Just putting this out there, but a dog is only as good as it’s trainer…

Do not pay $2000 for a lab puppy unless it comes from stellar pedigree lines. When I say stellar I mean multiple generations of FC's on both the sire and dam side. Not a junior hunter title here or there.

If you are looking for just a pet and not a working dog then you can find a cheaper dog fairly easily

Do not be fooled by these backyard breeders that crank out a litter every time their female is in heat. They will say the dogs are "healthy" and "come from hunting lines" but don't provide health clearances or pedigree. All they are breeding for is money and they are producing dogs with health issues that are diluting the Labrador breed. They will post a bunch of pictures with the puppies wearing clothes, red flag there.

Please only buy a lab puppy from someone who has done health testing on the parents. You don't want to pay money for a dog that is going to have issues down the road.

And for those that think people are making money off of high profile breeding, think again. To do it right you have the cost of the dog, the time of training, the cost of obtaining master level titles, training costs, the stud fee, the vet visits for the pregnancy, health testing for the dam, whelping costs for the puppies etc etc. The only reason to breed is to create another dog that you couldn't buy elsewhere. You breed for performance and take the hit on cost. No one with a high profile litter is making any money at 2k per pup, TRUST ME

Two of my best dogs ever were gsp. Born to retreave, could run around 40mph hunted close to mid range and no game bird could hide in a field. Would not win or place in NSTRA but I liked hunting them more than my 4x field champ male and female English setters that would place or win trials.

I goofed and sold one to finance a well bread great looking female setter to breed with my champ. My last one jumped the 4' fence each day and went 1/2mile down the road to play with the dogs there for 30 minutes. He got hit and killed. Someone was hitting dogs on purpose for a short time 4 got hit in my area in a few weeks. Other than that not a dog had gotten hit in the 12 years prior from any of the neighbors or mine. But mine stayed in the house or kennels unless letting then out to run when cleaning kennels.

Now we live on 96 acres and I have amazing habit and places to train and work dogs at home. But I'm gone working half a month and not home to take care of them and won't put them responsibility off on anyone else. We only have a small covey or two but I would build nice call back pens.

But there are not many Qual to hunt and few hunters so the market for trained dogs or pups would be limited and it would not take long before I was headed in that direction again.


Wise word coon dagger. I will add just because you breed two incredible dogs does not guarantee all the pups will be as good as there parents. It increases the odds and they will probably be good dogs but not the absolute greatest the breeder was looking for.

True. Labs are intelligent and they want to make you happy. Use common sense techniques and make training fun and they will shine. If you want a good dog spend time with it

My neighbor has some. Don't know the price. Are you willing to travel to SW Missouri?

She says 600 with papers, 300 without.

The dog can better than the trainer and vice-versa. A puppy is a crapshoot. Go for proven breeding and keep your fingers crossed.

Yeah same here it's like people think they have gold.

I'll say this. My family and I have raised and trained various dogs from Llewellyn Setters, Labs, Beagles, to GSPs. Papers and cost don't necessarily mean it will be a good dog for its intended purpose. Papers just indicate the dog has a "supposedly" good genetic background. Cost is a subjective issue. I've seen dogs with outstanding pedigree papers that weren't worth the ink on the paper, and I've seen dogs come from an SPCA that were abandoned or deliberately given up that were great companions and hunting dogs. Before we ever sold a dog, we "interviewed" the prospective buyer. Watched how the pups reacted / interacted with that person. Never met a bad dog, . . . just bad owners and trainers. No matter reason someone wants a dog, they should remember "TPR". Time, Patience, and Repetition, . . . My .02 :-)

Solid advice. I bought a pointer pup thirty years ago and became good friends and hunting companions with two guys who bought dogs from the same litter. Two of the dogs were birdhunting fools and the third was a dud. Didn’t seem to have the desire or instincts for it. Luckily for me, the dud wasn't mine.

If you're looking for a good hunting dog, buy from proven stock and hopefully you'll get a good prospect.

My son went through an interview process and even a visit from the owners before he got his dog Lab, lol. Even signed a contract about training and breeding his dog. Some folks do actually care about the lineage.

Even the plantations down here are very specific about who breeds with what when it comes to cockers and pointers. It’s not about money, it’s about producing the best possible hunting stock.
Down here pointers are used only for pointing birds. At the shot they don’t move. Cockers that ride the wagons are then called and cast in the direction of the downed birds. As they find birds they take them back to the head guide. Once all birds are found he throws them down and they pick them up and take them back to the wagon where they’ll wait for the next covey and hopefully dead birds.

You don’t get good working dogs cheap. I will admit, there are exceptions to every rule. I believe the winner of the retriever series one year was a Lab that was bought from a newspaper add with no papers and was already 2 years old. I remember watching it on ESPN and the interview afterwards.

Right, AKC, CKC and UKC registrations (papers) show your dog is a purebred. The system isn't foolproof but that's what it's used for. A pedigree from one of those organizations will show you the names and accomplishments (if any) of the other purebreds in your dogs lineage going back as many generations that you wish to pay for. I think AKC will do three generations.

As many have said on this thread, getting a new pup is a crap shoot, you just never know what you're going to get until several months after you get it home. You can up your odds by buying papered pups from a reputable breeder. Even better if you meet the parents and see their pedigrees. Always good to meet the pups and perform some personality tests on them.

But you just never know.

My first German short-haired pointer I bought was 2 and well trained from a friend that bought trained and reader dogs like crazy. About a year later I called the dogs breeder on her papers and it turned out they were going to a game farm to earn their dogs that was 35 mis from me. I got to see my dogs parents in action
If I glad seen that and looking for a pup I would not have bought from them.

After they hunted their dogs I got out mine. She blew the doors off her parents event the breaders admitted on their own how much better she preformed. It was completely mind blowing how much higher caliber dog my girl was then her parents.

Very similar story with my June dog. I think alot of it has to do with putting them on birds as much as you can. Yard work only goes so far. The breeder I got her from can show you a dozen dogs that will blow your mind in the yard but when we went to SD with them my ol June ran circles around them and she just runs the farm and sleeps on the couch but I take her to Iowa almost every weekend of pheasant season. Very little yard work just in the field mostly.

At least your not looking for a goldendoodle...those are very fashionable right now.

Don't get me started on those

If you want a mixed dog it better be free. Plenty of them at the shelter. No way I'm paying 2 grand for a mutt

I’ve said it before, but truly great hounds are born, not trained. You can train the majority of hounds to at least do something.

A natural dog merely needs exposure and repetition. The best of the best know what to do by instinct alone. These are the ones that you should take the time to train what I call ‘handler’s preferences’ and put in the breeding pen. I will not breed a dog that is not natural.

Kind of an off-topic question but my background in training is for police service dogs and man-tracking dogs, for those skills maybe 4 out of 10 have what it takes to make it and maybe 1 out of 10 will make a superior dog, and a lot of times that is not known until you have quite a bit of time and energy invested in the dog. Is that similar to what you are seeing with the hunting dogs or do you have a higher success rates?

Depends I guess, there are alot of variables. I would have to say it's much easier to get/make a good duck or pheasant dog. I have no experience with Man trackers but I have always wanted to train or work with one. I imagine there is no room for error when it comes to tracking someone who's life that is on the line or an escapee.