Get great lockups. Just foot damage with offsets. Not that it matters because I don’t live sell, but I have had chew outs with them. Reds are bigger and no issues, but we don’t have a lot of them so maybe that’s not a fair comparison. And Reds don’t seem to be as hyper as Greys are either.

The leggetts started out running all victor 1.5s, and kept a pile of victor 2's on hand in case coyotes showed up, but in later years they switched entirely to victor 1.75's, offset, 2 coiled. I was fortunate enough to spend a weekend trapping with ron leggett in 2004, unfortunately after pete had passed, talk about a wealth of knowledge

I caught fox and coyotes before it but after watching their videos I caught a lot more. Terrific teachers. I can't recall what year I first watched their videos, seems like it must of been around 1995-2000???

Wow, your a lucky guy to be able to do that. What
great memories that would make. They must of had a good reason to switch over to offsets. Thanks for posting that info, that is some great stuff. Ok Laz your turn.

Hey beav, you seein this. Both Phil Brown and the Leggets saw a need to use offsets. I wonder why that was, got any ideas?

Maybe they needed to according to the law.
And as far as I know none of them trapped for the live market. And If they did It because of lock up I don't see where 3 /16ths of a Inch offset on a small footed critter like a fox would make much of a difference In holding power.

If you think you need offsets for what ever reason that's what you should do. I for one don't believe I ever lost a critter do to what kind of jaw configuration I was using.

Phil's fox trap is a regular jaw vic #2, his yote/cat traps are offset vic #2 baseplates with heavy chain and welded j hooks. He passed one of each around at the FTA in virginia for the crowd to look at.

Leggetts trapped live market coyotes in TX for a while. They started out using their fox traps, but were having misses and pull outs. They settled on the vic 1.75 offset, but grinded a little on the jaws where the levers ride to increase lock up.

Yes who knows what the circumstances or the reason they did what they did. I am wondering since they ran such a long line they weren't getting to a lot of their fox until later in the day and were noticing more damage. I know Ogorman talked about a lot studies showed that offsets ( with the right amount of gap for the target animal) were less damaging. To me it's not so much about lock up as it is bone breakage.

I know on my Texas line i have an extremely low amount of damage and my traps are all 4 coiled and strong with 3/16 offset Canadian jawed. I don't get to a lot of my coyotes until later in the day.

Ive said before, take a pencil for instance snap an offset on it, then do the same on a closed jaw trap, smashed. I realize its not a foot or leg bone but i wonder when a animal has broken bones, did the trap do that or did they do that to themselves?

We will have agree to disagree on the offset issue. And just to be clear i realize there is know way to get to zero damage but I think we should at least try to minimize it.
Maybe a shock spring would help some also.

i dont catch a lot of fox but the ones i do are usually caught on the shin so if your thinking of broken bones i might say a two coiled #3 bridger offset with mods may be the answer yes its over kill but will help stop ankle and toe catches as the jaw is up past the foot really depends on what the intentions are of after catch use and before i get the #3 is not a fox trap remember the question was foot friendly

No way i would use that big of a trap for fox.

I believe there are 2 main issues we see on a foot/lower leg. That is broken skin, broken bones or both. Imo we can help eliminate the broken skin with lamination and no sharp edges period.

We can help eliminate broken bones with the RIGHT offset. On tip of that i feel keeping the trap as light as possible to help keep the animal from injuring themselves more plus a shock spring.

I think the above would go a long way in stopping any visible and internal damage to a fox. With that said there are still variables that will still be a head scratcher.

Well I'm doubting a red fox or a grey fox would be able to compress a shock spring. And I don't see where a shock spring In a short chain set up would be of much use on any critter.

wetdog, The Beav has added variety to the thread, He seems very knowledgeable. The idea of this thread was to learn everyone's opinion on a good trap,I didn't mean for it to be a debate on offset vs closed jaws, I simply wanted to know what you think is the most foot friendly fox trap. The Beav has the right to his own opinion, and you have the right to yours. Thank you both for sharing, I am very appreciative of everyone's input on this thread.

Duke

That cage trap is one I could not make happen
Climb on it, pee on it, sniff it.
but not go in it.
I'm sure I need the newest and bestest lol.

Sooo many makes and models these days
you are going to have to rely on multiple opinions.

I've used shock springs on my fox traps and I've used them when coyotes started showing up. And I see no difference In the amount of pullouts or foot damage when using them over a set up with out them. So I don't use them.
But If you feel you need for them then go for It.

It's the same with offset jaws. If you think they allow circulation to the foot so be It. But I don't see It happening. Those wide cast jaw faces are great but they don't hold as good as a regular squared off jaw face. And yes the offset will allow the spring levers to come up a bit higher on the jaws but If the offset Is 3/16ths does that make that much of a difference In lock up? Then of coarse If you have any derbies caught between the jaw hinges that 3/16ths offset becomes about a 1/2" offset and there goes any chance of something being caught.

But If you feel you need to reinvent the trap so be It.

Are you referring to me when you talk of circulation? If you are i never mentioned it and don't buy into the circulation thing. I have no idea where that came from. My guess it was either a little white lie or enough people actually believed it maybe. Not me

As far as the rest, i have no where you come up with some of this stuff. Most of us use sifters and i know for myself anyway i am very careful about getting any debris that i think will cause a catch problem thrown back away from the set. Dosen't take long to figure that out, or it shouldn't any way. Stuff does stil happen but rarely.

Not sure if rubber jaw traps were mentioned yet, if so i apologize for missing that. Those could be an option.

No I wasn't referring to you. I was just making a generic comment.

I have used rubber jawed traps and I feel like the rubber conforms to the foot and is more certain to cut off any circulation. And of coarse rubber Is fairly slippery and you may get more foot movement before the foot begins to swell. And of course rubber doesn't stand up well to any chewing or trap cleaning. And I'm betting It also absorbs odors.

Canadian jawed Wolf Creek #1.5s, or Duke #1.5 rubber jaw!

I've seen more damage from a chain link getting hooked on a spring pin than anything else. It's not good when that happens. Keep your spring pins short.

Author trapper, do you have trouble holding coyotes in the 1.5s?