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Attention NTA Member #7986833
11/04/23 07:25 PM
11/04/23 07:25 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Proposed Bylaws Amendment Ė Your Vote Matters

On page 32 of the November/December issue of the American Trapper, currently hitting mailboxes, there is a ballot for a Proposed Bylaws Amendment. This proposed change concerns the eligibility criteria for the position of NTA President and has raised several important concerns.

The amendment, if adopted, will prohibit anyone who has not previously served on the NTA Executive Council from running for President of the NTA. The rationale given suggests that effective leadership requires institutional knowledge, and to ensure that the Chief Executive Officer of the association has a thorough understanding of the organization.

I have served on the Executive Council since 2000, including six years as NTA President. The suggestion that a newly elected president needs a thorough understanding of the day-to-day operations is simply not true. We have a full-time paid office manager and staff that handle this. In addition, we have paid contractors, including our legal counsel, DNIA, and editor. There are also the six other members of the Executive Council and the entire Board of Directors.

What an effective president does need is an inspiring vision, excellent communication and leadership skills, as well as honesty, integrity, transparency, accountability, and undying dedication.

This proposal is ill-conceived and poorly thought through. Other than the seven current members of the Executive Council, I can think of only twelve individuals, including myself, who would be eligible to run for President. Of those twelve, I don't know a single individual who is interested. They have all done their time. Only four are still on the Board of Directors, and fully half are no longer active in the NTA.

On the flip side, excellent leaders at the state level would be prohibited from running. These are some of our best trapping leaders, doing an excellent job representing and defending trapping at the state level where all the hard work is done. Why would any organization limit the pool of prospective leaders, especially in a small organization like the NTA? Instead, we should aim to expand it. There is no downside to recruiting as many potential leaders as possible. Any member with an interest should be allowed to throw their hat in the ring, lay out their qualifications, vision and ideas and then let the membership choose. Iím puzzled as to how anyone would think that is a bad thing. There is real value in having someone outside the "status quo," without a "that's the way we've always done it" mindset.

The practical result of this change will ensure that anyone on the Executive Council planning to run at the end of the current president's term will run unopposed. This is not the way to get the most qualified applicant. It also prevents members from reviewing various qualifications to choose the best candidate. This proposal will discourage fresh, new, unbiased ideas and perspectives. Instead, we will continue with the same tired progression: State Director to Executive Council to officer to president. This ensures that the "new" president has been groomed into the same old same old.

Perhaps even worse, if adopted, this proposal will create the very real possibility that no one will seek the office. What if none of the small handful of eligible individuals wants to be president? Do we really want our association to be led by someone who doesn't want the job?

This amendment is contrary to the very ideals of our democracy: that we, the people, get to choose our leaders. Our Constitution requires no prior experience to run for public office, even President of the United States. Our founding fathers rejected the idea of career "King" politicians. They recognized the dangers of such a system and trusted the people to determine the most qualified candidate. I trust the NTA membership to do likewise.

The membership alone should determine who leads the NTA, not the Executive Council, the Board of Directors, or some short-sighted bylaw amendment. Under this proposal, men with as much history, respect, knowledge, and experience as Tom Krause would be prohibited from running for President of the NTA if he so desired. Is that the direction we wish to go?

Your involvement is critical in deciding the future direction of our organization. I urge you to participate in the decision-making process.

I'm asking you to help protect the power of the membership. Vote NO on the proposed Bylaw Amendment.

**You will NOT receive a ballot in the mail. YOU MUST cut the actual ballot page from the magazine and mail it into the NTA office for your vote to be counted. Photocopies of the ballot page WILL NOT be counted. **

Ballots must be postmarked by Dec.15


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986838
11/04/23 07:33 PM
11/04/23 07:33 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 3,005
PA
M
marathonman Offline
trapper
marathonman  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 3,005
PA
Thank you for an excellent explanation! Agreed !!

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: marathonman] #7986841
11/04/23 07:36 PM
11/04/23 07:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,221
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline
trapper
bblwi  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,221
East-Central Wisconsin
Thank you Chris. Helpful as well as coming from a first hand knowledgeable base.

Bryce

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986856
11/04/23 07:45 PM
11/04/23 07:45 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,505
NC, Orange Co.
QuietButDeadly Offline
trapper
QuietButDeadly  Offline
trapper

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,505
NC, Orange Co.
Thank you for the detailed explanation.


Life Member: NCTA, VTA, NTA, TTFHA, MFTI
Member: FTA NRA NWTF
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986867
11/04/23 07:57 PM
11/04/23 07:57 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32
Pierre,South Dakota
S
sdtrapn Offline
trapper
sdtrapn  Offline
trapper
S

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32
Pierre,South Dakota
Thank you, Chris. For letting the membership know this detailed information and to help to understand what is needed.


Support Your State Trapping Association
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986899
11/04/23 08:27 PM
11/04/23 08:27 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17,403
Wheaton Ks
L
lee steinmeyer Offline
trapper
lee steinmeyer  Offline
trapper
L

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17,403
Wheaton Ks
Good read, Chris. I couldnít agree more. Seems like ďcancel cultureĒ is alive and well in all parts of this country anymore!


YOU CAN IGNORE REALITY, BUT YOU CANNOT IGNORE THE CONSEQUENCES OF IGNORING REALITY.

http://www.lptraplinesupply.com
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986911
11/04/23 08:36 PM
11/04/23 08:36 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 288
NY
T
trappermac NY Offline
trapper
trappermac NY  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 288
NY
Thanks Chris for a detailed explanation. I agree with the vote NO.


Member NYSTA, NTA, FBU, ECTA
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986931
11/04/23 08:58 PM
11/04/23 08:58 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Jtrapper Offline
trapper
Jtrapper  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Does anyone even care anymore what NTA does? Example after example has been given by many who jumped in drove all over the country, spent money, wore out their vehicles and never asked for anything even remotely as close to a pat on the back for their dedication, all they wanted was to ensure trappers had quality representation in the fight to save our rights. And when you disagreed with those in leadership suddenly you were the enemy of the state, most like me just moved on to something else and left them to their own little obscure world where they think they are doing the Lords work. But recently that hasn't been good enough, those who oppose them must be ran out of the place forever, even someone that actually did attempt to run for President to change the direction things were going.

After all that why would ANYONE in their right mind even want to run for office or be a member of such a place for that matter? Me and you both know who is running things behind the scene's so it doesn't really matter anymore who their King is anymore.

As corrupt as the place has been for so many decades it's even mind boggling to me things have reached this level. Best tread lightly, you'll be the next one being tossed out of the place, lol.


Not my circus, not my clowns.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986935
11/04/23 09:06 PM
11/04/23 09:06 PM
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 1,561
Iowa
C
CTRAPS Offline
trapper
CTRAPS  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 1,561
Iowa
Chris, I appreciate you providing this clarification. I have heard for as long as I can remember that unity is key and that there is safety in numbers. But when a measure like this is introduced, I start to question whether we are really working together or if we are still on the same team. Additionally, it appears to me that as our membership base is declining, so is our sense of security.

Participation in the NTA has to be accomplished in a better method. Perhaps the first step could involve focusing more on keeping members rather than alienating them, banishing some, or placing others on probation or "adult time-out."

You asked; "Why would any organization limit the pool of prospective leaders, especially in a small organization like the NTA?"

It really makes one wonder doesn't it?


Life Member: ITA, IBA & NRA. Member of FTA & NTA
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986948
11/04/23 09:32 PM
11/04/23 09:32 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Yes Jackie, some do still care. We all know your position, we've heard it 1000 times.

CTraps, valid points, but they have nothing to do with the subject of this thread. And if you think I had anything to do with those actions you are very mistaken.

The point of this thread is to educate members to the awful ramifications of this bylaws proposal and to encourage them to vote against it. If you fellows want to discuss what you see as the NTA's shortcomings please start your own thread instead of hijacking this one. Thank you.


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986952
11/04/23 09:46 PM
11/04/23 09:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,793
Beaman Iowa 55
M
Mike Cope Offline
trapper
Mike Cope  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,793
Beaman Iowa 55
Chris,
Thanks for the Heads up and the explanation.

I agree with the points that you make.

Membership Do your research and send in your ballots.

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7986989
11/04/23 11:52 PM
11/04/23 11:52 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Drifter Offline
trapper
Drifter  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Thanks for the prod to wake the folks up. Hope you don't become a victim of the kangaroo court.


Some individuals use statistics as a drunk man uses lamp-posts ó for support rather than for illumination.

Andrew Lang (1844-1912) Scottish poet, novelist and literary critic









Life member NTA , and GA Trappers assoc .
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7987226
11/05/23 09:58 AM
11/05/23 09:58 AM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,451
Kentucky
ky_coyote_hunter Offline
trapper
ky_coyote_hunter  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 3,451
Kentucky
Consolidation of power, a proven tactic of corrupt leadership.


Member - FTA
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7987318
11/05/23 12:08 PM
11/05/23 12:08 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,656
Sumner, Mo.
C
claycreech Offline
trapper
claycreech  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,656
Sumner, Mo.
Agreed Chris.
Excellent explanation of a ridiculous bylaw change proposal.
I canít imagine any member voting for this. So stupid.
Even if youíre upset with the NTA, vote.

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988278
11/06/23 09:56 PM
11/06/23 09:56 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
C
Cindy Offline
trapper
Cindy  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
Chris,
Couple questions on this, I donít read the magazine from front to back as I used to. So had I not just read this post I would not even had known there was something like this up for vote.
So I appreciate the information I just read.

Here is my first question why is this amendment to vote not being sent out to members?
My thinking here would be that people not aware then wonít have a vote even counted, leaving this bylaw to possibly pass by those that have an interest in getting this passed.

Iím sure there has been ďhouse cleaningĒ votes placed in the magazine before but feel this has a little more meat than a house cleaning issue.

My next question is, as stated no photo copiesÖÖ.
George and I are both lifetime members and I have the second publication to magazine cancelled so to speak, so I only will receive one ballot.
Will lifetime members that chose to save NTA monies (many moons ago ) and wonít receive ballot in magazine have one mailed to them?

I understand this is prob a question for office but posted it here anyways so anyone that might be in the same position as stated above donít miss the opportunity to vote on this ďhair brainedĒ
Bylaw change !
Thanks


Happy Trails
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988293
11/06/23 10:29 PM
11/06/23 10:29 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Hi Cindy,

How have you been? I hope both you and George are doing well.

Bylaw amendments have always been sent as a part of the magazine. Only election of officers ballots are mailed out to the membership. You are correct in that we historically get very few magazines ballots returned. I'm unsure if its because people don't like to cut up their magazines or perhaps they feel these "house keeping" votes are unimportant? Thus the reason for my post. This is FAR from a routine issue. This proposal is so detrimental to the future of the NTA that it has to be defeated. I'm hopeful that making people aware will motivate them to cut out the page and send it in with a NO vote.

You are not alone... we have numerous LT members who don't receive a magazine. Its my understanding that they will be mailed a ballot.

If anyone else has questions feel free to holler out.

Good to hear from you Cindy, don't be a stranger. smile


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988299
11/06/23 10:41 PM
11/06/23 10:41 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
C
Cindy Offline
trapper
Cindy  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
We are doing great Chris thanks for asking ! Life pretty hectic with the Cat and all the events we have but I have had a lot more time on my hands to do things than I had in past so thatís a good thing !
You get out west ya need to drop in!

I see Kieshaís posts and see you got a lot of good grandpa things going on ! Lol
Looks like you gotta little gal that loves her gpa

Has the magazine went out yet ? When is deadline on voting ? Iíll make sure I keep and eye out !
Thanks for the heads up on this, guaranteed I would have missed it !


Happy Trails
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988303
11/06/23 10:47 PM
11/06/23 10:47 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Yes Indeed! Grandkids are the best!!

I received my magazine today. Deadline is DEC 15 postmark


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988601
11/07/23 12:16 PM
11/07/23 12:16 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 79
Fallon, NV
J
Jim Curran Offline
trapper
Jim Curran  Offline
trapper
J

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 79
Fallon, NV
During my 42 years as the state director to NTA , I am not aware of any bylaw change not passing. I am also opposed to this one as no one should be excluded from running for president. Although, looking back in history all 10 of the past presidents, back to Don Hoyt, have been on the EC before becoming president. I would hope that all TM members take the time to vote and send it in. Normally, there are less than 50 returns.

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988620
11/07/23 12:44 PM
11/07/23 12:44 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
I have confirmed with the office you can simply cut and mail the bottom "Ballot" portion of the page. This will allow you to save the article on the back if you wish.


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988636
11/07/23 01:16 PM
11/07/23 01:16 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,950
Peoria County Illinois
Larry Baer Offline
trapper
Larry Baer  Offline
trapper

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,950
Peoria County Illinois
Thanks for the information. I am a life member of the NTA who does not get the magazine. Is there a provision for a member like me to vote?


Just passin through
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988641
11/07/23 01:32 PM
11/07/23 01:32 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Larry, its my understanding that if you don't receive the magazine, you will be mailed a ballot.


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988645
11/07/23 01:43 PM
11/07/23 01:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Drifter Offline
trapper
Drifter  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
I have my suspicions but got to ask. Where do these by laws changes originate? Sure looks like a power grab.


Some individuals use statistics as a drunk man uses lamp-posts ó for support rather than for illumination.

Andrew Lang (1844-1912) Scottish poet, novelist and literary critic









Life member NTA , and GA Trappers assoc .
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988657
11/07/23 02:05 PM
11/07/23 02:05 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,950
Peoria County Illinois
Larry Baer Offline
trapper
Larry Baer  Offline
trapper

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,950
Peoria County Illinois
Thanks, I got the cash calendar mailer today.
Our Farm Bureau rules are similar but we can elect from any of our directors for any executive office and there are 24 directors.


Just passin through
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988801
11/07/23 05:49 PM
11/07/23 05:49 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Jtrapper Offline
trapper
Jtrapper  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Got my magazine today. As Jim stated it's usually musical chairs up to President anyway so probably not a big deal. Already saw how those on the outside get treated if they dare even toss their hat in the ring so doubt outsider's are going to run anyway.


Not my circus, not my clowns.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7988893
11/07/23 07:40 PM
11/07/23 07:40 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Jackie, it IS a big deal! There is a difference between no one other than EC veterans wanting to run and a rule prohibiting them from doing so


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7989995
11/09/23 04:48 AM
11/09/23 04:48 AM
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 6,967
W NY
Turtledale Offline
trapper
Turtledale  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 6,967
W NY
Got my magazine today and WILL definitely vote

Thanks for the heads up Chris M


NYSTA, NTA, FTA, life member Erie county trappers assn.,life member Catt.county trappers
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7991911
11/11/23 10:58 AM
11/11/23 10:58 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 16,706
West Virginia,age 49
cathryn Offline
bvr-takr-upr
cathryn  Offline
bvr-takr-upr

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 16,706
West Virginia,age 49
Originally Posted by ChrisM
Proposed Bylaws Amendment Ė Your Vote Matters

On page 32 of the November/December issue of the American Trapper, currently hitting mailboxes, there is a ballot for a Proposed Bylaws Amendment. This proposed change concerns the eligibility criteria for the position of NTA President and has raised several important concerns.

The amendment, if adopted, will prohibit anyone who has not previously served on the NTA Executive Council from running for President of the NTA. The rationale given suggests that effective leadership requires institutional knowledge, and to ensure that the Chief Executive Officer of the association has a thorough understanding of the organization.

I have served on the Executive Council since 2000, including six years as NTA President. The suggestion that a newly elected president needs a thorough understanding of the day-to-day operations is simply not true. We have a full-time paid office manager and staff that handle this. In addition, we have paid contractors, including our legal counsel, DNIA, and editor. There are also the six other members of the Executive Council and the entire Board of Directors.

What an effective president does need is an inspiring vision, excellent communication and leadership skills, as well as honesty, integrity, transparency, accountability, and undying dedication.

This proposal is ill-conceived and poorly thought through. Other than the seven current members of the Executive Council, I can think of only twelve individuals, including myself, who would be eligible to run for President. Of those twelve, I don't know a single individual who is interested. They have all done their time. Only four are still on the Board of Directors, and fully half are no longer active in the NTA.

On the flip side, excellent leaders at the state level would be prohibited from running. These are some of our best trapping leaders, doing an excellent job representing and defending trapping at the state level where all the hard work is done. Why would any organization limit the pool of prospective leaders, especially in a small organization like the NTA? Instead, we should aim to expand it. There is no downside to recruiting as many potential leaders as possible. Any member with an interest should be allowed to throw their hat in the ring, lay out their qualifications, vision and ideas and then let the membership choose. Iím puzzled as to how anyone would think that is a bad thing. There is real value in having someone outside the "status quo," without a "that's the way we've always done it" mindset.

The practical result of this change will ensure that anyone on the Executive Council planning to run at the end of the current president's term will run unopposed. This is not the way to get the most qualified applicant. It also prevents members from reviewing various qualifications to choose the best candidate. This proposal will discourage fresh, new, unbiased ideas and perspectives. Instead, we will continue with the same tired progression: State Director to Executive Council to officer to president. This ensures that the "new" president has been groomed into the same old same old.

Perhaps even worse, if adopted, this proposal will create the very real possibility that no one will seek the office. What if none of the small handful of eligible individuals wants to be president? Do we really want our association to be led by someone who doesn't want the job?

This amendment is contrary to the very ideals of our democracy: that we, the people, get to choose our leaders. Our Constitution requires no prior experience to run for public office, even President of the United States. Our founding fathers rejected the idea of career "King" politicians. They recognized the dangers of such a system and trusted the people to determine the most qualified candidate. I trust the NTA membership to do likewise.

The membership alone should determine who leads the NTA, not the Executive Council, the Board of Directors, or some short-sighted bylaw amendment. Under this proposal, men with as much history, respect, knowledge, and experience as Tom Krause would be prohibited from running for President of the NTA if he so desired. Is that the direction we wish to go?

Your involvement is critical in deciding the future direction of our organization. I urge you to participate in the decision-making process.

I'm asking you to help protect the power of the membership. Vote NO on the proposed Bylaw Amendment.

**You will NOT receive a ballot in the mail. YOU MUST cut the actual ballot page from the magazine and mail it into the NTA office for your vote to be counted. Photocopies of the ballot page WILL NOT be counted. **

Ballots must be postmarked by Dec.15




Thank you for the info.

I feel like it was well thought out by those who are in power and know that there is a shift in control on the horizon and theyrw attempting to keep change from happening , (but definitely not a good idea) out as a way to keep " the old boys club" in charge.

If you look at various state associations they have thw same same mentality.

The bottomline is they do not want progress or change. imo. They want.rhinhs to stay the same,regardless of what the general membership wants.

It has to be defeated or the membership and associations affectability and progression will definitely decline. My .02


IF IDIOTS GREW ON TREES THIS PLACE WOULD BE AN ORCHARD !

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995061
11/15/23 10:00 AM
11/15/23 10:00 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Everyone should have received their magazine by now.

The ballot is on page 32, you can simply cut out the lower "ballot" portion of the page and mail to the address on the ballot. There's an ad on the back side so you wont lose any part of an article.

I realize most are busy trapping but please take a couple minutes to vote.

Vote NO to protect the membership's ability to choose our leadership


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995124
11/15/23 12:38 PM
11/15/23 12:38 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Drifter Offline
trapper
Drifter  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Done and returned. Hope this gets defeated.


Some individuals use statistics as a drunk man uses lamp-posts ó for support rather than for illumination.

Andrew Lang (1844-1912) Scottish poet, novelist and literary critic









Life member NTA , and GA Trappers assoc .
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: Drifter] #7995194
11/15/23 02:40 PM
11/15/23 02:40 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,953
Otsego, MI 66
K
K-zoo Offline
trapper
K-zoo  Offline
trapper
K

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,953
Otsego, MI 66
Voted yesterday.


Member NTA, MTPCA, FTA, NRA, MUCC
2 Cor. 5:17
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995240
11/15/23 03:48 PM
11/15/23 03:48 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Drifter, it will be defeated if the members reading this take the time to vote.

I encourage everyone to copy and past my letter to your FB page


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995266
11/15/23 04:24 PM
11/15/23 04:24 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 16,348
Oakland, MS
yotetrapper30 Offline
trapper
yotetrapper30  Offline
trapper

Joined: May 2011
Posts: 16,348
Oakland, MS
Originally Posted by ChrisM
Drifter, it will be defeated if the members reading this take the time to vote.

I encourage everyone to copy and past my letter to your FB page


Well I can't vote, but I can do that at least.


~~Proud Ultra MAGA~~
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995314
11/15/23 05:26 PM
11/15/23 05:26 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
Southaest Kansas
C
Coyote Clayton Offline
trapper
Coyote Clayton  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
Southaest Kansas
One reason organizations set stipulations that someone needs to be a current member of the Executive level, is the learning curve on how an association functions or operates can be very detailed. The thought process is, it saves time on moving the group forward with it's initiatives. Elected leaders from outside the organization are prone to making mistakes by not knowing all the policy and procedure and legal restrictions. Not saying that is what is going on with this election.



Compulsive Coyote Washer
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995342
11/15/23 06:08 PM
11/15/23 06:08 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Drifter Offline
trapper
Drifter  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Coyote Clayton This is Chris's take on it from the inside.

Quote
I have served on the Executive Council since 2000, including six years as NTA President. The suggestion that a newly elected president needs a thorough understanding of the day-to-day operations is simply not true. We have a full-time paid office manager and staff that handle this. In addition, we have paid contractors, including our legal counsel, DNIA, and editor.


Some individuals use statistics as a drunk man uses lamp-posts ó for support rather than for illumination.

Andrew Lang (1844-1912) Scottish poet, novelist and literary critic









Life member NTA , and GA Trappers assoc .
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995465
11/15/23 08:22 PM
11/15/23 08:22 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Jtrapper Offline
trapper
Jtrapper  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Elected leaders from outside the organization are prone to making mistakes by not knowing all the policy and procedure and legal restrictions.

I don't think this organization cares about any of that, usually just make up the rules as they go.


Not my circus, not my clowns.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7995854
11/16/23 10:16 AM
11/16/23 10:16 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
W
w side rd 151 Offline
trapper
w side rd 151  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
Chris M You say that a good leader needs an inspiring vision excellent communication and leadership skills along with honesty integrity accountability and dedication I could not agreed more Without the traits you mention all the prior experience is pointless and worthless .When those that are in charge are making rules; make rules to keep them in charge and keep others from be able to change the rules it is now a private organization running the operation to benefit themselves .That is not within the spirit of the reason the NTA exists And most likely is fraud I have spent years as volunteer with various outdoor relater groups And poor leadership happens all the time But in orders keep the group going in the right direction the rules need to protect the membership from this type of cheating Thee general membership musthave some control over the operation of the group

Last edited by w side rd 151; 11/16/23 12:31 PM.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: w side rd 151] #7995860
11/16/23 10:25 AM
11/16/23 10:25 AM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 16,348
Oakland, MS
yotetrapper30 Offline
trapper
yotetrapper30  Offline
trapper

Joined: May 2011
Posts: 16,348
Oakland, MS
Originally Posted by w side rd 151
Chris M You say that a god leader needs an inspiring vision excellent communication and leadership skills along with honesty integrity accountability and dedication I could not agreed more Without the traits you mention all the prior experience is pointless and worthless .When those that are in charge are making rules; make rules to keep them in charge and keep others from be able to change the rules it is now a private organization running the operation to benefit themselves .That is not within the spirit of the reason the NTA exists And most likely is fraud I have spent years as volunteer with various outdoor relater groups And poor leadership happens all the time But in orders keep the group going in the right direction the rules need to protect the membership from this type of cheating Thee general membership musthave some control over the operation of the group


The general membership is who will make the final decision as to whether this bylaw amendment will pass. Historically, bylaw amendments receive less than 100 votes from the general membership, which is pretty pitiful, especially when you consider half of those votes probably come from members who are also members of the board of directors. There are nearly 10,000 NTA members which means less than 1% bother to vote.

Defeating this bylaw amendment is easy. All you have to do is send in your ballot, and convince 5 of your trapping buddies to do the same. If 10 members all convince 5 different other members to vote against this measure, it would be soundly defeated.

Last edited by yotetrapper30; 11/16/23 10:26 AM. Reason: Clarification

~~Proud Ultra MAGA~~
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7996075
11/16/23 05:57 PM
11/16/23 05:57 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Jtrapper Offline
trapper
Jtrapper  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
My problem as ive said before with this whole deal is if they are making this kind of decision's this poorly what other decision's are being made behind the scene's member's will never be aware of. Cause the NTA operates by letting directors know as little as possible and usually most of the director's never give the NTA another thought soon as they get back home from the convention so that's fine with them. Run of the mill member's know even less about what's going on until some little item such as this pop's up their attention for two minutes.

So fine strike this dumb idea down, can't wait to see what's next.

Did anyone ever find out the origin's of this wonderful idea? The lawyer? President? Concerned member? Someone had this idea and passed it along for it to get traction to begin with. Since it's such a great idea I can't believe no one has stepped forward to take credit for it.


Not my circus, not my clowns.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7996169
11/16/23 07:56 PM
11/16/23 07:56 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 288
NY
T
trappermac NY Offline
trapper
trappermac NY  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 288
NY
Jtrapper...your negativity (add naseum) does nothing to promote the intent of the OP, that being to strike down a by-law proposal. Everyone knows of your disdain for NTA, maybe start your own thread and whine away. In the meantime, try to stay on point to the original intent of the thread. If anyone has an issue with NTA right now it's Angela, but she has stayed on point with the intent despite her current status. I commend her for this. Your posts are all about you, so stand down because you're boring us.

Get your vote in members....stop this foolish proposal!


Member NYSTA, NTA, FBU, ECTA
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7996567
11/17/23 09:20 AM
11/17/23 09:20 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
W
w side rd 151 Offline
trapper
w side rd 151  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
I join the NTA as a lifetime member sometime in the mid 1980's Trapping was a booming fast growing activity Many serious trappers where making enough money in the business of trapping for fur And many more got involve i the business of making and selling products that that where part of the trapping industry . It could be said that trapping for profit and money was at it's peak during the past 200 years That fact that everyone wanted to be a trapper had a very obvious downside to those who where trappers before the sudden increase in those that took up the sport and made it a business to them .It was a time that groups such as the NTA and many state associations had a whole new group of people to try to convince them to support an organization that supports trapping and trapping rights I believe that we all need to do our part to keep our trapping /hunter / gun owner rights Many American citizens have died to keep this country the greatness nation in the world In the early years of my lifetime membership I made donations while only small in amount of money I tried to make some
when possible .As time went on however the NTA had situations that where never explained to those who where paying the bills by their donations. The people in charge and often the people involved in those situations did not deal with those problems in a way that would be considered to be appropriate to the general membership if they knew what was happening .tt at least to me seemed that some where protecting their own butt or someone else's butt that had abused the integrity of the NTA Maybe some of the issues that happen where dealt with behind closed doors out of necessity But there have been several times that at least gave the appearance that there was alleged misbehavior by the people in charge and it was swept under the rug Either the one that was accrued of the bad act was protected or the accuser was discredited I do not recall all of the details But I think more than once either the accused was protected or the accuser was discredited by the reigning people in charge It has been more than one occasion that some explaining was due necessary and never given And the general membership was not even informed about any part of the situation The NTA has taken on the appearance of a good old boys club at least when it applies to certain ways that the business of the association is conducted. I admit I have no first hand knowledge of the accusations that where part of the supposed issues I think of in the same way s Bob Dylan wrote in one of his songs You Don.t Need a Weatherman to Know Which Way the Wind Blows If I am completely off base with my comments and observations than I am a misinformed lifetime member of an organization
that could have been serving its members in a much better way If they have used the resources given to them by those that made donations to cover for the lack of leadership and integrity that is a black eye for all that where a part of the ones that what involved in the misbehavior . I will close by saying the questions that never were addressed by the leadership are the reasons I have discontinued my donations to the group . And making bylaw changes to make it even more difficult to get answers to anyone questioning the authority of those making the rules that benefit them selves creates an smell that none of us needs a weatherman to know which way the wind blows

Last edited by w side rd 151; 11/17/23 09:28 AM.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7996940
11/17/23 06:25 PM
11/17/23 06:25 PM
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 684
Michigan
B
BigBlackBirds Offline
trapper
BigBlackBirds  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 684
Michigan
Odd question here but is there a good written detailed description somewhere about how NTA functions?

Iím one of that huge majority in membership that never paid much attention over years. Always had other priorities but thise shift over time which leads me to the question

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #7997529
11/18/23 09:17 AM
11/18/23 09:17 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
W
w side rd 151 Offline
trapper
w side rd 151  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
There is never enough time to do all the things we would like to do However I have helped the NTA 1or 2 years to set up for their national convention And up until about 10 t 15 years ago II would include them on my list of groups to support with donations as I was able to For example a larger fur check made it possible to donation more to the NTA .When some of the issues that occurred or where caused by the people in charge at the time where never really presented to the general membership it gave the appearance of cover up or discrediting the accuser .And no clear explanation as far as the outcome. And after it appeared to be an issue of less than acceptable behavior by those in charge of keeping the group operating in a professional manner The people in charge have made it appear that they and only they had a need to know what was alleged to e a problem . As a dues paying member of the group if incidences are being left to go unresolved due to the lack of desire in wanting the general public to know of the indiscretions that happen Once you start down the road of promoting a lie the cover up for the action that was not dealt with in a proper way you need to continue i that train of thought t might all be a misunderstanding that started the mess to begin with But when the rules are being written to exclude all but a select few it is opening a dor the ends up leading to that problem going somewhere to happen I will admit I had heard bits and pieces concerning this issue for a while now And I wondered if it was just petty sour grapes by those they where no longer in the group in charge But when you keep hearing of the ongoing accusations and no attempts made to correct or stop them for just going forward wit what has allowed them to do more of the same I hve not been in the know to make that decision But I think someone should see if there is any credibility to th accusations that have been made and those that have been banished for their much needed questions be given a honest look at just what has been going on

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8008010
11/30/23 04:42 PM
11/30/23 04:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
C
Cindy Offline
trapper
Cindy  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
Just an FYIÖ., I never received a ballot in mail so contacted the office and for some reason I wasnít on list , frown odd
So if you havenít received a ballot and are a lifetime member with no publication you might want to contact them ?


Happy Trails
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8008474
12/01/23 07:12 AM
12/01/23 07:12 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
Jtrapper Offline
trapper
Jtrapper  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,268
Alabama (Bama for short) 108 y...
You left out Hall of Fame member as well!


Not my circus, not my clowns.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: Jtrapper] #8008513
12/01/23 07:46 AM
12/01/23 07:46 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
C
Cindy Offline
trapper
Cindy  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,897
Bedrock, Arizona
I donít think that qualifies you for voting lol
I know why youíre upset Jackie and some donít get it or understand either.
I started to post on the other link several times and stepped away .
Weird, I can do that nowÖ.,age must have something to do with it, cause George would debate the fact if I say Iím getting smarter.
But in reality I believe it isnít worth my energy.
I gave my heart and soul to NTA 30yrs and FBU 20yrs. 20 yrs I raised then to much to count and put them before my entire family and life that came first .
There is where I say idiot !!!!
Thatís along time and I got not one thank you still to this day from anyone in the realm of the board or EC of either organization.
Rather plenty of untruths and rumors of crap. Iím that person that keeps everything so there is nothing to debate or question.
With that said I still will vote and vote for
Whatís right because I have to hold onto the hope that it matters.
Thatís my two cents Ö hope everyone has a great day !!!!!


Happy Trails
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: Cindy] #8008557
12/01/23 08:45 AM
12/01/23 08:45 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
W
w side rd 151 Offline
trapper
w side rd 151  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,614
PA
Doing the right thing because it is the right thing to do is always a worth while accomplishment And a credit to anyone that strives for that goal Many have done that as the only way to go It seems some never thought it applied to then

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8008789
12/01/23 01:17 PM
12/01/23 01:17 PM
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,515
SE Minnesota
D
dustytinner Offline
trapper
dustytinner  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,515
SE Minnesota
Originally Posted by Cindy
I donít think that qualifies you for voting lol
I know why youíre upset Jackie and some donít get it or understand either.
I started to post on the other link several times and stepped away .
Weird, I can do that nowÖ.,age must have something to do with it, cause George would debate the fact if I say Iím getting smarter.
But in reality I believe it isnít worth my energy.
I gave my heart and soul to NTA 30yrs and FBU 20yrs. 20 yrs I raised then to much to count and put them before my entire family and life that came first .
There is where I say idiot !!!!
Thatís along time and I got not one thank you still to this day from anyone in the realm of the board or EC of either organization.
Rather plenty of untruths and rumors of crap. Iím that person that keeps everything so there is nothing to debate or question.
With that said I still will vote and vote for
Whatís right because I have to hold onto the hope that it matters.
Thatís my two cents Ö hope everyone has a great day !!!!!



Good response Cindy! I wish more felt this wsy.


Life member Minnesota Trappers Association
FTA,Sportsmen's Alliance
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8010180
12/03/23 09:32 AM
12/03/23 09:32 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Drifter Offline
trapper
Drifter  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
When is the vote count? I saw the deadline to vote is to be post marked by Dec 15. When and where will the results be shown?


Some individuals use statistics as a drunk man uses lamp-posts ó for support rather than for illumination.

Andrew Lang (1844-1912) Scottish poet, novelist and literary critic









Life member NTA , and GA Trappers assoc .
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: Drifter] #8010477
12/03/23 04:59 PM
12/03/23 04:59 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 10,313
Iowa
T
trapdog1 Offline
trapper
trapdog1  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 10,313
Iowa
Originally Posted by Drifter
When is the vote count? I saw the deadline to vote is to be post marked by Dec 15. When and where will the results be shown?

Call NTA headquarters and ask.

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8011459
12/04/23 03:21 PM
12/04/23 03:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
I would expect the office staff will include the results n the January board mailing


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8015354
12/08/23 12:42 PM
12/08/23 12:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
C
ChrisM Offline OP
trapper
ChrisM  Offline OP
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 148
South Dakota
Reminder... I know everyone is busy on the trapline...The deadline to mail ballots is only one week away. They must be postmarked by Dec. 15th


Seger's music speaks to a person's heart and soul like few others can.
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8018694
12/11/23 10:09 PM
12/11/23 10:09 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Drifter Offline
trapper
Drifter  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,840
Oakland, MS
Only a few days left to get your votes in.


Some individuals use statistics as a drunk man uses lamp-posts ó for support rather than for illumination.

Andrew Lang (1844-1912) Scottish poet, novelist and literary critic









Life member NTA , and GA Trappers assoc .
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: Drifter] #8020084
12/13/23 06:43 PM
12/13/23 06:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 253
Eastern Shore of Maryland
R
Roger Ringgold Offline
trapper
Roger Ringgold  Offline
trapper
R

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 253
Eastern Shore of Maryland
How and when can we find out the results of the By Law proposal voting?

Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8021764
12/15/23 08:12 PM
12/15/23 08:12 PM
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,515
SE Minnesota
D
dustytinner Offline
trapper
dustytinner  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,515
SE Minnesota
I hope everyone sent in their vote!


Life member Minnesota Trappers Association
FTA,Sportsmen's Alliance
Re: Attention NTA Member [Re: ChrisM] #8052873
01/17/24 07:00 PM
01/17/24 07:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,086
Alaska and Washington State
W
waggler Offline
trapper
waggler  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,086
Alaska and Washington State
"The amendment, if adopted, will prohibit anyone who has not previously served on the NTA Executive Council from running for President of the NTA."

What the heck were they thinking?
Kind of like only allowing a good-old-boy US Senator to run for the office of President.

How tone-deaf can these guys be?


"My life is better than your vacation"
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