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Germany #6546553
05/30/19 12:02 PM
05/30/19 12:02 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 4
Sachsen-Anhalt
S
Schinderberg Offline OP
trapper
Schinderberg  Offline OP
trapper
S

Joined: May 2019
Posts: 4
Sachsen-Anhalt
Any germans around?

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6546555
05/30/19 12:10 PM
05/30/19 12:10 PM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,132
Kingston, PA
TheBig1 Offline
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TheBig1  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,132
Kingston, PA
I wish that I still lived there but I don't.


You can't cheat the mountain pilgrim. Mountain's got its own ways.
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6548950
06/03/19 08:09 PM
06/03/19 08:09 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 776
MN, USA
star flakes Offline
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star flakes  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 776
MN, USA
Es gibt immer Deutsche.

Re: Germany [Re: star flakes] #6557328
06/17/19 05:16 AM
06/17/19 05:16 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 3
Victoria
B
Buckhunter2 Offline
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Buckhunter2  Offline
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 3
Victoria
Originally Posted by star flakes
Es gibt immer Deutsche.


Yes "there are always Germans around", but what do you trap?

Re: Germany [Re: Buckhunter2] #6557332
06/17/19 05:35 AM
06/17/19 05:35 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
E
Eddie43 Offline
trapper
Eddie43  Offline
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E

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
Originally Posted by Buckhunter2
Originally Posted by star flakes
Es gibt immer Deutsche.


Yes "there are always Germans around", but what do you trap?


Yes always interesting to hear what is trapped in other country's, and what traps are used. I know Germany use some interesting type traps, especially for fox.


Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6569685
07/07/19 08:07 PM
07/07/19 08:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 6,730
central Haudenosaunee, the De...
W
white marlin Offline
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white marlin  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 6,730
central Haudenosaunee, the De...
We spent two weeks in and around Frankfurt two years ago.

I had hoped (even posted here) to meet a German Trapper while we were there, but no luck.

Tell us about trapping there!

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6592141
08/10/19 05:45 PM
08/10/19 05:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4,136
Hi-Line Montana
Wild_Idaho Offline
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Wild_Idaho  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4,136
Hi-Line Montana
I second white marlin. What do you trap? What type of traps do you use or are you allowed to use?


Real name Eric
The sharpest hammer in the box of crayons.

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6612853
09/09/19 02:08 PM
09/09/19 02:08 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 4
Sachsen-Anhalt
S
Schinderberg Offline OP
trapper
Schinderberg  Offline OP
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S

Joined: May 2019
Posts: 4
Sachsen-Anhalt
Most traps used in Germany catch game alive. Since Germany is much smaller then the States or Canada there‘s always a town or village nearby. Means lots of cats and dogs and people in the woods.

Some of the traps look like this.

[Linked Image]

Snares and foodholds are forbidden.

I personally use a few conibears for marten and coon.

Trapping had a bad image for some time, but it‘s getting better.

Don‘t hesitate to ask if you have any further questions.

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6617405
09/15/19 06:11 AM
09/15/19 06:11 AM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 12,348
MT (Big Sky Country)
A
Allan Minear Offline
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Allan Minear  Offline
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A

Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 12,348
MT (Big Sky Country)
That's quite the live trap I've never seen anything like that before very interesting to say the least .

My mom was a genealogy researcher and on my dad's side with help she found relatives of mine as far back as 1300 in Germany sadly I don't know how to speak German.

Enjoy your day and Stay Safe out there !
Allan


Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6627431
09/28/19 08:53 AM
09/28/19 08:53 AM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4,136
Hi-Line Montana
Wild_Idaho Offline
trapper
Wild_Idaho  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4,136
Hi-Line Montana
I second what Allan said. Very interesting. My back hurts just thinking about packing that into the woods. grin


Real name Eric
The sharpest hammer in the box of crayons.

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6631820
10/03/19 09:46 AM
10/03/19 09:46 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,308
NE
C
conibearguy Offline
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conibearguy  Offline
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C

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,308
NE
Would love to see pictures of some of your results. Overseas trapping has always amazed me.

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6632497
10/04/19 08:53 AM
10/04/19 08:53 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
E
Eddie43 Offline
trapper
Eddie43  Offline
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E

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
Some YouTube video's showing some interesting traps from Germany












Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6632501
10/04/19 08:55 AM
10/04/19 08:55 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
E
Eddie43 Offline
trapper
Eddie43  Offline
trapper
E

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
Few more










Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6699501
12/19/19 11:46 PM
12/19/19 11:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,293
On the Sugar River, Wisconsin
longrangekilla Offline
trapper
longrangekilla  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,293
On the Sugar River, Wisconsin
My maternal grandparents were 100% German. They spoke German amongst themselves so I can understsnd some. My Grandps was in ww2 in the 1st LAH division . They were rabid Catholics and attended mass 3x a week. I have his dogtag and rosary from the war. Unfortunately he died while I was in high school.


If you're gonna be dumb, you gotta be tough
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #6763521
02/08/20 09:07 PM
02/08/20 09:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 281
Smithsburg, MD
J.C. Offline
trapper
J.C.  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 281
Smithsburg, MD
I lived there for 13 years on and off I loved every minute of it. I'd write in German but can only speak it functionally. Had to wait till I made it back to the states to get into trapping.


To a person ignorant of nature, his country stroll is a walk through a gallery filled with wonderful works of art with their faces turned to the wall
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #7043072
11/08/20 08:16 PM
11/08/20 08:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 56
Outer Banks, North Carolina
K
KrisB Offline
trapper
KrisB  Offline
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K

Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 56
Outer Banks, North Carolina
Originally Posted by Schinderberg
Most traps used in Germany catch game alive. Since Germany is much smaller then the States or Canada there‘s always a town or village nearby. Means lots of cats and dogs and people in the woods.

Some of the traps look like this.

[Linked Image]

Snares and foodholds are forbidden.

I personally use a few conibears for marten and coon.

Trapping had a bad image for some time, but it‘s getting better.

Don‘t hesitate to ask if you have any further questions.


What is the process in Germany to become a licensed trapper there? Is there public land to trap on or can you only trap on private land with permission from the property owner? Are there professional trappers there? A close Dutch friend said professional trappers are hired to trap muskrats on the dikes in the Netherlands. Is it similar in Germany with professional trapping?

Last edited by TrapperLibrarian; 11/08/20 08:19 PM.
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #7044870
11/10/20 10:23 AM
11/10/20 10:23 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 309
Oregon
R
RockCrick Offline
trapper
RockCrick  Offline
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R

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 309
Oregon
After watching the videos posted, why is there so much that goes into the construction of the traps? Concrete pipes and all that lumber, why not just use regular cages or even build larger cages if a large trap is desired?

Re: Germany [Re: RockCrick] #7045848
11/11/20 03:19 AM
11/11/20 03:19 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
E
Eddie43 Offline
trapper
Eddie43  Offline
trapper
E

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
Originally Posted by RockCrick
After watching the videos posted, why is there so much that goes into the construction of the traps? Concrete pipes and all that lumber, why not just use regular cages or even build larger cages if a large trap is desired?


Im not sure. I do know that trapping regulations are very strict in Germany. Maybe only certain area's can be trapped, and these tunnels would draw fox's to a location. I've seen pictures of traditional permanent wooden tunnels (above ground) from Europe, where a wooden trap is placed one end of the tunnel. Maybe these concrete tunnels and wire mesh traps are the modern version of these traps. Either way, I can't see how it would be worth going to all that trouble.


Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #7235957
04/05/21 08:00 PM
04/05/21 08:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 47,009
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
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Boco  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 47,009
james bay frontierOnt.
I have stayed in line cabins not much bigger than the big trap made out of wood.LOL.


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #7477829
01/29/22 05:03 PM
01/29/22 05:03 PM
Joined: Oct 2021
Posts: 115
WI
Y
YaYa Offline
trapper
YaYa  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Oct 2021
Posts: 115
WI
Back in the 80s I was stationed in Germany on a nuke site near a really big pine forest. At night we would often see what looked like a fisher or Sable climb our double fence and raid our garbage bin. What is it?
It was a very dark brown but I never got close enough to see any other markings.

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #7631340
07/20/22 07:03 PM
07/20/22 07:03 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17,589
Wheaton Ks
L
lee steinmeyer Offline
trapper
lee steinmeyer  Offline
trapper
L

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17,589
Wheaton Ks
I'm forth generation German over here, when we came to the US in 1863. My folks were fluent in German, but didn't pass it on to me. About all I learned in German was to cuss a bit by osmosis! lol

On an interesting note, the Steinmeier that was/is in the German government, is shirtail relation to me, but not sure of the exact association. I know my ancestors changed the spelling when they immigrated. My sister researched the connection back when he was Merkles right hand man!


YOU CAN IGNORE REALITY, BUT YOU CANNOT IGNORE THE CONSEQUENCES OF IGNORING REALITY.

http://www.lptraplinesupply.com
Re: Germany [Re: YaYa] #8184936
07/30/24 03:36 PM
07/30/24 03:36 PM
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
M
Manfred Offline
trapper
Manfred  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
Originally Posted by YaYa
Back in the 80s I was stationed in Germany on a nuke site near a really big pine forest. At night we would often see what looked like a fisher or Sable climb our double fence and raid our garbage bin. What is it?
It was a very dark brown but I never got close enough to see any other markings.


An old question, but maybe still interesting for some people.
Likely a Steinmarder (stone marten), Martes foina, or a Baummarder (tree marten), Martes martes.
The stone marten beeing the more common one, especially in settlements.
The stone marten has a white throat patch, the tree marten a more yellowish one.

Re: Germany [Re: RockCrick] #8184965
07/30/24 04:03 PM
07/30/24 04:03 PM
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
M
Manfred Offline
trapper
Manfred  Offline
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M

Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
Originally Posted by RockCrick
After watching the videos posted, why is there so much that goes into the construction of the traps? Concrete pipes and all that lumber, why not just use regular cages or even build larger cages if a large trap is desired?


The trapping regulations in Germany are very restrictive.
Only live catch traps not harming the animal and some instant kill traps are allowed, depending on the area.
Live catch traps must be designed to avoid any injuries to the caugth animal and have to keep it in the dark, in order to calm it down.
Instant kill traps in most cases have to be mounted in some kind of housing that can not be opend without triggering the trap, in order to avoid harm for curious or careless people, dogs etc.

The main target animal for the big concrete pipe traps is the red fox.
Adult red foxes have the reputation to be almost impossible to catch in box traps. You usually will only catch young foxes or the rare careless one.
On the other hand foxes here are used to concrecte culverts which are usesed for almost any field access across roadside ditches.
Due to our small field sizes and many roads, these culverts are everywhere and foxes use them regularly as hideouts.

These traps, once built, can stay in place almost indefinte. In the off season the shutters are fixated and the foxes can grow accustomed to the trap and use it as hideout. And when the season starts, you activate your traps with a view simple steps.

Re: Germany [Re: Manfred] #8184975
07/30/24 04:17 PM
07/30/24 04:17 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
E
Eddie43 Offline
trapper
Eddie43  Offline
trapper
E

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 186
Ireland
Originally Posted by Manfred
Originally Posted by RockCrick
After watching the videos posted, why is there so much that goes into the construction of the traps? Concrete pipes and all that lumber, why not just use regular cages or even build larger cages if a large trap is desired?


The trapping regulations in Germany are very restrictive.
Only live catch traps not harming the animal and some instant kill traps are allowed, depending on the area.
Live catch traps must be designed to avoid any injuries to the caugth animal and have to keep it in the dark, in order to calm it down.
Instant kill traps in most cases have to be mounted in some kind of housing that can not be opend without triggering the trap, in order to avoid harm for curious or careless people, dogs etc.

The main target animal for the big concrete pipe traps is the red fox.
Adult red foxes have the reputation to be almost impossible to catch in box traps. You usually will only catch young foxes or the rare careless one.
On the other hand foxes here are used to concrecte culverts which are usesed for almost any field access across roadside ditches.
Due to our small field sizes and many roads, these culverts are everywhere and foxes use them regularly as hideouts.

These traps, once built, can stay in place almost indefinte. In the off season the shutters are fixated and the foxes can grow accustomed to the trap and use it as hideout. And when the season starts, you activate your traps with a view simple steps.


Manfred, are you allowed to trap Pine Marten in Germany? They are protected here in Ireland.


Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: KrisB] #8185017
07/30/24 05:25 PM
07/30/24 05:25 PM
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
M
Manfred Offline
trapper
Manfred  Offline
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M

Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
Originally Posted by KrisB

What is the process in Germany to become a licensed trapper there? Is there public land to trap on or can you only trap on private land with permission from the property owner? Are there professional trappers there? A close Dutch friend said professional trappers are hired to trap muskrats on the dikes in the Netherlands. Is it similar in Germany with professional trapping?


For trapping animals considered game animals you first have to become a licensed hunter plus go to a trapping course and than you have to find a hunting ground with an owner or leaseholder that allows you to trap on his ground.
To become a leaseholder yourself you have to be a licensed hunter for at least 3 years.

To become a licensed hunter you have to go to a hunting school first.
There a essentially two types of courses at the hunting schools. You can either go for a about 3 week fulltime course or a course that stretches over serveral month with evening- and weekend elements so you can do it parallel to your job.
Topics are hunting-, weapons-, nature protection, hygiene- etc. regulations, knowledge about animals, plants, biotopes etc. knowledge about hunting, huter's jargon, practice in weapons handling and shooting, and so on.
Most of todays basic courses include the trapping course so you do not have to do this one seperately.
After hunting school you are allowed to a state-approved hunting exam which includes a shooting exam for both, rifle and shotgun.
When you have manged this test, you can get your hunting license which doubles as a weapons license.

The hunting grounds are organized in the so called Reviersystem (section system).
The ower of parcel technically has the hunting rights, but you need to have a rounded area of at least 75 ha to 150 ha (depending on the state) to constitute a section / a hunting ground.
If you are the owner of enough rounded land, you can get the status of a so called Eigenjagd, meaning yow own a legal hunting ground for yourself and can hunt on it, if you are a licensed hunter, or lease it to an hunter.
All other land owners are by law members of a Jagdgenossenschaft (or servel ones, if you own ground in different places, als I do).
The Jagdgenossenschaft ist a collective that sums up the hunting rigths for usually a couble of 100 ha. The members choose a management board and the joint hunting right can either be leased to somebody or manged by the collective itself. In most cases it is leased to a hunter or team of hunters.
The lease holder than can hunt on this ground and can give hunting permits to other hunters.

Larger state owened blocks are usually dived in hunting areas about the same size and leased to hunters, too.

There is no hunting on lage puplic land like in North America. It is all organized in small leases. And the owner oder lease holder decides who is allowed to hunt on his ground.

Muskrat are a separate topic. They are not native in Europe. They have been introduced in Europe in the twentieth century for there pelts.
In most parts they are now considered as pests as they do a lot of damage to levees and pond dams.
In Germany they are too not conisdered game but a pest.
If you want to trap them, you do not need a general hunting license. You go to your District Office and get a muskrat license.
You usually get an information flyer on what traps your are allowed to use, the district office registers you and off you go.
The regulations for musrat traps are much lower than those for game animals.
You can use sets without boxing them in. But you are not allowed to use creel like traps, only certain instant kill traps, and if you use bait, the bait has to be covered with some screen from obove to avoid catching waterfowel.

Some District Offices pay a prize for each muskrat caught. But only in very view cases this prize is high enough to make people hunting them as part of their living.
I never met a professional musrat trapper in Germany myself. I only have read that there are some in northern Germany who are paied to protect levees.

Trapping fur animals for their fur in order to make a living from selling the fur does no more exist in Germany.
The fur prices are very low and animals with more expensive fur like European Lynx are strictely protected.
Most predator hunting is done to protect small game like hare and pheasant.
And most hunters are hobbyists.
There are rich people who hire game wardens for their hunting grounds. And there are some professional hunters working for national parks etc.

Here a short video series an the hunters working for the National Park Berchtesgaden around Lake Königssee.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhUdH_iIijc
Main part of their job is to prevent the protective forests on the mountain sides form beeing eaten by too many red deer, roe deer and chamois.

Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8185027
07/30/24 05:34 PM
07/30/24 05:34 PM
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
M
Manfred Offline
trapper
Manfred  Offline
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M

Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
Originally Posted by Eddie43

Manfred, are you allowed to trap Pine Marten in Germany? They are protected here in Ireland.


It depends on which state you are in.
The federal hunting law allows to hunt them from Oktober 16. to February 28.
But the states have the possibity to decide on stricter regulations.
Nordrhein-Westfalen has completely removed the Pine Marten (Tree Marten) from the list of game animals. Thus you are not allowed to hunt them there.
Here in Bavaria they have a season same as by fedaral law.


Last edited by Manfred; 07/30/24 05:34 PM.
Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8186545
08/01/24 06:23 PM
08/01/24 06:23 PM
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
M
Manfred Offline
trapper
Manfred  Offline
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M

Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
Originally Posted by Eddie43
Some YouTube video's showing some interesting traps from Germany





Some explenation:

0:50
A visit to trapping and predator hunting expert Wolfgang Robel.
Wolfgang lives in northern Bavaria, about 50 km from my home.
He can be booked for seminars and lectures and he offers consultant work for gamekeeping.
http://www.fangjagd-schule.de/

1:00
Wolfgang calls in a red fox by imitating an injured hare but misses his shot.

2:55
Checking a marten trap.
This kind of spring trap is called Abzugeisen.
Foodhold-traps and spring traps triggered by pressure are forbidden.
Similar to a dog proof coon trap this Abzugeisen traps only trigger, when the animal pulls on the bait.
The bait ist attached to the trap by a piece of string or wire.
The jaws musst be big enough to catch the neck or chest of the animal, in order to cause instand death.
For marten the jaw diameter is mostely about 38 cm.
The trap has to be installed in a so called bunker.
The bunker has to be locked or equipped with a mechanism that triggers the trap if a trespasser opens the box.
The animal entrance musst have two misalined openings to prevent people and most dogs from reaching the trap through the opening with their arm or paw.
This male tree marten (Martes martes) stole fat balls from a bird feeding station. So Wolfgang used a fat ball als bait.

4:55
Checking a concrete pipe trap.
The trap is equipped with an electronic trap alert that transmitted a catch during the night.
Traps have to be checked at least once a day. Therefore many trappers use trap alerts.
The fox is forced out of the trap with a telescopic pusher and shot with a small bore revolver.
There are serveral versions of concrete pipe traps. This one was invented by Matthias Dose.
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100063675053630
Many say, the Dose system is the best, because it has no disturbing trigger parts inside the concrete pipe.
The central pipe is placed on a metal seesaw which can be adjusted for the aspired trigger resistance force.
Only if this force is exeeded, the pipe tilits a bit and triggers the trap.
The upper side of the pipe has an opening for inserting bait and visual checks.
A total of at least 5 pipes a 1 meter length should be used to make the fox feel secure in his 'culvert'.

Wolfgang has combined the trap with a Maeuseburg (mice fortress). A stack of palletes or similar, partially filled and covered with straw or dung and regularly baited with grain to attract mice to the trap side, making it more attractive to predators.

As bait inside the trap he uses a fishy bait paste called Wildmagnet (game magnet), which is very popular in Germany.
https://wildmagnet.de/
A hazelnut sized peace is engough. He refreshes it every 4 to 5 weeks or after a catch.

10:55
Visiting a group of Baujagd hunters in the Bavarian forest.
For Baujagd (burrow hunting) a small dog (mostly terriers oder wiener dogs, here called Dachshund (badger dog) as they are bred for this job) is used to drive foxes and badgers out of their burrows and shot them with shotguns.
It can happen the dog gets stuck in the burrow. Badgers sometimes even lock up a tunnel with dirt to confine the dog. Than you have to dig him out.
In areas where digging can be difficult or were usable burrows are rare, hunters built artificial burrows from concrete pipes.
These are called Kunstbau. They usually contain at least one chamber and two entrances or one entrance pipe that is splitting into two before the chamber, so the foxes oder badgers can leave throught the second tube when the dog is comming in by the first one. This design helps to reduce fights between dog and prey and injury of the dog.
https://parey-jagdausbildung.de/kunstbaue-richtig-anlegen/
https://www.reinken-betonwaren.de/produkte/fuchskunstbau/
https://shop.trapperprofi.de/trapperprofi-kunstbau-trapper-flexi-hole.html
https://www.kunstbau.de/kunstbau.html






Last edited by Manfred; 08/02/24 10:09 AM.
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8186933
08/02/24 07:47 AM
08/02/24 07:47 AM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 718
Ontario
S
Saskfly Online content
trapper
Saskfly  Online Content
trapper
S

Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 718
Ontario
Very nice post thanks for the info and the links.

Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8187086
08/02/24 11:55 AM
08/02/24 11:55 AM
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
M
Manfred Offline
trapper
Manfred  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 93
Germany
Originally Posted by Eddie43
Some YouTube video's showing some interesting traps from Germany








These are two more Matthias Dose type Wipperohrfallen (seesaw concrete pipe traps).

In the first video a stone marten (German: Steinmarder, Latin: Martes foina) was caugth on rabbit parts.

The second trap is equipped with a MinkPolice trap alert.
https://www.minkpolice.com/en/
Mid-July. The hunter is cleaning and preparing his trap and the passes leading to the trap for the season.
It is the time, when the young red foxes start do wander of and the season for adult foxes in his state begins. (Young foxes are open all year.)

He recommends to build the facing around the trap with more space than he did, to make it easyer to cleen the seesaw below the trap.
Mice like to build nests in there, which can block or drag the trigger system.
The wind has blown leaves and twigs etc. into the pipes, which are removed with a telescopic broom.

4:15
Five days later the trap alarm was triggered.
There was a thunderstorm during the night and the passes to the trap are again covered with leaves and branches and need to be cleaned.
In the trap he finds a youg male fox which is pretty small for July. He expected them to be bigger.
He calls the dog arbitrator of his huntig clup, to offer him the fox for dog trainig purposes.
(Main purpose of the predator trapping is protecting small game. The furs are almost worthless anyway, even the good winter ones. Therefore the season starts in summer, as soon as the foxes are open.)

7:55
Two more days later. The trap alarm triggerd again. The next young fox.
Most animals are calm inside these traps. Not uncommonly you even find them sleeping.
This fox is used for dog training, too.

Last edited by Manfred; 08/02/24 11:57 AM.
Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8187119
08/02/24 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Eddie43
Some YouTube video's showing some interesting traps from Germany





The Weka Invasiv trap was designed by Andre Westerkamp.
https://www.andre-westerkamp.de/
and is distributed by Krefelder
https://krefelder-fuchsfalle.de/fuchsfalle-shop/

Andre wanted a live trap according to German regulations for mainly catching invasive species like coon, nutria, muskrat and mink in wet environments like in or close to swamps, drainage ditches, small creeks, etc.
It needed to be robust und waterproof. So he made it of durable plastic and stainless steel.
I is produced in bulk to make it afordable.
And it ist light, for easy transport.

The hunter in the video bought it do catch the coons invading his hunting ground.

0:35
The coons scratch the bark of a birch tree and lick the sweet tree sap.
When the spaces between claw marks are as broad as a thumb, they are caused by adult coon.
The coons also empty the bird nesting boxes mounted on the trees.

3:16
The doors of the trap have a double security mechanism to prevent the caugth animals from breaking out.
The first mechanim is a door shutter at the bottom of the door.
The trap in the video is an older model where the shutter was mounted inside the door.
The newer traps have a shutter on the outside.
You find pictures of both, the old and new version doors, on this website:
https://www.geartester.de/berichte/lebendfalle-weka-invasiv-neues-modell
The second mechanism is a steel rod that doubles als a trigger indicator.
Wenn the door closes, the rod trops into the trap, behind the door. The door can not be opend before removing the rod and you can check your trap from afar with your binoculars. As long as the rod did not trop, the trap was not trigged.

3:45
The trap can also be equipped with a trap alart like minkpolice.

4:04
This adapter is for attaching an extraction cage, to get the prey out of the trap.

4:20
It is the second Weka trap he is installing at his hunting lease.

4:55
His first Weka was installed in an drainage ditch.
He caught a coon on his first try. But he had forgotten to put in the indicator/saftey rods.
So the coon figured out how to open the shutter on the inside of the door and leave the trap in only 10 minutes.
But 6 hours later the coons where back to exploring the trap again.

6:15
After inerting the steel rods the problem was solved and his catches stayed inside the trap.

8:20
Asian racoon dogs (Nyctereutes procyonoides) which have been introduced to Eastern Europe by man are also invading Germany.




Last edited by Manfred; 08/02/24 12:57 PM.
Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8187640
08/03/24 07:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddie43
Few more



Mostely self exlaning. The Wildmagnet mulitbunker made of concrete can be used as a live catch trap with a trapdoor or as a kill trap by installing an Abzugeisen (pull trigger spring trap) inside.
If used as a kill trap you might have to add a second, missaligned entrance in front, depending on local regulations.

There are similar systems from other providers,
like this one from Trapperprofi, made of 25 mm recycled plastic boards.


Re: Germany [Re: Manfred] #8187651
08/03/24 07:41 AM
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The Marderkobel (marten box) is a desgin to be mounted on a tree or in a barn, like a nesting box for birds.
They stay in place all year. The martens use them for sleeping or even rearing and in the hunting season the trap door is activated.
Some hunters bait them with eggs, to make them even more attractive / simulate a ducks nest etc.

Marderkobel by Kieferle:
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Marderkobel by Thale:
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]






Last edited by Manfred; 08/03/24 07:45 AM.
Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8187674
08/03/24 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddie43
Few more




The Trapper-Neozoen trap is designed for catching invasive racoon and nutria.
It is a seesaw type trap made of a 30 cm diameter steel pipe, 106 cm long.
The backside cover is avilable with or without air hole, as the customer preferes.
Weight 14 kg.

1:10
Demonstration of the coon safety spring, preventing trapped coons from opening the door.

1:30
Setting the trap. The trigger mechanism is self setting. You only need to lift the door and tilt the tube, making it very easy to set the trap.

He recomments to put some soil inside, on the bottom of the tube, and set the trap as close to the water as possible, for nutria directly on the nutria passes.
You can also put a flat stone into the shallow water und put the entrance of the trap on the stone. So the nutria can climb on the stone and into the trap.

2:40
He is demonstrating how be baits the trap with peaces of apple (using the little stones as he has no apple at hand). Some in front of the trap, some in the entrace of the trap, and most in the back end of the trap.
The trigger weight can be adujsted by the dirt you put at the bottom of the tube. If you want more trigger weight, you but more dirt close to the entrance so it takes more weight at the back end to tilt the seesaw.

Last edited by Manfred; 08/03/24 08:14 AM.
Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8187694
08/03/24 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddie43
Few more



This is the big version of the Abzugeisen, the so called Schwanenhals (swan neck)
It is used for catching red fox.
The most common jaw diameter is 56 cm.

The name Schwanenhals seems to origin from older versions, which had a spring only on ohne side, giving the closed jaws the looks of the neck of a swimming swan, putting his head in the water.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Source: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berliner_Eisen_(Jagd)

The video is from the hunting school of the Hof district (northern Bavaria) hunting club.
It is showing how to set the trap and how to use its safety features.


2:28:
He is demonstrating how the Abzug (pull) trigger mechanism works.
The bait pan has to be lifted (the animal has to pull on the bait) to trigger the trap.
Attached to the bait pan you can see the wires used for mounting the bait.

The iron rod he uses to trigger the trap is designed for manipulating the safety latches.

This can be seen in their video about the small Abzugeisen.




Like the small Abzugeisen the Schwanenhals has to be placed in a bunker for safety reasons.
In Germany outside the settelments everybody is allowed to walk on farm and forest land as he pleases as long as he causes no damage.
So in the forests practically all year and an farmland in winter and whenever the fields are harvested or mowed.
Even in the remotest areas of Bavaria, the national park districts in the east, we have population densities of more than 200 people per sq mile.
So you can be sure alomost every trap will be found and checked by somebody.
In olden times, when people still respected others property and still had eyes in their heads and could see or even read warning signs, you could use such traps in open settings.
Todays regulations allow the use only in secured bunkers.

For the Schwanenhals mostly Kunstbau like bunkers with a locked chamber and entrances through long concrete pipes (too long to reach the trap with an arm) are used.
Here some pictures taken from the website of German trap manufacturer Weisser.
The sides of the bunker and part of the pipes are dug in for damouflage and to stop trespassers from moving the pipes and reaching into the chamber.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Source: http://www.fallenbau-weisser.de/fangbunk.htm
On the website you can also see bunkers for the small Abzugeisen.



Last edited by Manfred; 08/03/24 09:07 AM.
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8187913
08/03/24 02:02 PM
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The Krefelder Fuchsfalle is another of the concrete pipe systems.
In this type of trap, the cental concrete pipe has a seesaw cut out of its bottom.
https://krefelder-fuchsfalle.de/home/

A video aboud installing this trap. I think it is self explaning.




Cutting the seesaw board and the cover plate.




Cleaning the seesaw mechanism after flooding washed sediment into the trap:




They also have a pre-assembled variant that can be transported with tractor and front-end-loader:


Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8187954
08/03/24 02:56 PM
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Wipprohrfalle 'Trapper' from TrapperProfi
https://www.trapperprofi.de/



As in the Dose systeme the whole central pipe is used as a seesaw.
In this older version TrapperProfi put the seesaw mechanism on top of the pipe. The pipe is hanging in the seesaw.

On the bottom of the central pipe they drilled some small holes so that leaking moisture from the bait can seep there and not at the ends of the seesaw. So the most intensive smell stays in the middle of the pipe and the fox has to go their do check it and has to step on the seesaw.

The brick on top is used to balance the seesaw for dirt in the bottom or heavy baits etc.
The minimum release weight is about 500 g and can be adjusted upwards by an adjusting screw as needed.

The doors have a racoon safety mechanism. The thorn on the back of the tool shown at 1:40 is used for releasing the safety while the hook graps the door for lifting it.

3:35
After blancing the seesaw with the brick an setting the trigger, the doors ar put back in and the trap is ready to catch.



A video of a newer version with some improved details.
The seesaw mechanism is now mounted to the flanks of the pipe, which makes the system cheeper to produce.
The trap can be equiped with a trap alert.



Pictures of assembling the trap:
https://www.trapperprofi.de/fallenaufbau.html

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8189244
08/05/24 10:49 AM
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Wodden box trap. Original design by Andre Westerkamp, refined by trap manufacturer and trapper Karsten Sambleben (the guy in the red vest).

It uses a tripwire-trigger with a snap trap for rats used as booster.
As trip wire he uses a multi-strand fishing leader that is connected to the rat trap by a spring cotter. This way the leader is realeased after triggering the rat trap, and is falling down to the bottom. The cotter is fastend with florist tying wire.
Before he used the spring cotter the leader often was destroyed by the caugth animal and had to be replaced after almost each catch.



The wood used is Siberian larch. The top is covered with pond liner.
The trap doors are made of screen printing plate, because these distort less than pure wood. He covers the sawn edges of the plates with a special waterproof, uv-resistant glue. He says this glue does not get cracks like paint does over time.
The laths beyond the trap doors and the lower edges of the doors are covered with steel profiles. Else the animals would chew throuh them.
The laths close the gaps between door an box. This has to be done do make the inside of the closed trap light-tight, als required by regulations.

1:50
The red marks are there to remember you to close the lock bars.
A friend of his forgot this once and the fox caught climped into the upper part of the trap and chewed up his expensive trap alert.

He is building 2 versions. A 2 meter trap for coon and marten and a 2,4 m version for fox and badger.
(Clear height 34 cm, clear width 32 cm)

In his experience a box trap has to be in the same place for at least one year before it is accepcted by adult red foxes. Before that you usually only catch young ones.

7:30
Instead of using the trip wire, you can also use bait attachet to a trigger wire. He sometimes uses a plaster egg, but you can also use natural eggs and use hot glue to attach them to the wire.
He sais the egg should lay on the floor of the trap, but have no more than a few cm play before the trigger is released. This can be adjusted by the florist binding wire.

9:15
He sais he never had problems with other coons freeing a caught coon, despite the simple door locking mechanism. He thinks if other coons try to help, they search along the edges of the doors und do not understand they just needed to lift the slat to be able to open the door.

The upper champer of the trap has to be mouse-proof. Else the mice will climp in there and trigger the rat trap.

19:10
The door of his dispatching cage has a wire attached. He uses the wire to lift the door to let in smaller animals like marten, which often shy away from opening the door themselfs.

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8189254
08/05/24 11:05 AM
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Thank you. Very interesting traps and methods.


Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8189280
08/05/24 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Eddie43
Thank you. Very interesting traps and methods.


Many of you might laugh about how circuitous German trappers have to work.
These traps are expensive and it is much harder to lure animals into them compared to open sets.
But it is all we have left under our regulations.
And perhaps some of the ideas can be helpful in urban, highly populated areas elswhere in the world.

Re: Germany [Re: Manfred] #8189474
08/05/24 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Manfred
Originally Posted by Eddie43
Thank you. Very interesting traps and methods.


Many of you might laugh about how circuitous German trappers have to work.
These traps are expensive and it is much harder to lure animals into them compared to open sets.
But it is all we have left under our regulations.
And perhaps some of the ideas can be helpful in urban, highly populated areas elswhere in the world.


I totally understand. In many parts if Europe, trapping is so restricted, that we have to adapt trapping methods, to stay within the law.


Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8189783
08/06/24 03:51 AM
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The Wiesel-Wippbrettfalle (weasel seesaw trap).

A very simple but effective trap for stoat and weasel.
It is mostly placed in culverts and plough furrows.

It needs a mesh or similar on the closed side to allow air and light through the trap.
stoats and weasels do not like to enter the trap if the end ist completely closed.
In areas where they are not allowed to catch weasels you can drill a weasel sized hole into the lid to let them escape.

I have found an English language version video of how to make ths trap:




You can also built them out of round plastic pipes:


Re: Germany [Re: Manfred] #8189796
08/06/24 05:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Manfred
The Wiesel-Wippbrettfalle (weasel seesaw trap).

A very simple but effective trap for stoat and weasel.
It is mostly placed in culverts and plough furrows.

It needs a mesh or similar on the closed side to allow air and light through the trap.
stoats and weasels do not like to enter the trap if the end ist completely closed.
In areas where they are not allowed to catch weasels you can drill a weasel sized hole into the lid to let them escape.

I have found an English language version video of how to make ths trap:




You can also built them out of round plastic pipes:





I like that pipe version. Have not seen that before. This trap also works well on mink

[Linked Image]


Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8189812
08/06/24 06:01 AM
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They have added a gauge for the seesaw-slat, fitting for a 110 mm PVC-Pipe:
https://www.pirsch.de/sites/pirsch.de/files/2019-08/Wippbrett-Schablone.pdf
You have to magnify it for printing until the 5 cm meassurement on the gauge is correct.
It is too big for European A4. So you might have to print it an A3 oder on 2 pages A4 and glue it together.

One could scale the gauge for any pipe diameter by enlargiing it until the width fits the pipe.


There is also a large scale version of this trap, called Berners Brett (Berner's board).



It was designed by predator control specialist Thomas Berner.
He wanted a trap that can be installed in existing culverts.
The axis of his seesaw has adjustable screws an both ends for fitting it excactely to the diameter of the culvert.
Than you block one end of the culvert and simply push the board into the other end like shown in the video.

Here some pictures of his desgin:
https://wildundhund.de/berners-bre-t-t-e-i-n-neues-fangsystem/

For longer culverts he uses a plug that is put into the pipe from the same end as the board.
Attached to the plug is a pice of steel cable.
With the cable you can pull out the plug which doubles as a pusher to force the caught animal into the dispatching cage.



Last edited by Manfred; 08/06/24 06:02 AM.
Re: Germany [Re: Manfred] #8189911
08/06/24 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Manfred
They have added a gauge for the seesaw-slat, fitting for a 110 mm PVC-Pipe:
https://www.pirsch.de/sites/pirsch.de/files/2019-08/Wippbrett-Schablone.pdf
You have to magnify it for printing until the 5 cm meassurement on the gauge is correct.
It is too big for European A4. So you might have to print it an A3 oder on 2 pages A4 and glue it together.

One could scale the gauge for any pipe diameter by enlargiing it until the width fits the pipe.


There is also a large scale version of this trap, called Berners Brett (Berner's board).



It was designed by predator control specialist Thomas Berner.
He wanted a trap that can be installed in existing culverts.
The axis of his seesaw has adjustable screws an both ends for fitting it excactely to the diameter of the culvert.
Than you block one end of the culvert and simply push the board into the other end like shown in the video.

Here some pictures of his desgin:
https://wildundhund.de/berners-bre-t-t-e-i-n-neues-fangsystem/

For longer culverts he uses a plug that is put into the pipe from the same end as the board.
Attached to the plug is a pice of steel cable.
With the cable you can pull out the plug which doubles as a pusher to force the caught animal into the dispatching cage.




Manfred, what is the purpose of the string on the large seesaw mechanism? Also, is he using a door hinge as the seesaw locking mechanism?


Dog will hunt!
Re: Germany [Re: Eddie43] #8190029
08/06/24 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Eddie43

Manfred, what is the purpose of the string on the large seesaw mechanism? Also, is he using a door hinge as the seesaw locking mechanism?


The string (cable) is for retrieving the plug, if you use a plug in a long tube (or if you can access only one end of the tube).
He attaches the cable to the seesaw so the animal can not push the plug further into the pipe.

The plug is made of a wooden disk with a stripe of sheet metal nailt around its circumference.
[Linked Image]

The door hinge is for locking the seesaw in the upper position.

And the axle of the seesaw has two screws (red) to adjust the width for a perfect fit into the pipe.

[Linked Image]

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8190031
08/06/24 12:47 PM
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Found a picture with the optional plug for long pipes.
Sorry for the quality. It was a very small picture in a pdf file.

[Linked Image]

Source: https://wildundhund.de/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/old_docs/21_08.pdf

Last edited by Manfred; 08/06/24 12:52 PM.
Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8190118
08/06/24 04:14 PM
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Very interesting thread.

Thank you for the information.

Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8193095
08/10/24 11:31 AM
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The Kofferfalle (suitcase trap) can be scaled to any size.
The trigger in most cases is a seesaw mechanism.

The lower part is dug into the soil down some mm of board.

As it has 3 open sides, it is more likely to catch an adult red fox compared to a box trap.









Re: Germany [Re: Schinderberg] #8208061
09/02/24 01:13 PM
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A video from the 1990s demonstrating traditional branch sings.



The cartoon at the beginning of the video shows a hunter who spends too much time around his trap, trampling the gras and leaving his odor, scaring away the martens.

2:00 Wartebruch: Two crossed branches are a waiting and meeting point sign. Wait here. / Meet me here.
2:06: Warten aufgegeben: The side branches of the Wartebruch are removed, indicating the other hunter was there but gave up waiting.
2:08: Warnbruch: A warning sign, indicating a trap oder damaged raised blind or other danger nearby
2:15: A branch used as a trigger indicator for a box trap.
2:52: Same for a spring trap in a bunker. The string needs to be longer due to the fast movement of the indicator wenn the trap closes.
Both indicators can be checked from afar with binoculars.

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