the yeller flies, mosquitos, cotton mouths, copper heads, heat, humidity, south of me are gators and we got BIG BLACK BEARS (some go over 800 pounds) and they love beavers in traps.

Boco says,
I've ripped thousands out by hand for years right down to natural flow.Some big ones too.
Still do but its a little harder when your older.
Ripped out 7 the other day finishing off a contract.
[/quote]




Many/most dams in these swamps have large trees and shrubs growing along their length complete with live roots from those trees/shrubs. If the dams were all mud, logs, and sticks that the beaver placed there then my 58 year old butt could tater rake em down until the rushing current took over. This is just not the case with most dams where I get a call to trap. Most places the beavers and the dams have been there too long.

Pretty sure Swamp has those on his side of the State as well. But what you don’t have is gators. What’s strange is our horsefly’s over here don’t bite. Noseeums drown when they land on you, but the skeeters and yellow flys will light you up. I’ve even gone to wearing pants again. My legs were getting tore up in shorts.

It's downright steamy in these deep south beaver swamp in the summer.....jungle-like.

Thanks for info Paul.

At this point I dont have enough need for explosives to go thru permitting (except I am gonna check on the tannerite legalities for commercial purposes). The timber company here are the ones that suggested I use Tannerite. Says they "approve" it on their lands. Sorta surprised me when the topic came up.

Just curious, is removing the dam part of your agreement?

Paul mentioned one fella here and I know two other trappers in NC (independent wildlife control agents) that have licenses to do explosives. They all get calls from other trappers who have potential jobs. And there are probably others that are USDA Wildlife Services employees. And you might not have the bureaucratic permit process in your location that we have in more populated areas. But in spite of the permit process cost, there are still situations where blowing them is the best option. And since you do not know anyone offering this service, it might be a good niche for you to fill.

I've never done any boom type removals. Been lucky I guess.
I have wondered about one of the portable winches with grapple though.

QBD,
I'm not sure I want to mess around with det cord, caps, electrial charges, etc.

I don't mind mixing 2 mostly safe ingredients and pouring in a pvc pipe pushed into the mud...then shooting with a .243 from 100 yds plus away...lol

If I can even see 100 yds in that particular swamp...

I ripped lots of those kind of dams swamp.I have a chainsaw with a 3 foot bar for the stick dams and rooted junk.
The stickdams are impossible to rip out here when it freezes in the fall,that is when the chainsaw with the long bar really helps.

Tannerite works real good. I poked a 2 holes in the dam big enough to get the cans in. As with some things to do with beaver, the deeper the better. I wrapped some primer cord around a tree and each can then shoved them in the holes I made. If you shoot the primer cord wrapped around the tree it will set off the tannerite. Make sure you use a good solid tree and a rifle with enough ft/lbs of energy for the primer cord. Once the dam is opened up prepare to spend the night shift shooting beavers as they will have it rebuilt in no time.

Sounds like a job for Hals buddies Grump and Restor !

I'd have to hire help to cut open a beaver dam with a chainsaw. I must not be as physically fit as you...lol

Most times I have em caught b4 water is released. Sometimes that dramatic water drop will reveal one I missed.

Oh ok. I was packing a bag to come give you a hand but talk of the critters that want to kill you down there made decide that I'd much rather deal with the grizzly bears here. Good luck and in my experience you don't have to be 100 yds away. I'm trying to remember what size of cans we used but they didn't seem very big. Maybe 1/2 lb.

The heat-humidity here is the biggest concern and annoyance here when trapping beavers this time of year and then only on set and pull days. Had to go back to truck one day last week and sit in AC for about 30 min to cool off. Heat index was 110F....was over 100F index at 0900 hrs.

Gators move out of the way and don't return while you're there. Cottonmouths dont move out of way but the key is seeing them b4 you get too close......move slowly and look closely b4 reaching or squatting down. Skeeter, deer flies, etc...just a common nuisance.

Yep you can have it. Snakes scare the bejesus out of me and 3 days of 110 F (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) near killed me last summer. No thanks.

Beavering in the heat isn't a problem. I can at least get in the water.

Coyotes in the heat is a real pia. The way I sweat kneeling to make a set I might as well go roll in the mud. I'm seriously considering ground cloth or possibly split leg apron to try keep myself presentable.

Around here we use to use fertilizer, Diesel and a charge.

The explosives are the same. Just substitute fuel oil for the aluminum powder and use a detonator. You have to place the explosive on or near the bottom of the dam. Otherwise the energy just goes up if placed on top. This makes the Tannerite impossible to use because you can’t actually get a bullet into the tannerite to set it off. Our local USDA trapper and dam blower told me that usually one pound will work for the average dam if the bottom is hard enough. Had to use 6 pounds for my farms because we essentially have no bottom around here.

Had several big time farmers over the years tell me that back in the day they used a pound of black powder, in a one liter plastic bottle, taped up tight, with a water proof fuse drilled through the bottle cap positioned at the base of a beaver dam and it worked fine. Too many houses now for something like that to take place. But if you are in the swamps or back in the boonies it just might work for you. Hope that helps someone.

I've ripped thousands out by hand for years right down to natural flow.Some big ones too.
Still do but its a little harder when your older.
Ripped out 7 the other day finishing off a contract.
[/quote]
The OP did not ask what size rake to use, What license he needs, He asked for advise on Tannerite.

From the great info gathered here from this thread, some PMs, and my short internet research...

A) 2" pvc pipe about 24" to 30" long. This amount will blow an impressive breach in most dams.
B) Cap pipe on one end.
C) Mix Tannerite on scene and fill pipe.
D) Cap pipe.
E) Shove or insert into upstream side of dam, leaving enough of pipe visible that you can hit from about + or - 100 yds away. Best to angle pipe into dam to create lift of debris towards downstream side. Water pressure will assist after discharge. Debris/mud in dam will create less blast resistance than the water will, hence blast will direct more in that direction.
F) Shoot from upstream side if possible as blowout will be more towards downstream side of dam due to the water pressure.
G) Use rifle caliber that delivers minimum 2000 fps. A .243 is good.
H) Use ear plugs and stay behind a large tree if possible.
I) You will need a manufacturer's license from ATF if you mix off site and travel on public roads with mixed binary ingredients, including Tannerite-type stuff. The manufacturer's license is also needed to use the binary mixes for commercial purposes, ie charging landowner to blow dams. This license is $200 initially and then $100 with every 3-years renewal.
J) State and local permits may be needed.
K) Tannerite brand is the better quality binary mix that is currently available.....it's a bit more powerful.
L) Always think safety. Dont get complacent. Always be mindful of the "shrapnel effect of the sticks and logs.

Thanks for all the great info!

I.posted what I've learned to help others that may need to use this stuff in a limited amount when other options are not available...and does not need to become a fully licensed explosives guy.

Can't bring myself to cool off in this....


but you are correct about coyote trapping in the heat!

With waders I'm going in. My lower half might get a couple degrees cooler.

But I got the advantage on you. Most of my water is flowing or spring sourced. Some of those swamps just sit and stew.

Just saw your question....

No...not part of agreement, but I have landowners that have asked and are willing to pay for the extra assistance.

A local timber company wants me to breach them, if I can, but it's not part of our beaver removal agreement. If I can do this safely...and legally, then I will be a more valuable asset to them.

Don't know about down there but up here it is better to do and ask for forgiveness after. Atheist this way it gets done.

Here it is mutual agreement on the contract.If both the client and trapper agree to the trapper returning the impoundment to natural flow there is a fee.
Every client except Ontario Power Generation will let the trapper remove the dam,and unless it is an unsafe situation to the trapper,like inside a long small culvert only accessable from the low side,most trappers will do the dam removal.
OPG had problems with their union for contracting out the dam removal.
So when I issue the contract I make sure they dont mess with the dam until the trapping is completed.