Would appreciate some input from experienced lure makers - home use formulators and commercial makers alike, not to the exclusion of other applicable orientations.

In your opinions, what is the significant difference between genuine China Star pure anise extract, and the cut/tinctured version of the extract as a simple lure ingredient? Does anyone know what the average oil dilution ratio for the tinctured form is in rough percentages? The price differential between the pure and tinctured is about threefold.

I am considering purchasing some for the first time to experiment with a "sweet" formulation attractant as a curiosity lure for red and grey fox in an attempt to duplicate a sweet lure as close to the caliber of that given to me (without a formula) by my fox trapping mentor in 1954. Mark was a professional predator trapper then, and every dirt hole set he ever made for fox had a small gob of it in the hole in combination with a few drops of gland lure on the top edge of the hole.

Over the years I have sniffed several sweet commercial lures designed for raccoons, but nothing close to his homemade stuff. My interest in this is just one of those deliberate, stubborn curiosity energies. There is a touch of anise in Mark's original lure. All that I have left from that original lure is an empty quart Ball canning jar with dried up black residue from it occupying the bottom of it.

For those of you who may use a similar sweet/gland lure combination, is there a commercial sweet lure you might recommend?

I meandered off on a bit of a tangent, but my digression was related to the sweet odor of anise oil.

Your comments and considerations will be most appreciated. Thank you.

Jonathan

Staight run oil material is typically stronger and longer lasting when useing it in a formula.Tinctured /or retail food grade material will have the odor but the impact it has on your formula will be the telling story. For home use a tinctured or food grade product may suffice adequately.

Tinctureing is a good procedure when needing a specific product to blend better in a mix.It usually is done when working with crystals, powders or plant matter of sorts to extract the needed essence. Chinese Blend Anise is what I would recommend uncut to get the most from it. It will crystalize at cooler temps where as tincture material typically wont.

Tincture percentages and alcohol percentages in retail food grade use products will vary as to the active amount in that product.I dont know if there is a cutting standard however depending on that person it can vary 25 to 50% on oils I am sure. I would dare say that some dont add any more active then necessary to get some odor presence to sell that product.

I am sure many use food grade materials( candy making oils ) for formulas and get by.Retail food outlets sell the 1/4 ounce sizes at a much higher retail then the trapper industry cost. The determining factor is duration and penetration/permeation throughout the formula.Anise is typically one of those products that can overpower a formula and become the dominant odor if a good grade is used but it will be there for a long time.

This odor has been used by many old timers and some new lure makers as the go to product in coon lures until they become aware of the many other choices available.An ounce of product of the good blend isnt too cost prohibitive at around $4.50 an ounce that is our retail price it will easily do a nice homemade batch of lure or bait.I dont use this product at the present time but many do.

Bob, Thank you for your generous, experienced and detailed commentary. I am grateful to you for that synopsis. Your response is exactly the clarification I was hoping to recruit, after trying to craft the question and locating enough courage to raise my hand in class to ask the question - fully knowing it was not a stupid one, but rather odd compared to the average ink ending in a question mark.

My unquiet mind has been infused with enlightenment. The slope of my learning curve has been lowered several more degrees.

You are an excellent teacher, and I am glad that God put you on the planet at the same time to be on the faculty while I was attending classes at Trapperman University.

Jonathan

Bob wrote...Chinese Blend Anise is what I would recommend uncut to get the most from it.

Me too Jonathan, I wouldn't monkey with diluted tinctures. One can generally purchase pure anise oil from pharmacies if one only need a small amount like one to four ozs for homebrewing lures. Ace

You are quite welcome Jonathan. I just happened to be the first responder to your inquiry. I am sure another would have contributed by answering your question in time.BJ

Asa, Thank you for stopping into class. You, too, are held equally in the esteemed ranks among my most favorite teachers.

My intuitive sense was to opt for the the concentrated extract, no matter the price - just because I am not inclined to assume an "......that'll be good enough" posture on most things in the substitution department. However, budgeting on a fixed income is a factorial when one's eagerness and appetite for something shows up, no matter the penny's tally.

I already told you that your muskrat lure on my shed's shelf is not designated for that rodent's attraction. I am hoping that it will fill the role of the commercial, "sweet" attractant that I had alluded to. You will be the first to get my report on that later this fall.

Jonathan

If you are looking for a good sweet scent to use in lure formulation that works well on coons and gray fox, I would say persimmon(sp) would be a good choice. Just as Anise, it can overpower a formulation fast.
Also as far as cost goes, pure oils last longer because you don't use as much as you would with diluted tinctures. You also don't have to worry as much about consistency of your final product from batch to batch. Tinctures can vary quite a bit even from the same maker.

High Noon, Thanks for the persimmon suggestion.I have never sniffed it, but based on your recommendation, I am going to include that in my "sweet" trials. That may very well be one, if not the, mystery ingredient from Mark's original jar of years ago. I'll know the second that I get a whiff of it. Worth the gamble. I just ordered 4 0z. each of the China Star anise oil and persimmon oil extract from Blackie's Blends in Ohio.

Jonathan