I'm gonna ask the age old question on calibers.

-I need one for coyote.
-I don't want a large caliber suitable for deer.
-I'll keep shots under 600 but likely in the 2-400 range.
-I don't want to destroy the fur badly. I'm gonna make a magic carpet out of them.

Just sometimes a livestock killing yote needs some lead poisoning.

I've got a .204 ruger which has been sweet but I feel like I can do better.

No you can't do better than a .204 that's what I use. Love it!

I have a 204 I use for this as well, can't find anything wrong with it, LOL

I gave up using my 22-250, to use the 204, doubt I'll ever go back.

But you asked for a different caliber, get a 22-250, lots of 22 calibers, 17's too that have this range. More selection of ammo in the 22's though.

.17 Remington

6.5 creedmore will flatten them WAY out there. I haven't used one yet but have buddys that can hit the 500 yrd gong off hand with theirs! I prefer a .243 with a 55grn. I can reach out and touch them with that without terrible fur damage. All Marines know how to sew, so it wont matter what you shoot one with. lol

ne 50 bmg's please!

17mach4 or 17 fireball would be a good choice. They are more efficient than the 17 remington and velocity is within 100fps or so. I've shot many coyotes, P-dogs, badgers.crows and a few other things and theyworked great. Not much fur damage at all and they shoot flat. My $.02
Jwrdn

google the 22 TTDH, or the 22/6mm AI both more than capable at 600 yards, but they are reload only propositions. factory loads? 22/250 (a faster twist barrel) or a 243.
RR

A 22 short will cause the least amount of damage
Don't won't big holes in that magic carpet lol!

If you can make a magic carpet, you can work some magic and remove big bullet holes .22-250

17-204 with chan nagel 30 grain hollowpoint

Let me out of your backpack and point me in the right direction. I'll just run em down

I really like .223 with a 45 grain superformance

.221 fire ball for 300 and under, very hide friendly, 22-250 there after.

I was thinking about another creedmor. I shot a hog at 400 with a .50 bmg. Went straight through him and never expanded. I expected a pink mist like you wouldn't believe. Looked like a red popcorn fart and had to trail him 60 yards.

I don't reload and thus .22-250 is my pick. I've shot several with my AR in .223 and no problems until I get beyond the 250 yard range.

Take a look at stag arms model 6 ar..223/5.56 1/2 moa guaranteed .they make it in left hand also ! It's heavy 10 lbs but 400 yards won't be a problem.Ive done more sewing with the 22-250 than my .243.Buds gun shop has them for a little over 800.00

.220 Swift

John, just like Jayme said. 22-250

Don't know why you don't like the .204. Maybe bullet choice? 35 grain Bergers are the best fur bullet by far.

I'm not expert but I believe bullet type has to do more with pelt damage than caliber to some extent. A .308 with a fmj will do less damage than a 22-250 with a ballistic tip.

Goldy, I like the .204, I just think I'm tricking myself into thinking it's too light. I'll be moving to Montana in a few years. The wide open terrain where I'll be will be perfect for a 400 to 600 yard shot. I've got the capability and just want to make sure I have a gun that matches me.

Again, maybe I haven't given the 204 the proper test but I feel maybe it's too light?

You may be right. I've only cared about killing things with bullets the last many years but I shot a couple yotes with my .204 and it left a hole that looked like superman punched in them.

22-250
center mass is good to go
little high or little low
you learn to sew

35gr Berger in my T.20 works good for me, most of my shots are under 350 yds
if you need further shots, a 52gr hollow point in a 22-250 should work

...gone are the days when the challenge of the Hunt was to bring the animal in.

the .204 is fine

Before I spent the money on a new gun, unless you just want another gun, try the 35 grain Bergers. Night and day the bullet choice makes. I personally don't own one, my hunting partner does. But I do all his skinning and put-up. Before he switched to 35 grain Bergers, I was doing a LOT of sewing. Some were just destroyed beyond usable. Now most of the time the bullet doesn't come out, especially out past 200 yards. Wind drift doesn't seem to be a big issue, because at 4,000 fps, the bullet gets there before the wind has much of a chance to drift it.

my barrel is 25" , shorter the barrel sooner the bullet falls on distance

22-250 seems the general concensus. Maybe I'll ask Barbara Boxer and Nancy Pelosi and the queen of them all.....Dianne Feinstein while I'm out here.

I agree. But in this case, losing the chance on some of these yotes isn't acceptable. Trapping isn't enough for the livestock killers where I'll be and I need to have the capability to reach.

Sounds like wise words, Goldy. I'm gonna give this a try and see what I come up with.

May get a 22-250 also. Lol. Maybe I'll call it my retirement gift to myself. I'll start saving now.

If you are wanting to wipe out livestock killers at any distance then I would look at one of the many 6mm calibers and run 105 grain amax or 105 grain Berger hybrids

You can never have too many guns.

You might experience a little wind east of the mountains in Mt. You will want to shoot heavier bullets. At 600 yds in a stiff breeze a coyote gets pretty small. I would get the 22-250 or a .243.

Absolutely! 204's are absolutely awesome. I have a lot of varmint guns .17 Remington,204,22-250,220 swift etc.. They are all good choices,but more importantly is going to be your bullet choices. Do you reload? If not then it is hard to beat 22-250 for factory load choices-40 grainers are cooking and shoot very flat with less damage when you get them out there past 250 yards,past that is where the 52-55 grain pills will outshine the lighter bullets.

It is a really tough question to answer-way too many variables. But I would tell you that if I had stuck to one gun one caliber I would have been a much better shooter at both short and long range. My confidence would have been way higher as well.Get to know your 204 as good as you can-you will be a much better long range shooter for doing it INSTEAD OF BUYING YET ANOTHER CALIBER AND GUN TO LEARN/USE.JMHO

you could try a scope that is set up for .204, range it then move scope turrants for distance and wind

one thing I like about my T.20, it can shoot 3 shot one hole groups @100 yds, my .223 never did better than a half inch @100yds

.243 with 60 gr sierra hp.

USMC, my son is a marine and when he was out there for SOI, he was a little sad the sargeant wouldnt let him pop the coyote out beyond the rifle range.

Man, bunch of good info in here. Now it's time to work. I'll be back. Please keep paying taxes. Lol.

Montana, in places is quite windy. I have a .204 and shoot 35 gr bergers. Love it. However, for the parameters you listed, the 22-250 is far better suited. I have one in ackley improved. Love that gun. Lights out in the 200-400 yd range. I know the predator control guy in Great Falls. He shoots 6.5x284, but predominantly long range. In the 700-1000 yd range. Again, love the .204, but loses to much energy downrange, and since you're not shooting prairie dogs, go with 22-250 for 200-400 yard coyotes.

Great old round, I use it or a 243 with 55 grain sierra blitzkings.

Haha, marine. I just saw on other post you are moving to Augusta. Those winds off the front are tremendous. 200-400 you might just have to move up to the 6mm range.LOL

Big dog get a 22 250 of its got to big a hole give it to a Afghan and tell him it's a magic turban lol

Never owned a 204. Never heard any complaints about it. I like my 22 250 though I don't see any advantage one over the other. 250 is a decent deer rifle out to about 250. No idea how the 204 would be. I'm guessing you want an excuse to buy yourself a present. Take a look at the 22 hornet. Will reliably kill coyotes out to about 75 yards. ( tough animal. miss the heart at distance good chance it will die someplace you won't find it) Absolutely fox medicine with little damage to about 200. Badgers, cats beaver same thing. Great bait gun for prairie dogs and jack rabbits. You will be happy with yourself for buying one.

I use a 243 win with a sierra HP bullet and lapua brass loaded with alliant or hodgdon powder. Bullet selection is key in any of the cartridges listed.. I like the Sierra hollow points for fur, they dont expand rapidly like a ballistic tip will sometimes at close range high velocity. I also have a 22-250 in the cabinet for coyotes, I use the Sierra 55gr gamekings in it. Sierra ,hornady and Nosler bullets, all of them shoot well. See what bullet your gun prefers to shoot. I like the 6mm bullets for thier high ballistic coefficient -bucking the wind a little better then those smaller calibers.

IMO once you get past 350-400 yards the .22s and smaller just don't have the B.C. to buck the wind the way the 6mm and larger do. The possible exception being something with a fast twist that is set up to shoot the 69+ grain .22 caliber bullets at a healthy starting velocity. My old tang safety ruger .22-250 may get a new 1:7 barrel for this exact thing.

Right now I shoot a .223 and .22-250 and my kids have a couple youth .243s with short barrels that have performed well on coyotes. I am seriously considering something along the lines of a 6mm-06, 6mm Ackley, or .243 Ackley for those coyotes that hang up at 350+. I picked up a .25-06 a couple days ago to play with but it will most likely turn into a donor action/stock for the 6-06. I hunt with my kids and wife mostly these days so they will be shooting anything inside 250 or so with ARs, short barreled .243 or the .22-250.


My daughter shot this young coyote at 62 yards square in the chest while it was looking at her. It had no significant exits with a 100 grain power point out of her 16.5" barreled .243. I was expecting a mess. Solid chest hits cover a lot of sins.

Hey Marine I'm pretty sure you already new you were gonna need a heavier bullet for the conditions you are expecting out there. The reason I bought the .243 was because you can now buy 55 grain bullets for it and push one out the barrel at about 4000 ft./ second. What I found was that my rifle doesn't like them very much, averaging just under an inch at one hundred yards. That's on a calm day ! As the years have gone by I've settled on a 65 grain hornady ballistic tip and done very well out to 670 yards. I've never had an exit hole even at 90 yards on any well placed shots ( this shouldn't be a problem for a man that makes a living with a gun, ) ! My point is these days you can buy a seventy grain bullet for the 25-06 and push it out the barrel at about 4000 ft/ second and you have plenty of room for fine tuning with heavier bullets for high wind conditions.

What ever you buy I'm sure you will figure out how to make it do what you want !
Regards,
Don

Yes. Please ask them. Ask them to stand out about 200 yards. Then check the damage.

Mike

you can really make about any .22 cal centerfire work, throu selected choice of bullet size, weight and velocty, really.......there gonna be no "ONE" perfect caliber and bullet combo that fits all requirements.....and depends a lot on what YOU want....do you want extreme range and accuracy as your no. 1 and fur damage kinda 2nd place, or you want minimel fur damage, at expense of some long range flat trajectory and knockdown, kinda hard to have the "perfect" one for both.........Ill tell a simple one....shoot a 223, with 40 gr bullets, and fast as ya can throw em....you somewhat end up with velocity and tragectory of a 22-250, and reasonable fur damage gun.....40 gr. ballistic tips at max 223 velocity around 3500 (ya gotta be able to push past max loads data in loading books to do this) pretty much stay inside the dog past a 100 yards....and if you can hold shots in a 3" circle at 300 yards, and can put them in the correct spot w/o hitting shoulders, your gonna drop and find most that ya shoot......in a rather simplistic view.....if I wanted extreme range and accuracy Id max out a 250 or a 220 swift.......

All the depredation guys out west that I know, who kill coyotes all year, prefer the .220 swift.

if wind is the main hurdle just get as fast a twist as you can, go with the highest BC bullet that ya can, any 2 given bullets of the same BC, fired at the same velocity, drift and drop exactly the same, regardless of weight or diameter, in other words an 80 gr 22 bullet will drop and drift less than an 80 gr 6mm shot at the same muzzle velocity.
RR

6.5 Grendel? 223 75 grain bthp Hornady reaches out pretty good, but for flat reaching out 204 ruger sits on top, until it gets windy. 75 grain would sure have an advantage. Of the 3 I stated I own 2. 223/204. I use mine a lot hunting in the ocean. Seals. The 204 is good on calm days. 200-350 yards. The 223 I use a leupold mark ar scope, has drop out to 600. Kinda cheating but my meat is what I'm after. 204 is like a laser. Point an shoot. Can't beat it on a calm day. Zeroed at 200 yards. All three test rounds are always touching @ 200. the 28" pro hunter barrel helps, all my varmint rounds are bull barrel. Heavy yes, trade off accuracy.

What kind of ranges are you guys shooting out to with the .204?

I have a Rem. 700 in .204 and a Rock River ar15 in 223. The weight difference alone keeps the 204 in the truck, I'd like to shoot the long gun once I get some shells reloaded.

I can also think of some dogs I wouldn't have killed this year without an autoloader. Just something to keep in mind when you have 2 or more come in.

the 204, to 400 yards mirrors the 223's trajectory with a 35 gr bullet, a better bullet in the 204 will help.
RR

Longest 550 yards with 204. Dead calm. Dead crane.

17 hornet marine boy!!

Hornady 32 grain vmax, top notch in my rifle. Wasn't to fond of 35 grain Berger. Didn't shoot as good groups as I'd like. Guess what works in 1 gun don't work as good in another.

have taken a couple groundhogs at 550 with a plane jane 223, 55 gr hornaady sp in reman ammo
RR

6.5 creedmoore insane ballistics.

Of course since I said that last night, I tipped this one over today at 361 yards according to my range finder with my AR.




~ADC~

Since the wind is always just a gentle breeze around here I really lik my .6mm Remington or the .25-06 I'm pulling everyone's leg about the wind, our forecast is for wind speeds of 30-50 mph with gusts up to 70 mph.
Stay Safe out there.
Allan

Anyone know if you can buy ..204 brass and what it goes for?

Hey John, I think calling one in and then blowing it up with a hand grenade would be more fitting for you ... those pale Montana coyotes aren't all that anyways.

Yes you can buy .204 brass somewhere in the 25-30 dollar range per 100.

big hole in that one

I bought 500 rounds of imi brass, all I have to do is remove the powder, bullet, primer, and form it to tactical .20, imi best brass I know of

Now I hate all of you. Lol. Ill just stick to my throwing knives.

I think every single one of you are making sense.

It's really easy John buy one of each of the above mentioned rifles besides you have kids right and they're going to need a rifle sooner than later anyway.
Allan

Allan, I'm gonna need to come cry on your shoulder. Lol.

All I know is I watched 2 yotes run from the cattle from across the river while I was there and I felt naked because I didn't have something to reach.

I know a lot of 6MM and 25 cal,s even some 22 cal, load VLD bullets are capable of making 500-700 yard shots, but in the real world of calling, there aint THAT many people that can realistically make those 600 plus yard shots.....sure the right gun and right man can shot 2-6" groups at that yardage, off a bence w/ sandbagged gun or even prone w/ a bipod, but of most the time calling your sitting on your hauches, with a longer pr of shooting sticks, with more wobble, and it AINT that easy....remember a broadside coyote chest is about 8" max, so figure out there 6-700, you 4" low, or 4" high usually is a miss.......and unless your DARN good at estimating range, or always got a rangefinder on hand, your just about out of the ballgame before ya start.....under or over estimate range 30-50 yards your bullet drop alone just takes ya outta the ballgame.....Im sure there a FEW guys, and a few on here, that can consistanly do it, with the right gun, and prolly a rangefinder in hand, unless youve been doing a LOT of long range shooting over a number of years, and one of them things if you dont stay in practice constantly you get a little rusty.......I kinda think MOST of time, those super heavy VLD bullets, arent going to be the best fur bullet over the entire range spectrum, and many times requires a custom barrel w/ a special twist.......Im gonna say for 90% of the shooters out there, would more served shooting a 22 c/f cal, with 55 gr bullet weight max, and better yet 50 grains, and stay fur friendly on the bulk of 100-300 yard shots, and still have good chances at the occasional 400-500 yards........lets face not EVERYONE is a marine corps sniper capable shooter....even if ya THINK you are......and even some of them guys, im betting based on a 8" chest cav coyote, might have a tough time on some 600 yard coyotes compared to center mass of a human, where ya got about 24" from the crotch to the head (12" high or low)....Im not trying to take anything away from anyone, as some can pull off such shots, when everything is lined out right....

Back when I used to call/shoot alot, got me a 400 yard view right straight in front of me, pretty much got it all planned hes gonna come right straight in from my desired shooting position, got the gun on the sticks wiggle rock solid into the dirt, been shooting alot and know the gun and the load.....and they come in 90 degrees to where i think, move the bipod, now my sticks are wiggling,and I got one leg of bipod on a dam rock that that moves too much, scopes at a cant, etc ,etc....and I miss the durn thing at a 125 yard, LOL

I went thru the phase where I shot enough when shooting p'dogs and bench shooting all the time (20 years ago kinda pre-rangefinder days), that I had the gun to shoot 500 yards, and got thinking Im GOOD enough to shoot coyotes consistanly at 500 yards......but my back couldnt hack dragging in the shooting bench to every stand....LOL

good post rich

running away coyotes getting shot at just makes them more afraid of humans, take the good high percentage shots , get more killed that way.

Will, I think you're onto something. I can sell finger warmers with all the little pieces. Lol.

X47

I agree with you Rich, I for one have missed coyotes this winter that I normally wouldn't miss. I'm planning on many a trip to the range with more than one of my rifles.
John watching them coyotes run isn't fun on days like that.
Allan

Judd, keep my beer cold. Lol.

long range shooting isn't by any means hard, just takes a bit of practice with a well set up rifle, I was as good as I will ever be in 2008, I shot 3 rounds per week, but nothing got too far away that I couldn't hit.
RR

Hey big fella...It is going to be just a tad windy up in that part of the state. If you get one of those 17's you might look like Angelina Jole curving bullets.
Lots of good advice on here but I would listen to Allan and the other Montana guys. They live there and they know what it takes. I personally shoot a 223 or a 243. I have killed loads of but sniffers out past 400 with both but if it is windy the 223 stays home and the 243 with a 90gr FMJ is in the truck. If those butt sniffers start messing with the calves in the spring both of them stay in the truck and the trust rusty 270 comes out. Any hit is a good hit with a 130gr on a calf killer.

A real good caller I knew in Wy, and this guy could shoot, started shooting a 17 Rem and loved it the first 10-15 coyotes, then he missed one like 3 times at a 100 yards.....while snowing.....he took it out on his bench the next time it was snowing and said it shot about 5 gallon bucket groups in the snow......

1x8 twist 75-77 bthp match rounds 223. 18" barrel. Reach out an touch. Anything bigger will blow up your yote.

.204 brass is not available now unless you get the Hornady brand and its a bit too much $$

Why shoot them ???

Set leg holds and snares !!!

Oh, yes I forgot, you moved to the land of tree hungers

Big Marine like you should just throw rocks and kill them at that range! Probably too much damage though... When I was living out west way back, I had a 22-250 and a 243. I liked them both but eventually sold the 22-250. At the long ranges I thought they had a little advantage over the smaller calibers some of my friends carried. I do agree with others that the type of bullet makes a huge difference. Today there are many good ones to choose from and whatever rifle you choose, experiment with the ammo until you find what it likes best. A great scope will make a world of difference too. Being a rich CWO you should just buy one each of the above mentioned... lol Good luck with your choice!

I measured some coyote carcasses. Kill zone is only 4 1/2" - 5" high on a broadside coyote. 3 1/2" - 4" wide head on. All that fluff makes them look a lot bigger than they are.

Now also keep in mind that the augusta area now has a good population of wolves as you move toward the front. Was shed hunting probably 10-15 mi from augusta, south of Gibson reservoir, and I saw lots of wolf tracks. Son ran into one about 75 yards out a week later. Love this area.

22-250 preferably in left hand gets my vote ..lol . Using hornady 52 grAmax bullets not loaded overly hot , pinhole entrances and rarely an exit .

I hear you! lol I have a .222 remington, and a .22-250. But I usually take my .22 LR when I go calling. I like the challenge.

22-250 is fast.

Devil Dog- I use a 223 Hornady Superformance 53gr Vmax.

They are dead dogs walking!!
Nay NOT help.... But you can't beat this set up. I got my furthest woodchuck at 650 with this...

Ridiculous

That's what it seems to me too,But these guys say you can get it!

Bet he had a bad scope, those 17's don't burn out that fast !!

Lol. I'm rolling in money, brother. Might go buy me a whole gun shop. Lol. I figured after nearly 25 years of service I'd deserve a new gun so I'm saving now. These kids are eating my paycheck.

will, it doesn't get much nicer in my opinion but I've never been to Wyoming. I'm sure your area is about.as nice...

Next snowstorm we get I'm going to shoot a few rounds through my .17, I'm doubting that very much too..

I almost feel guilty not hijacking my own post.

Will a duke 1.5 kill out to 400yds? Lol.

I need to start a new thread to see who all is going to live near me when I move.

I hope you like cheap beer USMC. I sold that mink yesterday for a whopping $4, LOL!

22-250 just dont shoot bone wont have to worry about big holes...

Lol. Don't you know Marines drink cheap beer? 1 beer is good....conversation is best. I'll bring the beer. I think we found a house in Fort Shaw.

Cool. I lived in Fort Shaw when we first moved here in the 90's.

hook up with Kirby Allen when ya get to fort shaw, he knows just a bit about rifles
RR

Kirby Allen? Is he on here?

I've wanted a Ruger mini14 in the 30 or 223, but I dont know if it would make a good coyote gun. I believe it would ride in my snowmobile nicely though,and take some abuse.

+1

Run the numbers of a 17-204 or heck even a 17 remington shooting 30 grain Kindler Golds bullets vs. a 22-250 shooting 50 grain bullet to 500 yards. You will see the 17 drifts less and isnt that far behind in energy numbers. People that think 17 cal centerfires are about as effective as a slingshot crack me up.

Les, I've always wanted one of them mini 14 ranchers for the truck.

But which caliber is the question,lol. Will the 30 do too much damage ? Handy, short, and reasonably accurate are my criteria. Especially inside a truck.

only good for 200yds?

No. He is not a trapper but he owns Allen Precision in Fort Shaw. We go to the same church. Good guy and a wealth of shooting knowledge.

Love my CZ .17 HORNET! Kills them very well, and no fur damage!

Originally Posted By: USMC47
Saskboner, you just hanging out on the beach drankin margaritas? That's some high class stuff right there. Lol.

And here I thought you were drinking coyote shooters. Why don't you tell me what they taste like?

no, find him at allen precision shooting.com, best smith I ever dealt with
RR

Kabar would be my choice!!!!

Me I use a 243 shooting 58 gr.. hornday out of a bullet action savage that cuts holes out to 300 yds love this rifle .. anything within the 400 yd range is dead.

17 hornet marine boy!!!!

I cant beieve that this crowd can not know that U are only string the pot,,,,,,.....(fumbs up little wiggy carrictor)

Love my .220 Swift...it kills em dead...sometimes a little too dead. ..but it is a great round...imho