Can someone share some knowledge of the old NH 4s with offset jaws and teeth? Are they just 14s with a number 4 pan? I was told it was the original 14 prior to having the 14 pans the number 4 pans were used. Is this correct?

Where is Digger Dale when you need him?

This is where, perhaps, discussion of the "Deer Trap" comes in??? I thought a #4 with offset and teeth and HEAVY jaw posts was considered a "Deer Trap". Though the trap itself does NOT say "Deer Trap" on it anywhere...........

Again, I may be mistaken..................

MZ

I havd one coming in mail. I’ll post pics next to a 14 when it shows up but it looks exactly like a 14 from what I could tell when I bought except the pan.

The details that I use to distinguish the early #4 "deer traps" from later 14 traps with 4 pans are: the early traps will have a small #4 pan with no patent information stamped, the jaw posts will have very rounded corners as all early posts do, the jaws will have a slightly greater gap(this feature does not seem consistent) and the trap will have a very heavy cast 8 chain.

To answer martinpine's original question; The first #14s were just #4s with offset jaws with teeth.
I think the #4 offset with teeth was first introduced around 1865, close to when the #0 and #1 1/2 came out. Sometime in the late 1880s the name was changed to #14.
I have noticed that the early #4 offsets with teeth should have a small pan and the jaw casting marks will be on the underside of the jaws. As opposed to later models where the cast marks are on the leg of the jaw. (pictured below)

Newhouse did advertise the #4 offset as a Deer Trap at some point but I think it was just a marketing ploy.

Early jaws cast marks

Later jaws cast marks

Several different variations on these as they progressed on the way to the #14. That first Model #4 Deer trap has forged springs, long link chain, thin post nuts, and very heavy offset jaws with a flatter looking tooth. As you get farther into the progression in which most of us refer to the last model before the #14 the post nuts will be thicker and the post will have a squared off look to the top rather than the rounded look on the top edge, as well as the jaws went from a heavy wider offset jaw, to a thinner more streamlined jaw.

Here's a pic of a #4 with heavy jaws next to a Patent Date #14

Thank you this helped a lot.

I stated above that there should be casting marks under the jaw.
Always learning something new and could use some input on this.....
Here is one that the cast marks are on top of the jaw..... I can find no other cast marks and it looks like a chunk of one jaw broke off with the casting lug.....

wow great traps! very nice...!