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Muzzleloader help? #7703829
10/29/22 12:06 PM
10/29/22 12:06 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Macthediver Offline OP
trapper
Macthediver  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Here is the deal. I have a 54 cal CVA muzzle loader for probably 20 years now. I won it as a door prize at a sportsman banquet.
When I first got it I took it to the range and shot it with the sabot bullets that came with the gun.

The bullets I shot before are these and I believe I used 100 grains of powder??? I do recall they shot dead on at 75 yards .. And like always I did not write anything down about loading them.

[Linked Image]

This is the powder I have.

[Linked Image]

Ok so things being what they are I figured its time I bring the gun out and play with it again. What I want to do though is shoot a bullet I cast myself. I have the molds for both a conical and a ball.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

What I would like to do is pour and shoot the Conicals. I know if I use the ball it has to be patched. I poked around on the net some for info about Conicals. Have seen people say to patch and some say no patch. I have no idea where to start with trying to load the Conicals. I have bore butter for lube. [Linked Image]


So reaching out to the vast knowledge here on T man. I'm looking to pour and then stuff one of these conical in my gun. Shoot it and not blow myself up.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. If I can figure this out. Might try kill a deer come November.
I do better hands on.. But what say all??


Mac


"Never Forget Which Way Is Up"

Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703840
10/29/22 12:33 PM
10/29/22 12:33 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,893
new york
M
mike mason Offline
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mike mason  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,893
new york
Shot all 3 in my 54 with 90 grains of 2f. All 3 put the hurt on a whitetail out to 75 yards.

Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703857
10/29/22 12:53 PM
10/29/22 12:53 PM
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 1,363
Custer Co, Idaho
S
sneaky Offline
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sneaky  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 1,363
Custer Co, Idaho
No need to patch a conical, but a felt wad under the base will help. Get some better lube than that bore butter. Dan at Bull Shop makes an excellent lube. His NASA lube is highly regarded. Track of the Wolf sells a bunch of different lubes and you can get felt was from them also. Guys who shoot alot buy Durafelt and a set of hole punch dies from Harbor Freight and make their own wads. It'll keep from leading your barrel as fast and helps with accuracy. IdahoLewis on YouTube has a ton of videos worth watching.


Sometimes nothing can be a real cool hand
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703866
10/29/22 01:14 PM
10/29/22 01:14 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 839
McCurtain Co. Oklahoma
O
OKforester Offline
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McCurtain Co. Oklahoma
Use 100 grains of powder. The directions on the powder you have should say if it is equivalent by volume to black powder, I’m assuming it is. If that’s the case then you can use a black powder measurer. Cast the conical bullets and put the bore butter in the grooves. Load and shoot. Unless you are really going to do a lot of shooting that’s all you need.

Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703881
10/29/22 01:44 PM
10/29/22 01:44 PM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 5,101
Northern Michigan
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J.Morse Offline
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J.Morse  Offline
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Posts: 5,101
Northern Michigan
I have a TC Hawken in .54. I also use the same Lee bullet mold you have. I have killed a pile of deer with them, but using Pyrodex 90% of the time. I use homemade Blk Powder the rest of the time. For lube I used either Bore Butter, or soap I made with bear fat. I used a 90 grain load.


Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703885
10/29/22 01:56 PM
10/29/22 01:56 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 848
Michigan
coonlove Offline
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coonlove  Offline
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Michigan
If your CVA is one of the lightweight synthetic stock models, recoil with a heavy conical will get your attention. Might want to play with the much lighter but effective round ball.


"I'm the paterfamilias"
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: OKforester] #7703892
10/29/22 02:13 PM
10/29/22 02:13 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,893
new york
M
mike mason Offline
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new york
Originally Posted by OKforester
Use 100 grains of powder. The directions on the powder you have should say if it is equivalent by volume to black powder, I’m assuming it is. If that’s the case then you can use a black powder measurer. Cast the conical bullets and put the bore butter in the grooves. Load and shoot. Unless you are really going to do a lot of shooting that’s all you need.

Use to use 100 grains but muzzle hunting in the late PA season with snow, I was seeing unburnt powder on the snow after shots. Dropped down to 90 grains.

Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: coonlove] #7703946
10/29/22 03:57 PM
10/29/22 03:57 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Macthediver Offline OP
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Macthediver  Offline OP
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Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Originally Posted by coonlove
If your CVA is one of the lightweight synthetic stock models, recoil with a heavy conical will get your attention. Might want to play with the much lighter but effective round ball.


Ok got my attention my gun is synthetic stock. I didn't think when I fired the sabots pictured above it was bad at all. So are we talking 12ga slug or 31/2 10ga turkey loads?? Infact I think 31/2 12ga turkey loads kick as nasty as anything I've shot. Or is it more the style and fit of the stock? I've always felt muzzle loaders more pushed than kicked?? Not that I have shot many just a few.
[Linked Image]



Mac

Last edited by Macthediver; 10/29/22 04:14 PM.

"Never Forget Which Way Is Up"

Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703950
10/29/22 04:12 PM
10/29/22 04:12 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 673
Southern Wisconsin
F
Fishdog One Offline
trapper
Fishdog One  Offline
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F

Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 673
Southern Wisconsin
It is not going to be as bad as 3 1/2 12 ga loads, I used a round ball from my .54 because it was more accurate at 100 yards than conicals, shot elk, deer and bear with that round ball. Patch was cotton from jean pockets, lubed with bore butter, 2F Black Powder.


Born twice, die once
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703954
10/29/22 04:14 PM
10/29/22 04:14 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 13,059
Ky
J
jbyrd63 Offline
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 13,059
Ky
90 grains will kick less. Biggest problem with round balls are not much "shock" factor. Sabot hollow points better expansion. But your gun your choice.....

Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703986
10/29/22 05:21 PM
10/29/22 05:21 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 18,388
Green County Wisconsin
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Online content
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GREENCOUNTYPETE  Online Content
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G

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 18,388
Green County Wisconsin
no patch on those lee R.E.A.L just smear of lube they are meant to as the name suggest Rifling Engraved At Loading

you May want a fiber wad or lubed wad between the R.E.A.L and the powder

the 20 year old black powder substitute , might not be good any more
Smell it , does it smell like ammonia?
and try to light some a small pile say 30gr on paper outside with a long fire place match or regular match in a long pliers , if it doesn't go woosh I would buy a new bottle , many of those attracted water and clumped or broke down.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7703991
10/29/22 05:29 PM
10/29/22 05:29 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 18,388
Green County Wisconsin
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Online content
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Green County Wisconsin
Originally Posted by Macthediver
Originally Posted by coonlove
If your CVA is one of the lightweight synthetic stock models, recoil with a heavy conical will get your attention. Might want to play with the much lighter but effective round ball.


Ok got my attention my gun is synthetic stock. I didn't think when I fired the sabots pictured above it was bad at all. So are we talking 12ga slug or 31/2 10ga turkey loads?? Infact I think 31/2 12ga turkey loads kick as nasty as anything I've shot. Or is it more the style and fit of the stock? I've always felt muzzle loaders more pushed than kicked?? Not that I have shot many just a few.
[Linked Image]



Mac

100 gr of black or sub and a 432gr conical will be little different than a standard pheasant load in a 12ga single shot and yes I would say less of a kick more of a push

432gr = 1oz so when your shooting

that said more powder isn't typically more accurate especially with the Lee R.E.A.L they don't have the gas seal like a sabot

I would start at 75gr for a hunting load and work up 5gr at a time till you find accuracy then loose, reach max book load or get to where you are happy with what you are getting
swab the barrel between shots with a patch and spit or a patch lube.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7704026
10/29/22 06:40 PM
10/29/22 06:40 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 23,494
New Hampshire
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Nessmuck Offline
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New Hampshire
Yup....pour 50 grains down the barrel...then Tamp wasp nest material on top of the powder ...and see if it goes off . Have to test that powder !


It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees.
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7704028
10/29/22 06:44 PM
10/29/22 06:44 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 23,494
New Hampshire
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Nessmuck Offline
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New Hampshire
If that powder goes bang...then go in the pantry and get a spoonful of crisco...and lube up those bullets.

Pour 90 grain of powder down the barrel
Then ram home the lubed chronical


It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees.
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7704064
10/29/22 07:23 PM
10/29/22 07:23 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 18,388
Green County Wisconsin
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Online content
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Green County Wisconsin
if you haven't any wasps nest material some news print crumpled up would work


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Nessmuck] #7705061
10/31/22 07:20 AM
10/31/22 07:20 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Macthediver Offline OP
trapper
Macthediver  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Originally Posted by Nessmuck
Yup....pour 50 grains down the barrel...then Tamp wasp nest material on top of the powder ...and see if it goes off . Have to test that powder !


My powder didn't go bang wouldn't even whoof with a stick lighter. So today I go on search for jug FFG. Also managed to loose a barrel wedge some where???


Mac


"Never Forget Which Way Is Up"

Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7705064
10/31/22 07:23 AM
10/31/22 07:23 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,751
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
danny clifton  Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,751
williamsburg ks
I dont know where to get a barrel wedge but pyrodex is easy enough to find and works good. The folks that bought GOEX make estes rockets. I am hoping GOEX black powder gets available again.


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7705072
10/31/22 07:32 AM
10/31/22 07:32 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,751
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
danny clifton  Offline
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williamsburg ks
https://www.harborfreight.com/dual-drum-rotary-rock-tumbler-67632.html

These are cheap and if you want a new hobby you could make your own powder.


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: danny clifton] #7705100
10/31/22 08:36 AM
10/31/22 08:36 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 18,388
Green County Wisconsin
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Originally Posted by danny clifton
I dont know where to get a barrel wedge but pyrodex is easy enough to find and works good. The folks that bought GOEX make estes rockets. I am hoping GOEX black powder gets available again.



the black powder supplier I use posted they should be making GOEX again by the end of the year

https://www.addictedtoblackpowder.com/back-powder/

real black lasts a century or more while subs don't


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Muzzleloader help? [Re: Macthediver] #7705101
10/31/22 08:39 AM
10/31/22 08:39 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,162
Ohio
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Don Adams Offline
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Ohio
Track of the Wolf sells wedge pins.

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