Yes Sir How about competion? If they are lots of coyotes want they work a set better ?

Just like people and pets. Every coyote is an individual some are more spooky than others. Saying I catch some coyotes one way doesn't mean it will work for the majority of them. Using examples of some coyotes being caught on moved objects the first night is like someone saying my first dog was stupid so every dog must be stupid......

For what it's worth, most coyotes that i have caught the first or second night have been with just bait in a dirt hole. The sets with lure not so quick as a rule. I think lure creates a red flag response at first. If your location is dead on I'd just use fresh bait

Yes Sir. I agree Some coyotes are dumb some are not !! Some are educated some are not and easy to catch. They are stupid coyotes in every state. But their are some smart ones in every state that have been educated by people who didnt treat them like they where educated. IF you treat every coyote trap like a real tuff livestock killing coyote then you catch it or dont. Then tou have not educated father and you catch it latter. But if you set like it does matter with sloppy unrealistic sets then you educate him and make him even harder to catch. So what does it hurt to set ALL traps like you mean bussiness??

Maybe yes but I do a lot of testing and run cameras quite a bit here, and I think just having a lot of younger naive coyotes if the biggest factor.

Just say 60% percent of the population is naive and easy to catch. When u have lots and lots of coyotes u just have a lot more of the 60%ers. There's some popular lures and baits that I've tested that just suck here and my thinking is if it was just hunger and competition that drives them I shouldn't b seeing this. When I first started I caught some coyotes on theses poor attractants and didn't know better but my catch rate was pretty low. There's plenty of coyotes here that are harder to catch too but u don't notice them as much because of the easy ones. White bones placed will spook a lot of coyotes here.
I've been running camers testing stuff here the last month and seeing coyote family somewhat intact and I don't see coyotes really completing to work the set so to speak. Some in the group will work it ,some go on and will wait their chance.

Every place is different. What works in Pa will NOT work in another place like West Texas or New Mexico. A hole set in lots of places will cause a coyote to jump out of a 2 track rode because it is not naturally made

I'd agree with that mostly. A fur trapper in KS that is just taking the available ones and moving on is going to catch more putting in the proverbial dirt because of the kiss theory though.

I feel KISS works best for me. Know that being said. On the plains of say Kanas or Nebraska. A Flat Set may not work well. You cant set a good Flat Set in a green grass cattle feild. A step down dirthole. Would be what I set. Make the set match where you are at. 1 lure worka like a champ in Alabama but doesnt work good in Kanas. That will be a fact. A Montana coyote ant going to respond the same way as a Georgia Coyote and vic versa

My guess about some of the commercial lures being made is because of cost and availability a lot of the good natural ingredients they are being partly or completely replaced with synthetic stuff and my testing has shown with a few exceptions the synthetics seem ok to the human nose but are inferior when it comes to the coyotes nose. Probably even happening in some of the prepared baits but they have enough natural base that you see less of the effect. Just my theory based off things I see and read as I haven't seen the recipes of the majority of the commercial formulations out there.

Yes Sir. I also think some people = blame lure for not working. When = The seaon or situation changed = But the persons lure or lure usage or lure amount did not OR maybe like you said = it’s unnatural or smell unnatural. Now a few coyotes can be caught on curiosity type lures but i fell the same as = Natural is better.

In my testing lately in front of cameras a couple of formulations I've tested I've put both some down a hole and some on a corn stalk within 6" of the hole and the stuff down the gets worked the hardest and the stuff in the stalk hasn't got any attention until the hole has been destroyed. Very limited test sample but something I'm going to be testing some more. One formulation is a very eatable bait and the other was a curiosity lure they will bite first the want to roll on. Just something interesting I though I would share. It was almost like it being in a hole created a stronger response......

I test year around here and what's the best will seem to be the best year around on my coyotes. I've only been testing about 5 years so I haven't seen everything but I've got skunky call lures that will still get great reactions in summer compared to other formulations. And my limited experience is a good formulation build off natural ingredients, the more u use the stronger the reaction. If a large amount of something causes a coyote not to work a set my opinion is,based off what I've seen, that it had a marginal attraction to begin with and too let the coyote figure that out before he got caught. Put 4 oz of mink or rat glands, or good fish oil down a hole and see what happens. The more u use the harder they hit it.

Yes Sir. So you dont often have = Pacing or avoidance with to much lure ? I have seen over use of other trappers lure cause = pacing and avoidance and general - spookyness in the deep south. Heat and Humidity?? Does it carry smell different in Kanas than Alabama because of humidity??? What IF a hole its self creates = set being worked for you. But for me in another state is causes avoidance? These are good questions. Cause a Kanas coyote ant like West Texas coyote. And a Indiana coyote ant like a Florida coyote. But its interesting hearing how coyote vary in reaction from state to state OR place to place

Rarely do I see pacing, either on camera or snow. Do see some avoidance or lack of commitment. But not because of too much lure or bait. Or at least not on one's I consider good. And that seems to be a similar experience with a few other guys that test lures and who I trust in their opinion. And yes as a general rule a west Texas coyote is going to act differently than our average coyote. But with that said I've got coyotes here at the house where I regularly test and trap that I can't seem to trap. Particularly a one eyed female and here mate. They will work a test hole in front of a camera if they really like the stuff but put a trap in the ground and they are on to it. Last year is first year I really tried to change it up to catch them just as a challenge since they weren't worth much. If they are spooky they usually just walk so close and just go on by or turn around. Rarely pacing. If they like to dig traps they may circle once scouting it out though.

Thanks for the replies

Nobody traps within a mile of me that I know of and would probably be a safe bet that 5-10mi nobody is trapping them.
The only person I have to blame for educating any of them is me, and I definitely don't want to educate any of them

The largest and oldest coyotes I’ve caught have been on blind trail sets. Nothing new, nothing changed, no foreign objects near the set and no bait no lure nothing to put them on alert.
Pretty much sums it up.

This ^^

Smartest coyotes can’t elude a well placed, blended and aged blind set

Yes, on the wrong coyote with the wrong object. Certain things are moved alot by other animals. Moving a bone a couple feet with fresh urine is not going to get the same reaction as placing a new bone that wasn't there before.

I agree with you which is why most of my control work is blind sets and snares.

By and large, whether you’re going to spook a coyote (by any means, some coyotes in some situations will spook simply because you stepped foot out of the vehicle) largely depends on time of year, type of coyote, and location.

The worst case scenario I can think of where you’d be most likely to spook a coyote the easiest would be early denning, setting traps within 1/4 mile of the den site. It’s an area that pair spends a LOT of time in, an area they’re VERY familiar with, and an area and timeframe when theyre “on point” when it comes to potential dangers.

Late summer/early fall, winter fur trapping, lots of young, unattached, traveling, transient coyotes would be the opposite.

Heavy bred spring females again are usually the opposite.

Transient coyotes are almost always easier than long term homebodies.

Other than a blind set, every other set has something added. Whether it’s lure, bait, or urine. Y’all may need to make coyote prints in the dirt to keep it real.
Here’s what I’m not getting on your “educated” coyotes…and this is everyone’s educated coyotes. Y’all use the same lure/lures for however long you’ve trapped through the years, but yet all of a sudden this educated coyote gets caught. Y’all have even stated how they’ve avoided this set or that set to be caught in so and so set. If he was truly educated then he/she wouldn’t be duped unless it was using the same trail day in and day out and finally stepped in a blind set with no lure or bait.
With that being said I still don’t see how moving something will prevent a coyote from working a set. I don’t care one bit if there’s an ambulance at my favorite restaurant, if I can get in I’m going in. Hasn’t it been established that coyotes movement and curiosity is based on hormones and food? I don’t think they just wake up and think I’m gonna go for a walk today and avoid everything I see that’s different. They do what they do every day.
Yes, I’ve had “avoidances” even posted pics of a coyote walking around a dirt hole but wouldn’t commit. So what did I do? Left the dirt hole as it was and moved off to the side about 2 foot and put a set in with a shot of urine. Next time the coyote came through it got caught in that trap and ended up with his back foot in the dirt hole trap.
So was that an educated coyote?

To me the only way a coyote is educated is if he gets caught and gets out. That has nothing to do with anything being moved unless he investigated something new and that’s when he got pinched. Or he investigated a dirt hole and got pinched. Or walked a certain trail and got pinched. I would say maybe watching his/her mate get caught, but that would mean no doubles or triples on a catch so that blows that out of the water.

Steel you mentioned using natural lure, what about bait? How is muskrat a natural bait to a Texas coyote? I will say the same thing about a Georgia coyote. We don’t have muskrats where I live yet they catch coyotes. I do know using “natural to the area” baits work.
So natural lures are referring to gland lures? You mention using red fox urine. How many of them do they have in West Texas? We do have a few of those around and plenty of Grey it seems, but I’ve heard others say that Grey Fox urine doesn’t really work. Anyone here tried it for coyotes?