When we did the 3 year field study,the wire boxes,tin boxes and boxes on posts were the poorest marten producers.
Small boxes that limited the size of the bait were very poor producers.A box that could accommodate at least a lb.of beaver meat was a much better producer.
Boxes on the ground were good marten producers but were rejected because of pelt damage from rodents,and too much mtc in winter-loss of bait etc.
Boxes painted white attracted an inordinate amount of squirrels for some reason.

For the life of me I can't imagine why a marten would care what the box is made of or what the orientation of it might be. I don't see any way in a study to control all the possible variables that will affect the results of the experiment.

Not trying to hijack the thread. Just a question in my mind.

Agreed, marten are not hard to catch.... the big marten producers all have a quick system figured out and they certainly dont use a pound of bait at each set.

The study was very comprehensive,and followed all scientific protocols.It was set up and overseen by some of the foremost furbearer biologists in North America,and used 30 odd seasoned marten trappers from some of the best Marten country in North America.

No one tried to read the Martens mind but just applied the variables over 3 seasons and crunched the numbers at the end of the study.A couple of the results I related in the above post,It may or may not be useful.

Similar,most likely, to how a wolf tends not to stick his head in a 330.

Maybe it's just me but it seems you Canadian boys go a bit overboard to catch marten. Belisles 120's at $138.95 a dozen?? I could buy 2 dozen bridger 120 mags for that price. Wooden boxes??? heavy, don't stack, expensive, time consuming, and the squirrels, porcupines, and bears will destroy them anyway when you could use flower pots that are cheap, lite, stackable, and can bring back at the end of the season so they don't get destroyed. Just doesn't seem economical to me especially since Marten are easy to catch.................

Well this is all I'll add here because I don't want the thread to go this direction..BUT.

If you trap an area in year 1, with a particular type set, the next year a different set and the third year a different set..those years can't be comparable because the area has been trapped before. How do you control for that variable ? There is no way to control for the fluctuations in population.

OK suppose you set the three set types all in the same year. Not every location is the same so maybe no marten see certain sets. Or, lets say you set all three types next to each other or within a few yards. The marten will get caught in the first set he sees. How is that scientific ? Unless a guy could catch ten out of ten marten (or close to that) in one of those three sets, I don't believe you can draw any conclusions.

As far as using a pound of bait, how does a marten decide how much a bait weighs? My baits usually weigh less that one ounce and have no meat on them at all. In my opinion, the results can be better explained by the fact that a larger bait may require a larger box and the marten may be more inclined to enter the larger space than smaller ones.

And yet, you use ground cubbys. For SHAME!

I have been looking for some pots to add to my setup. Should fit on just like the cones i have and they would hold a good large chunk of bait.



One word, AIHTS.

The Belisles are reasonably priced and are certified under the AIHTS agreement. Thats why I like them.

I do lose some of the permanent boxes but not as many as you would think. I have lots that have been in service for more than 10-years. As for traps, yes you can buy cheaper traps but I will catch more marten. My favorite marten trap is the Savegeu 2000-5. Last year I kept track and with the Belisles I missed 19 marten.....with the 2000-5s I missed none.

I have tried the flower pots.....to much messing around.....I want a box that the trap will fit inside and stay there with no nails or wire needed to hold it in place. My wooden boxes do stack together, and I can have a set put in in under 2 minutes. IMO lure is more important than bait....I use either Gusto or Marten Magic....even at -40 it leaves a scent trail.

well for us its not a big deal hauling in boxes, trapline is very flat, no hills. Throw in a couple boxes each trip, no big deal. and i have to agree with yukon, once they are screwed on there is no messing around, trap stays in the box really nice. what works for best for us doesnt have to work best for you guys.

we did find a couple ruined boxes last trip in but they are fixable, a few were torn down but not as many as we had expected.

"As for traps, yes you can buy cheaper traps but I will catch more marten." I have a hard time believing that because I buy expensive traps I will catch more marten, I know guys that catch 100 plus marten a year on cheap duke #0 longsprings ($62 a dozen). I looked up the savegeu 2001-5 and I can see why nobody here uses them at that price as they are more expensive than Belisles!!!

Yes to each there own, I'm frugal I guess and prefer to maximize my profits especially with the price of gas these days. I plan on using the snowshoes more this year for side lines to save money so I'm glad we can still use footholds here........

I believe you would need to peruse the entire data to answer all your questions White,but for example-here is a paragraph on the kania trap.
In 1989 and 1990 the Kania trap caught significantly fewer martens\100 trap nights than the LDL contained,conibear box horizontal,box open up,box open down,box on post,tin box on post.In 1990 and 1991 after enlarging the bait compartment to accommodate a larger bait the kania capture rate increased 1.7 fold.Bait was now the same as trapper standard one half kilo of meat,in the Trappers Box (Hauth Box) and Bird Box.

Visitations as well as captures was recorded.A visit occurred if a marten was captured or if there were marten tracks within 15 meters of the set.
Trappers were selected for their willingness to participate and to keep consistent and accurate records.Having a sizeable marten quota was a prerequisite.
Because the study was designed as a complete factorial with traplines as randomized blocks we assumed homogeneity among traplines and pooled data from all traplines for scientific analysis.
Project co-ordinators accompanied trappers in the field throughout the winter on a regular basis to ensure protocols were being followed and that trappers did not deviate from their original instructions.
Comparisons of ratios among trap and set types used maximum likelihood of goodness-of -fit tests adjusted by Williams correction factor.Multiple comparisons based on \100 trap nites of \100 visits were performed by evaluating overlap of simultaneous confidence intervals of proportions.Multiple comparisons of ratios were performed using a stepwise test procedure.

Dirt,I don't set ground boxes for marten-those are on water for mink.I cant help it if the Marten don't know the difference,lol.

Thanks Boco. That pretty much confirms my suspicions that the marten enters the box because it's bigger, not because of the size of the bait.

Also, 15 meters is a long ways as far as I'm concerned. I wouldn't consider that a 'visitation'. That just points out how completely subjective the whole exercise is.

That REALLY is the last thing I'll say on this thread

Birchcreekkid, The difference with the savegeu 2000-5 is the trigger......nothing get past that pitchfork trigger. We cant use legholds so thats a non issue here.

Lots of guys here use the Belisle....I dont just because of the trigger. Yes I could change the trigger out and have on a lot of older traps but anytime I buy new I get the 2000-5s. I also like the longer springs.

Not quite White,the bait compartment was elongated(cut,extended upwards and re-welded) on the kania not made larger to accommodate the larger bait.
Also the hole for the LDL pan trap was made smaller and the bait divider was moved forward to achieve a better strike location,and did not affect visitation.
I tend to have more faith in studies that involve actual trappers out on the trapline.I have used information from trappers involved as well as from the study itself,to improve my methods.Not everything in a study is useful to everyone,you need to take what you can use out of it and try stuff to suit your own needs on the trapline.
Personally I like a very large bait aways from the actual trap,as a draw for dispersing juveniles.

And then there were marten in my area. That don't fit into any study.

I will put a few more box sets just to say. They are not always the answer. Tried them one year and won't again. Not worth the weight and bulk on the distances I have to travel. Found no difference in resistance using them alongs side pots.







By far and large I have had more refusals on these than anything as I set more of them.


Try seeing this 50 times or so in a day. ;0)


I have seen things change from one year to the next in drastic proportions.
Many of you remember this check of my sets. Not to brag but so show that I do know how to catch marten at times.



Thought I had found the answer in bait. Just to be outsmarted the next year. With 80% of the marten traveling right by the same sets that took marten the year before. Same bait, same time of year, same type of sets. Back to the drawing board.

I have found the marten in my area to be them most unpredictable animal I have ever trapped. At least a coyote you can figure on him being cagey. Never have I trapped marten in other places that demonstrated such indifference at times.
But the master of experimentation that I am. I don't stop until I get the upper hand.
I will put this out there.
1. When guys that catch large numbers of marten speak I listen.
2. When there is a need for change, I do.
3. When you think you have it all figured out. Things can change.
4. With much experimentation in the area I trapped the last 8 years would I ever rely solely on one type of trap for marten.
5. Never will I buy a 110 or 120 trap for a marten again. I would go no smaller than the 155-160's. I have now proven over and over that in a time of being possible resistance the 110 or 120 and its small size is the first trap that will be avoided. I have learned things over the last two years that have me totally setting up for marten differently than ever before. That only predominantly came about with setting multiple types of traps and snares on the way to the bait.
Try it sometime. You might be a little surprised what happens.
All this to say that if you have found something that works for you. Great. It may not for others. You can all argue and say what you want about your sets. I am all ears, as others are. It is what helped me the most in trying different things. But the bottom line. If I guy is serious about getting marten he does what works best for him in his area. If a guy is not willing to adapt then he will be missing out on catching more fur. To each his own.

Can't forget the tip up set. I like to use it in areas that will have a longer check time. Gets them safe. I like the natural cubby on the ground best with a tip up. Foot trap over a conibear.



A natura cubby will produce more for me but it is a lot longer to setup.




One trick on the tip up. Go with a lot longer pole when cutting green than you think you need. Small diameter and long. Then next year you use it it will weight less than half its original weight. And operate a lot different. Perhaps not working at all for a tip up. A long pole can be re used with a different tie. Don't use wire to attach the pole to the main tree. It will rust and break leaving you with no pole the next year. Leave the pole vertical over the summer. Use a piece of wire to hold it in place. Makes for a better setup next year. Not down from rocking in the wind. And covered in snow on the ground end.

And then there is the real wild card that can't be ignored. A gray jay in a trap is a marten potentially not caught.
The biggest reasons I went from foot traps to conibear in the first place.

If it worked all the time. The flower pot with a conibear tip up or off the side of a tree would be my preferred set. With a 110 duke. ;0) Few birds, and weather proof cheap to get setup. In my temps I can still get 60% or so of the marten out of a the trap. As it is I would never buy this setup again for the area I trapped. Just saying. Sometimes we can't have our cake and eat it too. ;0)

I don't think birchcreekkid actually realizes that the cheaper conibears and footholds are actually illegal in Canada. heh.

There are fairly strict rules regarding dispatch times and what not to certify a trap legal there. (That is the AIHTS reference) Canadians would have to clarify.

I do feel fortunate that I get to choose what traps I use for myself.

Use vanilla plant pots here, not that happy with them overall and am sure wooden boxes are better, but because of weight and packing issues use em anyways. (Can't leave boxes out over the summer at all, completely not an option due to VERY high bear pops) Use a piece of surveyors tape over the top to dual purpose hold the trap in and mark the set and make for easy checking from a distance. You get used to it and it adds only seconds. There are a lot of things I would do differently if didn't have to worry about heavy snow so much. I will say that I very much prefer the pots that are large enough to fit the trap inside, don't like the smaller ones at all.

Have to agree with that !