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Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: MJM] #7819064
03/12/23 01:17 PM
03/12/23 01:17 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,831
WI
T-Rex Offline OP
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T-Rex  Offline OP
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WI
Originally Posted by MJM
rb seems to think a Browning 10ga is the way to go. If I lived some where I thought I needed a back of to a gun, I would bge moving. Why live in a place that you thing you need to carry two guns to do your job. Does your work allow you to carry? Do they give you firearms training. The entire thing sound nuts to me.

I carry 24/7. Most situations involve little to absolutely no risk. Even if (when) I move, my job will occasionally put me in potentially dangerous spots. That's just the way I'm wired. I need a lot of variety in my life.

Does my work allow? Danged if I know, or care. I never asked and have never been told. I am a contractor, so no employee handbook. There ain't nobody but me to cover my back.


Man who mistake shillelagh for fairy wand; see pixie dust, also.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819077
03/12/23 01:39 PM
03/12/23 01:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,831
WI
T-Rex Offline OP
trapper
T-Rex  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,831
WI
So, if I'm buying a new gun anyway:

There are a couple caliber extremes that I am now considering.
  • As long as it is just going to sit in a loose pocket and any gun is better than no gun...Why not a tiny flat .22WMR?
  • In the spring and fall, I have lately been plagued with a couple black bears. NAA used to make a Derringer with an interchangeable 45 70 government barrel. The peace of mind just might be worth a potentially broken wrist.


Man who mistake shillelagh for fairy wand; see pixie dust, also.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819088
03/12/23 01:52 PM
03/12/23 01:52 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,831
WI
T-Rex Offline OP
trapper
T-Rex  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,831
WI
BTW. Bond Arms, that has been recommended by YT30, and ADC also makes a model called Back Up that comes in .45ACP. Most of those Bond Arms derringers have interchangeable barrels of several calibers. That makes the decision a bit easier.


Man who mistake shillelagh for fairy wand; see pixie dust, also.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819114
03/12/23 02:26 PM
03/12/23 02:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 16,150
Tennessee
Scuba1 Offline
"color blind Kraut"
Scuba1  Offline
"color blind Kraut"

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 16,150
Tennessee
IMHO those 45-70 derringers are not much more than a gimmick as you just don't have the barrel length to get the necessary velocity to those heavy slogs. You'll have one heck of a muzzle flash though. Not that that fireball will do you or any else any good. In a small pistol like that they 45APC is more than enough cartridge. The upside to that is that you use that round in your primary sidearm as well.


Let's go Brandon

"Shall not comply" with morons who don't understand "shall not infringe."
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819139
03/12/23 02:45 PM
03/12/23 02:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 14,119
Ky
J
jbyrd63 Offline
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jbyrd63  Offline
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J

Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 14,119
Ky
yea large caliber derringers hurt. My turd head brother in law bought a 44mag derringer and ask me to shoot it. Immediately I knew it was a mistake. Took about a week for the swelling to go down in my right thumb .

Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819165
03/12/23 03:15 PM
03/12/23 03:15 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,534
Green County Wisconsin
G
GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
trapper
GREENCOUNTYPETE  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,534
Green County Wisconsin
Originally Posted by T-Rex
Why?
Deliveriing medications after dark in sketchy, and worse neighborhoods Primary needs to be concealed, and sometimes difficult to access with winter clothes and hands full.

I do sometimes carry a .38 spcl. J Frame. I like it, but, would feel better with a little better penetration through winter clothing, and as few moving parts as possible.

I appreciate all the good suggestions so far.


a new big caliper low capacity gun might not be the answer.
we see many cases where he who has the most capacity wins in one example the cop and criminal were carrying the same gun and driving the same car , they dance around the cars shooting at each other , the cop with the reload wins this is slightly different than a citizen shooting but maybe not that much if they are committed to getting what you have.

a 45acp is .452 a 9mm is .355 .452-.355=.097" .097/2=.0485"

the question is at what point does 0.0485 inches make a bad shot a good shot? VS when does an extra round or two make a difference?

procedure and positioning like looking for a way to pocket carry in vest , jacket , ect a concealed sub compact 9mm with a compact light it could be without the light if you don't think light is an issue.

then at the same time figuring out better ways to keep your hands free or more free like a bag to hold the product.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819269
03/12/23 05:41 PM
03/12/23 05:41 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,303
B61-12 vicinity, MO
T
TreedaBlackdog Offline
trapper
TreedaBlackdog  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,303
B61-12 vicinity, MO
I always liked the idea of the keltec pm30 for a carry gun. Figure with 30 shots of .22mag - something got to give.

Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819270
03/12/23 05:44 PM
03/12/23 05:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,303
B61-12 vicinity, MO
T
TreedaBlackdog Offline
trapper
TreedaBlackdog  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,303
B61-12 vicinity, MO
I have shot the FN 5.7 also - it is extremely nice and comfortable.

Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819316
03/12/23 06:38 PM
03/12/23 06:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,964
Pillager, Minnesota
P
patfundine Offline
trapper
patfundine  Offline
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P

Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,964
Pillager, Minnesota
Originally Posted by T-Rex
Why?
Deliveriing medications after dark in sketchy, and worse neighborhoods Primary needs to be concealed, and sometimes difficult to access with winter clothes and hands full.

I do sometimes carry a .38 spcl. J Frame. I like it, but, would feel better with a little better penetration through winter clothing, and as few moving parts as possible.

I appreciate all the good suggestions so far.



Carhart coats have big pockets. Carry a revolver in the pocket.

Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819347
03/12/23 07:17 PM
03/12/23 07:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 521
Southeast KY
K
K91773 Offline
trapper
K91773  Offline
trapper
K

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 521
Southeast KY
I used to carry a Glock 27 as a secondary firearm they are surprisingly easy to shoot and accurate for a handgun that size in 40 S&W it is also extremely reliable. Obviously, since it is a Glock a rigid holster is required but several companies make a "holster" that covers the trigger area with a cord that attaches inside the pocket to pull the cover off as you draw the handgun.

Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: TreedaBlackdog] #7819371
03/12/23 07:52 PM
03/12/23 07:52 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,534
Green County Wisconsin
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
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GREENCOUNTYPETE  Offline
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G

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,534
Green County Wisconsin
Originally Posted by TreedaBlackdog
I always liked the idea of the keltec pm30 for a carry gun. Figure with 30 shots of .22mag - something got to give.
they are rather large almost identical in size to a Glock 17 a touch taller and a 1/4 inch less in length.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819384
03/12/23 08:01 PM
03/12/23 08:01 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,534
Green County Wisconsin
G
GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
trapper
GREENCOUNTYPETE  Offline
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G

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,534
Green County Wisconsin
https://alabamaholster.com/product-category/pocket-holsters/
they used to make them to your shape if you ordered it, I think you sent a cardboard cut out of the shape , not sure they still do
this is how I pocket carry a LC9 my first holster cracked at about 10 years I liked it so I ordered another to replace it


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: TreedaBlackdog] #7819397
03/12/23 08:28 PM
03/12/23 08:28 PM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 17,200
Iowa
~ADC~ Online content
The Count
~ADC~  Online Content
The Count

Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 17,200
Iowa
Originally Posted by TreedaBlackdog
I always liked the idea of the keltec pm30 for a carry gun. Figure with 30 shots of .22mag - something got to give.


Technically 31 shots. https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/64077/kel-tec+cnc+pmr-30+30+1+.22+mag+4.3 price doesnt seem too bad all things considered. It's my long list of guns I'd like to have someday.

Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: GREENCOUNTYPETE] #7819443
03/12/23 09:35 PM
03/12/23 09:35 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,831
WI
T-Rex Offline OP
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T-Rex  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,831
WI
Originally Posted by GREENCOUNTYPETE
a new big caliper low capacity gun might not be the answer.
we see many cases where he who has the most capacity wins in one example the cop and criminal were carrying the same gun and driving the same car , they dance around the cars shooting at each other , the cop with the reload wins this is slightly different than a citizen shooting but maybe not that much if they are committed to getting what you have.

a 45acp is .452 a 9mm is .355 .452-.355=.097" .097/2=.0485"

the question is at what point does 0.0485 inches make a bad shot a good shot? VS when does an extra round or two make a difference?

procedure and positioning like looking for a way to pocket carry in vest , jacket , ect a concealed sub compact 9mm with a compact light it could be without the light if you don't think light is an issue.

then at the same time figuring out better ways to keep your hands free or more free like a bag to hold the product.


A whole bunch of numbers and made up scenario does not apply.

I just need something in my hand to buy enough time to grab my primary.

Maybe at this point I should mention: When the SHTF,
  • everything in my hands is now on the ground
  • My weak hand is on this new undefined thing
  • my strong hand has ripped open a little Velcro® and on primary.
  • If weak hand solves the problem; end of story
  • It not, well, we are back to original scenario


Man who mistake shillelagh for fairy wand; see pixie dust, also.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819456
03/12/23 09:47 PM
03/12/23 09:47 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,763
Arkansas
W
Wallace Offline
trapper
Wallace  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,763
Arkansas
That .380 makes a pretty good back up gun. But it sounds like you need the little gun for primary defense with the high capacity gun for back up. Most if not nearly all self defense shootings are over in 2 shots or less.
I'd get a double stack 9mm for that strong hand pocket if that's where you are going to first.Glock 43 or 43x might work.

Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819467
03/12/23 09:56 PM
03/12/23 09:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 3,155
Michigan
D
Ditchdiver Offline
trapper
Ditchdiver  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 3,155
Michigan
Check out Bond Arms derringers. Many calibers to choose from and you can buy multiple different caliber barrels that interchange so you have multiple choices.


When life gets me down..... you know hunting/trapping season is closed.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: Wallace] #7819468
03/12/23 09:59 PM
03/12/23 09:59 PM
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,283
East of the Mason-Dixon Line
DelawareRob Offline
trapper
DelawareRob  Offline
trapper

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,283
East of the Mason-Dixon Line
Originally Posted by Wallace
That .380 makes a pretty good back up gun. But it sounds like you need the little gun for primary defense with the high capacity gun for back up. Most if not nearly all self defense shootings are over in 2 shots or less.
I'd get a double stack 9mm for that strong hand pocket if that's where you are going to first.Glock 43 or 43x might work.

Yup


Be a mentor

You don't rise to the occasion, you fall to the level of your training.

Semper Paratus
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819486
03/12/23 11:13 PM
03/12/23 11:13 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,380
Mt.
g smith Offline
trapper
g smith  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,380
Mt.
John Wayne shot the holdup man with his derringer then he said "you should got into another line of work "


You can ride a fast horse slow but you can't ride a slow horse fast .
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819568
03/13/23 06:51 AM
03/13/23 06:51 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 3,611
SD
Boone Liane Offline
trapper
Boone Liane  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 3,611
SD
As I see it, you have a pretty decent back up.

But maybe need to be evaluating in what, and where you’re putting your primary that you feel the need to go for the “back up” first.

If you reach for the little gun first, it’s not the back up.

Last edited by Boone Liane; 03/13/23 06:53 AM.
Re: B.U.G. (back up gun) [Re: T-Rex] #7819577
03/13/23 07:11 AM
03/13/23 07:11 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 3,991
Wisconsin
E
Eagleye Offline
trapper
Eagleye  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 3,991
Wisconsin
Did you check out the Judge Public Defender? I thought it had a more compact frame size than my standard Judge.

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