Anyone familiar with the hunting around Haines ? Thinking moose and deer. Also wondering about subsistence hunting in AK. What does that actually mean and how does one qualify? In general is the hunting in Haines considered good compared to other parts of AK ?

Found a piece of property over there thats interesting.

Haines moose is what is known as tier 3. It is basically a drawing for locals, with a quota that, when met, the hunt is shut down. Pretty good bear hunting for both flavors. Lots of goats.
Several river systems that open up a lot of country to jet amd air boaters.

Thanks AV. Is the tier 3 what Alaskans call subsistence ?

Sort of "hybrid" subsistence, if you will. It is a drawing, with a harvest threshold. Last time I looked, they gave 200 permits, with a desired harvest of 25 bulls.
I had property up there years ago, and ferried back and forth for a few years. Was going to build a cabin, cleared a site, put in a short rosd, but then life got in the way, so sold it.

In Alaska, Tier 3 is when your freezer is empty, you go fill it. Spent a little time goat hunting out of Haines myself. Seemed to be kind of an unfriendly place when we were there. Just a bad vibe I got. Maybe it was just me. The population of bald eagles was like something out of a Steven King movie. Like AV said, lots of goats and bears.

OK well thanks for the info. For us it is appealing because its so close we could build pretty easy. Land is sure reasonable compared to the prices around home here.

I'll take a swing at your question Yukon but before I do I will say am not trying to offend anybody by any use of words so don't jump to conclusions!


In AK there is Federal subsistence and State subsistence. I am much more familiar with Fed subsistence than State subsistence.

Federal subsistence is at heart 'Indian' law. There is minimal 'Indian Country' per se in AK. Instead of the Indian Reservation system (Indian Country/Nation-within-a-Nation as it were) as was implemented through the various treaties with tribes in the lower 48, here Native Corporations were formed in 1971 by ANCSA, the Alaska Native Claims Settlement Act https://ancsaregional.com/about-ancsa/.

ANCSA ceded Federal lands to the various Native groups as private property belonging solely to each Native Corporation in order to develop economically. ANCSA did not grant Nation within a Nation/ 'Sovereign' status. The Reservation System in the Lower 48 grants certain autonomous/sovereign powers to the various tribes such as police, gaming and fish and game management within the Reservations. Alaska Natives did not receive these sovereign powers including the ability to run casinos for instance or to manage fish and game on their private property. Instead fish and game management authority was reserved to the State.

1972 Federal Marine Mammals Protection Act (MMPA) barred non Natives from taking marine mammals including seal, sea otter, whale, walrus. polar bear. One might argue this set the stage for what was to come. Meanwhile the State of AK was generally still in charge of overall game management, excluding marine mammals.

1982 Alaska National Interest Land Conservation Act or ANILCA classified much general Federal property as National Parks, Federal Wildlife Refuges, etc. thereby locking up vast territory to traditional human use including hunting, fishing and trapping but also mining etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_National_Interest_Lands_Conservation_Act

ANILCA also created "Subsistence".

Subsistence grants preferential access to fish, game, firewood etc on Federal land to residents of 'Rural Communities'. Most rural villages are of course predominantly Native. 1982 America was ostensibly striving to be color-blind. So unlike the 1972 MMPA which overtly stated that marine mammal resources were strictly reserved to "Natives", the 1982 ANILCA sidestepped the race issue by applying the law to all "Rural" residents which as I already said are predominantly Native but also include white guys like Yukon Jeff for example lol.

In essence ANILCA created Subsistence to codify Alaska Native access to fish and game on federal lands that had not been granted under ANCSA although you can have Federal Subsistence rights even if you are a white guy as long as you live in the right place.


SO, if Haines is considered "Rural" then Haines residents have Federal subsistence rights.

State subsistence is another ball of wax and maybe somebody else can clarify some more of that.

I help clarify subsistence hunting and trapping for you. If you are doing both activities to provide food and livilhood for yourself or family, you are engaged in subsistence. It occurs during general seasons and special subsistence only seasons. So, if they have any general seasons, you can subsistence hunt during them.

Thanks drasselt , sounds like a guy would need to study the regulations to understand where you can hunt or not hunt.



Dirt, from the sounds of this^ every hunter or trapper could claim subsistence ? Is it state you are referring to or federal ? How do they classify "rural" ? Do bears fall under subsistence ?

I'm thinking Dirt's clarification is a bit tongue in cheek?

What kind of hunting and trapping occur under general hunting and trapping seasons? ADF&G knows that subsistence hunting and trapping occurs during these seasons. The BOG knows too. What is supposed to occur during special subsistence seasons is only subsistence hunting. You are what you are. If I go out and trophy hunt a subsistence hunt, am I a subsistence hunter?

None of you have done a completely accurate job of explaining hunting around Haines. 254, go online and get the current 19/20 Ak. hunting Regs. Take note that Haines is in GMU 1, subunit 1D. Also note that all of unit 1 has a deer season, EXCEPT 1D. Moose in 1D is a tier ll hunt, not tier 3. Read the reg book to understand tier ll, but the short answer is it will be difficult to get a permit.
Haines is classified as a RURAL community under federal Regs. That means residents oh Haines can hunt under fed. Subsistence Regs. Fed. Regs ONLY apply on fed land. Fed. land is ONLY refuges, nat. parks, BLM, and nat. monuments. All other lands are hunted under state Regs.
Don't ask me to define, "resident" under fed Regs. I don't think they know what the definition is. Resident under state laws is residing 12 consecutive months. Are you planning on becoming a resident? I believe not being a US citizen would interfere with becoming an Alaska resident. If you do not become a US resident and an Alaska resident, all of the above info does not apply to you. I'm assuming you're a Canadian resident for which I send you my condolences! Haha!
Haines folks are having a hard time right now with the difficulty of crossing the border! I read that most Haines residents use doctors in Whitehorse.
mt

You are right, MT, tier II. My mistake.

I think 254 might be a US citizen.

If he is a US citizen, how does he get to own a trapline?
mt

Thanks for the info MT I am going to get the regs. Ken is right. I am a US citizen, born in Californiaistan. Did my time in the US military and all that. I am only a permanent resident of Canada. Thats all thats required to own a trapline here. I wont get into all the details on how bad its getting here with the new gun ban and the covid deal, but they are sending the police to peoples houses who are supposed to be self isolating and threatening them with 3-years in prison if they dont comply. I have a successful business here and lots of real estate or I would be gone by now, its that bad politically. We have a chance with Erin Otoole. If he gets in next election we might be OK. If not its all over. Glad I have the ability to leave because it might come to that. Haines would be easy because its so close.

Dirt, what is a "trophy hunt"?

An adjective and a noun. Mine was adverb and verb.

Dirt, i only ask because i don't see anything in state regulations about trophy hunting.

Or Statute. I believe that trophy hunting is covered under "other uses". "other uses" is anything that is not subsistence." Subsistence " has a definition.

"Both Alaska state law (AS 16.05. 940[32]) and federal law (Title VIII of ANILCA, section 803) define subsistence uses as the “customary and traditional” uses of wild resources for various uses including food, shelter, fuel, clothing, tools, transportation, handicrafts, sharing, barter, and customary trade."