very interesting that He studied the book of Romans and figured out the truth.

Which Protestant denomination is currently carrying the torch of "truth"?

Works are evidence that one has accepted Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior, we are bond servants to our Master. Works will never gain you salvation, nor will paying pentence. We are powerless no matter how good of a person we are if we fail to accept Jesus Christ and his teachings as presented in the Canonized Holy Bible.

We are saved by the grace of God, freely given and not earned. But I have known people who were devout Christians early in life, who surely were in a state of salvation, but who later in life lost the faith and became atheists. Are they still saved?

you know that was an interesting sermon yesterday

with the conclusion all of them and none of them.
any institution will be plagued by the issues of men , yet any institution that brings people to Jesus is united with christ.
because Jesus prays for all the future believers as well in John 17 he is setting the stage for all future believers to join him as well.

This isnt meant to stir up division it is a mere observation based on a study of Martin Luther and how he came to the conclusion that the works based teaching were not the way described by Christ. I have no issue with however one chooses to interpret any denomination. I alone answer for myself at the Great White Throne of Judgement as will every soul ever created by God the Father.

John 14:6 tells us, as stated by Jesus Christ himself, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

Romans 8:31-39
What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? 32 He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? 33 Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. 34 Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36 As it is written:

“For Your sake we are killed all day long;
We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.”

37 Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. 38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, 39 nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

And yet Martin Luther didn't like the Epistle of James because of the pesky works stuff. He called it an epistle of straw.

Hebrews 6: 4-6, "For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame."

So it is possible to lose salvation.

That's how I understand it based on Paul's writing.

And yet that's not what the Calvinists teach.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perseverance_of_the_saints

I really worry about the once saved always saved movement. There just isn't any scripture to back it up and lot's of people are betting their eternity on it. the argument is God will not take your salvation away, which is true, but you sure can give it back. mikec

I don't believe in predestination, but rather in free will. We are all predestined to spend eternity with the Lord based on our choice to believe or not. If God predestines or chooses just certain people, there are those who would have no chance of salvation because their fate had already been predetermined .

Im torn on the once saved always saved. It thas been taught at at least one church I have gone to but neither made since to me.

Go off latter and murder and rape people and your covered. If your doing that are you/ were you truly saved. When you started wanting to be more like christ you stop doing a lot of sinful behavior and have behavior changes. A lot of people look at that and think I don't want to give xyz up. But the thing is when the changs happens xyz no longer has the same appeal to you and since you colonies are interested in it your not giving it up your desire has changed.

Then there is sin is sin one is no worse than the next. Hard to wrap my head around. Lying is as bad a murderer is hard for my flesh to comprehend.

But then look at all the sin those saved commit on a daily basis maybe as simple as the girl in yoga pants catching your eye and you look a sec to long. Happens every day after salvation and the gift of salvation has been accepted. So if sin is sin and someone commits murder then they should still be forgiven? Hard to swallow but im just a man the created not the creator.

Now being saved and later rejecting it seems like free will has a place and they should be able to choose to change their mind.

The Great Commission from John 20:


Why did Jesus authorize his disciples to forgive sins?

Martin did say that about the book of James, however, read what he was saying because he was still thinking in works based salvation. Thats not what the brother of Jesus was saying, your works are because of your faith through salvation, not works to achieve salvation. Go back and read these things. Martin Luther missed the point of what James was saying. Because of Salvation through our saviour Jesus Christ we will do those things which in time will Glorify God. As opposed to, you do good works to seek salvation, which is all about you and not the acceptance of Jesus Christ.

List the scriptures where Jesus authorized the disciples to forgive sins. Do you not or have you not read what John the Baptist said as Jesus approached, Behold the Lamb of God who will take away the sins of the World.

If you wish to prove a point, quote scripture within its entirety and within i context.

Go back to John 20, read the entire chapter and dont take it out of context. Jesus was saying, whoever has sinned against you, look up the scripture verse by verse in the old greek and hebrew and you will see what was meant. Mere men can not forgive anyone of their transgressions. Forgive us of our transgressions as we forgive those who have transgressed against us. THe blood of Jesus Christ is the only thing that can wash away our sins.

Those who are deeply imbedded in this mindset wont change your minds. A few will. thats why I teach a mens transition bible study from one faith to another. Folks are fleeing this one doctrine to seek a better understanding.

What did the Apostle Paul after his conversion on the road to Damascus. We are born into sin. yes accepting jesus christ brings us to the foot of the cross, in humility. Many will and have entered into a backslidden state. WE all have at times. Thats why the blood of Christ is so precious. come back and repent and then get back on track. Those folks on death row are only bound by the bars and shackles of men. Once they truly accept Christ, everything changes. It is far better for them to be in iron chains than the spriritual warfare chains of Satan.

The choice is ours. Since God exists outside of time, space and matter, he is all knowing. We are not. Since God declares he knows the end from the beginning. Think about that. He has known us since before the foundation of time. That correlates with Times of Old, Ancient times. Which in Hebrew, going back to Genesis 1:1, prior to that is what they refer to as the point in which time vanishes as it wasnt documented.

If we could wrap our brains around God, Then we would see him as something equal and he would not be large enough for us to worship.