You guys would know.In two years my truck will be paid off and I plan on buying a new snowsled.Which is better up there a tundra or Scandic?The weight of the scandics scare me a little but are they better?Thought I would find out straight from the horses mouth so to speak.You all would know.

Tundra takes more riding skill. Skandic is heavier, but either would work just fine. Expedition is easiest to ride and if you don’t have a lot of riding experience may be the way to go.

Thanks Have rode a snow sled my whole life beaver trapping and bobcat hunting.

If you have been riding your whole life, any of them will suit you just fine. The new Tundras are an amazing machine.

Better? That's subjective considering what you plan to do with the snogo and where you plan to do it at. Alaska is a big state and what someone uses for trapping in one part of the state may not always be the best choice somewhere else.

Snowsled that will go thru deep snow and break trail.Not looking for a trail sled.Not so heavy that you can't get it unstuck.Light enough to be able to move it around by hand.

Breaking trail in deep snow while pulling a loaded tobaggon? On trail or bushwhacking?

Unless you drop one thru the ice any snowmachine can be unstuck with a shovel,chainsaw and come along.
An old style bumper jack is handy also.
You can buy whats called a Powder jack for snowmachines-based on an old car bumper jack.
If you are going far best to go with someone with another machine,especially when we are older.

Break the trail first with just the sled would be my plan.Then keep it as packed down as much as possible after that.Then pull the tobaggon while trapping is the plan.I'm new to this up in Alaska as its still in the planning stages.Alot of learning to do.

The scandics they use in Baxter state park during the winter are so heavy they got to be hard to get unstuck.Alone that had got to be quite a job.

I have a Skandic SWT, and I haven't got it stuck often, but I've always been by myself and got it out. The biggest headache is when you roll one on its top, they aren't near as easy to flop back over as the old 300 Tundras, or even the newer bigger Tundras. I used a electric ATV winch on the Bearcat WT fourstroke I had before this (and I had that thing stuck a LOT!)and it actually weighed more than the SWT. I was going to use that on this sled also (I set it them both up with a reciever hitch front and back so I could switch the winch to either end, or hook it to a floorboard with a loop of cable if I wanted to pull straight sideways like rolling one back on its track) but I got a ropealong for Christmas just a week or two after my SWT arrived, and that is what I pack and use now. Works great and no worries about running your battery dead on these four strokes if you have to run a winch when it is on its top and isn't running. Always pack a shovel, with practically any good utility machine, if you are simply buried in deep snow you can generally always dig your way out. The only time I've needed a rope along or winch is either when I've had them on their top in the ditch, or slid them down over a bank.

I love my Skandic SWT, but you don't ride them the same as you do the old Tundras, they are like a truck, you can shove them in low and just idle and they will crawl up on top of the snow and go, and if you start to have problems just back up a few feet and then idle forward again. It is unbelievable where I have broken trail and taken this machine by doing that. It is when you pin the throttle that you can bury yourself in them. They are not a sidehill machine, however, they have so much track that you can hang as far off the side as you want, you're not leaning that machine and cutting a track into a sidehill, that track is going to follow the contour of the land.

I'm used to being up on my knees not sitting in deep snow and guiding the sled by leaning if that answers anything.Looking at the Tundra LE with the longer track.Going to have to try some sleds out before buying.

Might have to try a skandic out as I'm not much on pinning the trottle but easing into it.

Reverse would be a luxury to me.I'm used to getting off the sled and pulling sideways on one front ski while hitting the trottle to turn one around.But sleds I'm used to are much lighter then sleds now.

I'm running a 900 ace widetrack skandic with pogos and my wife has the same in 600. I've only had it stuck once and that's when I first got it. I always carry a rope-a-long, shovel, and chainsaw regardless of what machine I've used over the years. Like Bearcat said the widetracks don't sidehill well so a long track like the tundra would be better. I prefer pogos to A arms for off trail use however on trail you will have a better ride and they are a bit less tippy. The 900 has better cold starting ability than my wife's 600 and the 900 has plenty of power when you need it. Nice thing about the wide tracks is that you can breaktrail AND pull one heck of a load. The tundras would shine on skinny trails like a hand cut trapline and sidehilling. The are pretty nimble but also tippy. You can still break trail while pulling a reasonable load but not like a wide track those things are like tanks, just put it in first and go.

I bought a 2012 Tundra LT with the basic 550F. The reverse is awesome! You won’t be riding on your knees with these, it’s super comfortable to just stand up straight and drive when you want. I actually used the handle bar loop in the middle this morning breaking trail through a swamp. They can be quite tippy….lol.

I have a scandik 600 ace 4 stroke(2017) widetrack and a tundra scandik 550 2 stroke.(2008) 154 inch long track.
I use the Tundra scandik more than the skandik most years.
Only drawback to the 550 is its a gas guzzler.The big 4 stroke uses very little gas in comparison.

I keep them both maintained religiously.

Is that tundra Skandic a mix between the 2?
It is nice having the simplicity of old school tech like the 550 fan in a new platform with a few bells and whistles.

Much lighter weight than the scandik sort of a crossover with the long track and 550 engine.
They only made them for a year or two.Not tippy at all like the newer tundras.
Great machine for breaking trail for a 15 inch track.its got the inch and a half lugs on the track also.The extra wide ski skins really improve the performance in the deep powder.
There is another one in town but they are scarce.
It skips across open water real good,lol.

Thanks everyone.

2024 ski doo tundra long track

2024 scandic wide track

A friend of mine has one of those, and I've seen a couple others around. I bought an 08 300 (actually 277cc) new that was the same design, they made the 300 for three years and I think the 550 with that front end also those three years, then they went to a pogo front end and discontinued the 300. Those steer like a dream, the 300s are tippy, but not compared to the older Tundra Rs, and steer a hundred times better and are way more comfortable. I gave mine to my mom with over 30,000 miles on it about seven years ago and she is still riding it, although the oiler quit on it in 30 below weather just before I gave it to her and I seized it up and had to rebuild the engine, so it isn't original. The 300s came with a 138x16 track, which finally wore out on her and she replaced it with a 15 inch wide track (was a few hundred dollars cheaper for an aftermarket 15, could only find a skidoo 16 to fit, no aftermarkets) and claims little lose in performance out of the narrower track. They were a great machine, I don't know why they quit making them. I've heard numerous times how that A-arm front end isn't as tough as the pogo fronted, but I know I beat that thing off trees, stumps, gates, rocks and everything else and never broke a thing. I will say that when you are breaking trail with the throttle pinned going up through places overgrown with tag alders, those A-arms and coilsprings are real good at grabbing brush and coming to a sudden stop, I've had them switch ends on me and stop suddenly, while I kept going.

The 550 is a good reliable motor, but it will burn double the fuel the 300 will (makes sense, it is a two cylinder with the same piston and jugs as the 300, just two of them instead of one). The four stroke motors, both the 600 and 900 ACE are awesome on fuel mileage, getting better mileage than the old single cylinder Tundras.

I personally wouldn't go back to a 2 stroke for an every day sled, although they are simple to work on. The four strokes are quieter, way better on fuel mileage, and more reliable. But they have a bunch of electronic junk on them and if something does go wrong they are not as easy to work on. For what I do I love my SWT, but there are advantages and disadvantages of the wider tracks. If they made the Tundra with a high/low transmission like the Skandic and wide track Expeditions it would be much better for pulling loads on narrow trails. I've got 6000 on my SWT and am still on the original belt. While my Tundras were good on belts they never lasted that long and my Arctic Cat would go through at least half a dozen a year.

I want to second the expedition sport. I have a 600 ACE, often wish I had the 900 Ace although I pull a relatively heavy sled. I would never own another 2 stroke.
In short, the expy sport is a tundra with A arm suspension. I rode my 600 ace tundra several thousand miles, mostly in Montana, bust also on the north slope (miles of hard wind blown sastrugi mixed with bottomless power in willow bottoms). I have never ever wished I had a Tubdra again. When people say they are tippy, it is a vast understatement.
In my mind the Expy is much superior on any kind of trail and equal in the woods and brush. Best advice is ride one of each.

Are you moving up here, Bruce?

Another option would be to look at the Lynx Ranger 49 with the 2 stroke engine and manual start.
Or the lynx Brutal.

The 4 stroke sounds great, it’s just the fear of minor breakdowns that require a friggin mechanic. I’d have to ditch the sled, get home, haul the trail er out from the back and over to the shack, then get the sled back to a dealer to fix something that’s probably simple…lol.
The Expy has an adjustable 39” stance where my older tundra has 32. Yes, tippy but it sure can get through some tight spots when making new trails….if that’s even one of your requirements.

I've hem-hawed back and forth between the Skandic and Expedition models, and ended up with the Skandic for that very reason, the narrower stance (still wider than the old single cylinder Tundras) fits in tighter places. On the other hand, if I was buying a new sled for the wife I would buy the Expedition, hands down. Because a less experienced rider, who probably isn't going to go on so many "iffy" trails, for someone like her I would pick stability over slimness.

Going to start doing some trapping in Alaska.First goal is a wolverine.

Perhaps the first goal should be to acquire a useful snogo? You have a friend or relative up here? Next goal might be to find a place to trap? What about a truck and trailer? If you won't be here year round where will you keep the snogo?
Seems like a fair amount of preparation needed to get to the point of actually setting a trap. How old are you?

I am pretty happy with my Tundra 600 efi. Still have two stroke simplicity with a pull start and electric start. It is not as fuel efficient as a four stroke, but way better than my 550. It also has much more power than my 550 or my 600 ACE. The newest platform with wide ski skins is less tippy than the previous Tundras.

If a wolverine is your goal then a snogo isn't mandatory a pair of snowshoes will get you into wolverine country as well as other fur.

I have a 2016 Tundra extreme in 600 Etec and a 2017 Tundra LT 550 for a spare machine. I would like to upgrade to a SWT once my machine hits 3k miles

I have used mountain machines for awhile grow up un them then went to a utility sled . Don’t like the utility ones most don’t have the power I need have been using a Polaris lxt 550 for a few years now and just way under powered . I travel 56 miles of river with lots of over flew I find lots of power and paddle track gets me through every thing I Incounter. Plus’s after back surgery I don’t sit any more and mountain machines are built for standing. Running a pro this year and next I might pick up a summit. Gas mileage is bad but knowing all I have to do is grab the throttle and power out is a comforting feeling. I have had the hole river drop out from under me before and the only thing that save my but was a paddle track and power. Some spots we go it is deep and moving if you go in you are not coming out . What started it was years ago I would get utility sled stuck all the time and would have to go back with Mountain sled to retrieve my utility sled. Afterwards I just started using mountain sled . My m6 has 13,000 miles on it and is still in use. All original except things of broke was absolutely the best trapping sled I have had .

My nephew was telling me today these Ski doo expeditions are in between a tundra and a scandic.Same long track as a tundra but a wider track.Wider track then a tundra but not as wide as a scandic.Anyone familiar with these?

Is there a skidoo dealer somewhere you could drive to and see some of these? Or any snogo dealer?

As far as I know the only real difference between the expedition widetrack and the skandic widetrack is one has pogos and the other A arms. IMHO your getting the dogsled in front of the dogteam

The Expedition now comes in all the various sizes of track as the Skandic, 16" wide like the Tundra, 20" WT, and 24" SWT. And same motor options. The front suspension and steering are different, making them wider and more stable. They are supposed to be more comfortable to ride but I'm not sure if they have the same rear suspension as the Skandic models or not. If your Skidoo dealers are anything like those out west, they won't have any inventory and if you want a new sled you will have to order it in April without ever being able to look at your options and hope it comes in by the time you want to use it the following year. My dad and I both ordered new sleds in April of 2022 and mine came in mid December, his didnt come in until mid January.

Our skidoo dealer is now carrying the lynx line.
I'll have to check if he has a lynx brutal in his showroom.

For some reason this thread makes me think..... Canoe?

Haha.....good one Dirt!

lol....One term that often causes confusion is the difference between a snowmobile and a sled. So, let’s dive into what exactly a snowmobile is. A snowmobile, also known as a sled or snow machine, is a motorized vehicle specifically designed for travel over snow and ice.

I have used a canoe as a sleigh behind the Scandik a few times.
If you use a canoe for a sleigh make sure you hook the tow rope the same way you hook it when towing your canoe behind your motor boat.

Canoe indeed. I'll rent him one with the right deposit lol

I had that same thought a couple days ago!

Bruce the only difference between Skandics and Expeditions is the front suspension and distance between the skis. From the engine to the rear bumper they are the same sled. Skandics ride rougher due to the pogo stick design. A lot of people talk about how skandics are stronger for going off trail but that has not been my experience. I run an Expedition wide track and an Expedition SWT both with 900 ace engines. I am fairly hard on equipment and run through brush and over logs without issue.

With any of the big sleds you will want an electric winch and or comealong. They are heavy and they do tip every now and then. As far as getting stuck in snow just bring a shovel. Clear a foot or two in front or behind them. Back up and go forward then launch out of the hole and keep going.

Having the high and low gear options is something I really like.

I also am a 4stroke convert for a utility sled. They are quiet and fuel efficient not to mention no smoke. Still love 2strokes for my play sleds though. As far as reliability issues go the 2strokes have more issues and are just as hard or harder to diagnose and repair in the field than the 4strokes are.

Whatever sled you decide on I would certainly go with a long track (154”). In Alaska we never know what the winter is going to bring. It can be dirt one winter and 4-6’ of snow the next in the same area.

Funny, I thought to Myself Yesterday, Bruce is about to be canoed.

Bronco, is your 4 stroke electric starter only? How easy/difficult would changing a starter in the field be?

Biggest drawback of the fourstrokes, I don't know of any that aren't electric start only. As far as replacing the starter in the field, I've never had one go out, so I've never replaced one in the field or otherwise except the auxiliary electric starter on my 08 Tundra 300. That wasn't bad at all, but I didn't do it in the field because I had a pull start on it.

I did have the starter solenoid go bad on my Bearcat four stroke (a known issue, they made a post production fix for) but it stuck on in the field instead of not working. Easy to get to mounted right on the battery, just disconnected the wire after it started. Annoying but better than not starting.

Yes they are electric start only. Changing starters is easier on them than it is on the 2strokes. But how often has the starter in your car or truck gone out?

I think the proper question should have been. Can you rope start them on the clutch with the shoe laces from those new bunny boots?

If I am not mistaken,even the newer 2 strokes with a manual starter will not run with a pooched battery.
Some juice is needed for the electronic fuel injection?

The new Vikings will run.

How hard are the four strokes on belts?

The point of the question was to point out having a starter failure in the field means a walk back to the truck, cabin, etc.
Dirts tongue in cheek question makes me wonder, can you pull start the engine from the clutch?
Starters on road vehicles rarely go out, but when they do you're on a road. Help is likely not too far away.

There shouldn't be any issues your money can't cure.

That T after Bruce isn't followed by an eadwell I hope?

FWIW; Both My tundra and expedition have needed starters, Luckily both failed right in the yard at home.Pretty easy to replace, minimal tools. I suppose You could do it in the field if You happened to have a spare starter with You. Pretty pricey If I remember correctly and had to beat the bushes for the second one. I have not been happy with parts availability from ski doo in recent years.

The viking starter went bad. Needed a new brush. There was an aftermarket product by i believe RM Stator that was the whole brush holding hardware with brushes . Around 15 bucks.

Correction, 17.84

Belts last a long time if you dont burn them up trying to get unstuck.
I think everybody has at least one spare belt stashed somewhere on their machines.

Thanks, good to know.I always carry two extra belts

I had to add a recoil (rope start) as an accessory on my Tundra 600 efi. I can pull start it with a dead battery. That is one of the reasons I chose the 2 stroke. I was out with a friend once, many miles from the nearest rode. He was riding a Tundra with the 600 ACE and I was driving my 550 Tundra. His battery went dead and our only option was to take the battery out of my machine and put it in his. Every time I had to pull start mine the rest of the day, I made sure to remind him that I was having to pull the rope. That experience was in the back of my mind when I was deciding between the ACE and the EFI.

There are efi machines that don’t even have batteries. My mountain machine is an efi machine without a battery.

Don't forget a good wolverine dispatch kit!

They are super easy on belts compared to my 2 stroke mountain sleds. I bought one sled with about 3,000 miles on it and the clutches and belt needed some love and the other had 7,000 miles on it with no issues with the clutches or belt. Since first purchasing them I have had no issues and I am a bit rough on things. Constantly starting and stopping, towing things, going through very rough terrain in low range and up steep hills. Not to mention the number of times I have had to winch out of my trapping area in the SWT while towing my trapping toboggan.

I have seen a couple videos of guys pull starting the ACE engines. Think I will pass on doing that. I remember trying that on similar sized yamaha outboard 4 strokes and it not being enjoyable. Starters are small enough and light enough if you were concerned it would be easy enough to bring a spare with you. Thats what I have done on remote trips. Bought a used one off ebay and keep it in my spare parts kit for long remote trips.

The skidoos are great, I have a 900 ACE SWT with 6000 miles on it, almost all towing a sled and it is on its original belt. You won't get that out of a Tundra or Expedition Sport four stroke, because they don't have the two speed transmission and are a little high geared for tight, twisty trails. But they will still do good on belts. The Arctic Cat four stroke I had however was a belt eater, it didn't have the multiple speed transmission (2012 Bearcat wide track, some of the newer ones actually have a 3-speed transmission) but I put lower aftermarket gears in it. That helped, but it still went through 6-8 belts a winter.

Always carry a spare belt, I used to carry at least two in the Arctic Cat.

Yep my .22 pistol

I recommend NOT shooting it in the head. The skull is a nice trophy or is worth 50 bucks. Maybe more depending on where you advertise it.

Nothing will be for sale.Big taxidermy bill.lol

Right now I'm leaning towards a expedition or scandic.

Dispatched a lynx once with bunny boot lace. I wouldn’t want a machine in the bush that you couldn’t hand pull start as a backup

You can smoke a belt unloading your new machine after hauling it to the shack and it kinda freezes up. Tried backing up, could smell burnt rubber but I barely tried so figured it was still good. It drove “fine” for a few weeks when I decided to replace it. It was all glased but was a different machine with a new belt…lol.
One thing to ask is how your EFI is powered, is there a fuel pump and how they might be powered. I’ve heard of guys with 4 strokes getting home with one of those little lithium booster packs.

My first machine was Skandic SWT w/ a 550F. It was a great beaver trapping machine. Gas guzzler. Hard to turn with the super wide track.

Upgraded to an Expedition w/ a 4-stroke in 2017. Sips gas. Lots of power. Super comfortable ride. Heavy. I don't trap like I used to, but I pull a lot of ice shacks and it's great for that.

If I was buying a machine just for trapping, it would probably be a Skandic SWT. Of course, conditions in WI are nothing like Alaska. FWIW.

As you can see they don't make these anymore and everybody led you in a different direction.

That looks like the infamous white17 dispatch kit.

At least the paper bag part.

I don't know how many of you have tried counting coup on a wolverine with a stick. I have found it to be quite challenging !

LOL....bet that would be fun to watch

Fruitless .... is how I found it !!

I have a two year old skandic 600ace wt

1 they are tippy
2 the fuel tank sock filters plug up and need replacement
3 the radiator needs better shielding from incoming sticks
4 they are tippy
5 they are tippy

I use the back of an axe (not hatchet)

I got the missus convinced I need a new sled, I'm gonna go poke around at the ski-doo dealership when I go into town next

Let me know what you end up getting and why.

Going with a skandic, just haven't decided if I want the 600efi or 600ace

I let the wife take my old sled out for a spin last night knowing it wasn't going to go positively for her. Long story short I had to walk about 2 miles (after she walked that 2 miles home) and go get it unstuck and replace the belt she ate up trying to power out. When I got home she asked if that happens often, I told her there's 3 belts riding on the machine for a reason...she said I probably shouldn't be doing that in the middle of nowhere in the dark all the time lol

Quote.....Going with a skandic, just haven't decided if I want the 600efi or 600ace

Whats the diffrence between those two?

The efi is a two stroke,the ace is a four stroke.
Two stroke has more horsepower,the four stroke is very good on gas
I have a 600 ace wide track skandic I find it has plenty of power for me.
Some trappers here use the 900 ace superwide track,but I found them front heavy compared to the 600 even though the 900 engine is not that much heavier.
A couple big winter beaver trappers here have the 1200,I found that machine way front end heavy but its like a tank in the bush.

Just 2 stroke vs. 4 stroke, and about $1,800 difference on the machine price. 4 strokes last longer and burn less fuel, but 2 strokes are easy and cheap to fix and I can put a pull start on it easy

Now you can put the good belt back on lol

It's an Arctic cat, no such thing as a good belt. You can chew through a brand new one in no time flat if you're not careful

Good plan

The ACE engines are easier to work on than the 2strokes for the most part. Plus parts cost the same.

Probably gonna go with the ace, I inhale enough 2 stroke smoke in my day to day life as it is

What size track are you going with?

20" all the 24's I've seen have the 900. Not sure if they make a 24" with a 600, maybe they just don't have any at our dealership, not sure. Either way, I'll be more than pleased I'm sure, I've always rode old worn out junk so I'm excited for my Cadillac lol

This is why you buy the machine for where you are going to use it. My dad has a 600 ACE wide track like yours. It has plenty of power with the two speed transmission. But my biggest complaint with it is that it is light in the front end. Here we have a lot of ups and downs in the mountains and spend quite a bit of time on ATV trails, some of which can be quite steep as well as narrow and twisty. That light front end is easy to steer on the level or on a road, but you get going up hills on those ATV trails and the skis are riding four inches in the air and it doesn't steer well that way. My 900 ACE (SWT so not comparing apples to apples, but if anything it should be worse because of the heavier track on the back end) doesn't have that issue at all, it can work your arms a little more in deep wet snow, but I'll trade that for the ability to steer better on the trails here. I did a lot of tweaking to the suspension on the Arctic Cat I had previously, in order to put more weight on the skis in an attempt to improve the steering. By the time I was done tweaking it, if you parked in wet snow on level ground, you couldn't turn the skis when you were stopped, you would have to start moving before you could turn the handlebars, but it did steer better.

?[/quote]
20" all the 24's I've seen have the 900. Not sure if they make a 24" with a 600, maybe they just don't have any at our dealership, not sure. Either way, I'll be more than pleased I'm sure, I've always rode old worn out junk so I'm excited for my Cadillac lol[/quote]
They made the 24" track with the 600 ACE for a couple years, but haven't for several years. You can get it with the 900 ACE, or the 900 ACE turbo (loud, lots of power, I don't know about fuel mileage) or I believe you can still get one with the 600 efi, but not the 600 ACE.

The 1200 is very front heavy,not for me here,but some winter beaver trappers like it for pulling tandem sleighs when hauling lots of traps and gear in and piles of beaver out.
I stay away from the ravines around the big rivers but the kids like that country for high marking with their loud mountain sleds
I agree with you bearcat there are plenty of options nowadays to suit your needs.(except the little sleds you can toss in the back of your pick up.)

It will be interesting to see if BRP will come out with anything new in their utility line of sleds since Arctic Cat is closing up, besides the Lynx line of snow machines.

Ski-doo was originally meant to be ski-dog, so maybe they'll buy them out and make ski-cats

They already make ski-cats-the lynx line of sleds.

Lynx line

I'm torn between the Brutal or the Shredder?

Over $500.00 per month all year for 3 years, OUCH!

Dirt.... go Brutal with the 850 E-Tec. Check your whole line before your coffee cup gets cold ! Cool huh ?
Save the Bravo for church on Sundays.

Or the little lynx ranger 49.
The videops of that lynx brutal are pretty impressive,but they always make them look like that.
I will have to go see Remi and try some out.

You are not going down my trails fast, or with any thing wider or higher than a bravo. Scored me most of somebody's swt windshield and mirror today. If I drove a widetrack or lord forbid a SWT I would get way too many friends checking my gear.


Anybody need a mirror?

Dang on your trapline?