How would the statement "The analogy of the man needing rescue and not taking the help is not in the Bible and irrelevant"? how would that fit in with when that small voice speaking to us in a convicting way and we over ride it, then the next time its even easier not to listen and become calloused over.

God sent Jesus, but how often do we reject Him? Are we waiting for another, perhaps looking for a bigger scene and grandstanding?

Sometimes the whale swallows us and pukes us out on a beach. Jonah, must have surely been a back-sliding Baptist, that would make anyone puke, even a big fish, lol.

I wonder how a God fearing people justified violence to expell a king and create a nation? I guess the pastors of that era got it wrong.

I wonder how a God fearing people justified violence to expell a king and create a nation? I guess the pastors of that era got it wrong.

God has used both warrior and martair through out history to do his works.
We would need a leader to lead us and it would have to be God's will. The biggest thing is how would u govern after. The economy would be toast. I mean we are running on borrowed money now. A civil war would burst the bubble we are living in. The people would just vote for the guy that would promise them that the government would bail them out which is a big reason we are where we are at now.

Finance would be less of an issue than goods and charity. We were there once before and survived it.

Finance would be less of an issue than goods and charity. We were there once before and survived it.

I hear u but the mindset of the vast majority is much different than back then. People freak our and get in fights if they think they might run out of TP nowadays.

I stand corrected Foxpaw. Your point gives us hope in a positive way. Church attendance is way down these days and that is most of the problem of how people act. The young people don't have a clue.

We are not here to judge and the Christian wars should not be forgotten.

With only like a 11% of the church living by a biblical world view, the fight might need to start with the church.

Right now we have traitors running our federal government

Trump fought back and look were it got him - demonized.

Cliven Bundy fought back.

There is a 9 in 10 chance if you fought in DC, you would be fighting the enemy. I’m certain there are cities across the country with similar odds.

If you're referencing the study that I think you are, I think it was 9%. I had to preach last month, and I used some of that data. Incidentally, Foxpaw, the scripture I was working with was Jonah 1. Anyway, do you remember what they said the America's true religion is? Syncretism. It's true. Most people who claim Christianity in America just apply Christian words and Christianized philosophies to whatever else it is that they actually worship. For some it's the Economy, for some pleasure, or wealth, or freedom. For many it's America (or aspects of its politics or political ideologies) Just read this thread. This is a conversation asking Christians how to fight "the enemy." We have had several excellent posts that are based in a biblical worldview, but watch how much just assumes that the American political right is "us" and the American political left is "the enemy"






I'm not going to beat around the bush or put any cherries on top of this. Sorry if I cause offense, but I have to speak the truth. This does not represent a Christian worldview. This is syncretism. We are worshiping a modern version of the goddess Roma. We just call her America now, and sadly we think God approves of it. This kind of thinking and the kind of living that grows out of it is part of the problem. This is a huge part of what the Bible is trying to tell us. When we look at how humans collectively sin as nation-states, you'll notice that people will elevate their national/social/political/economic identity and claim (or assume) that they have divine authority. Then they start oppressing, enslaving, killing, and waging wars to protect that political system. It always leads to death and destruction. The Bible calls that part justice/judgement. It's all over the Bible. Genesis 11. Exodus. Kings. Daniel. The Revelation. When we value our political identities above our God-given identity, then we are NOT participating in the Kingdom of Heaven. That is the wide path that leads to destruction. It's adding bricks to the tower of Babel. It's the same thing every human kingdom has always done: promote itself and its own authority at the expense of other image-of-God humans. Christians are called to live differently (because they think differently) and to participate in a different kind of kingdom. This kingdom's highest value is love (even for your enemy). Its loyalty is to God alone, not to human leaders. The goal is an entire humanity UNITED in LOVE to glorify GOD. Worship of political systems leads only to division and death. Read the Bible. Read a history book. Read the news. Read your life.

I'll stop ranting and leave you to read what Paul has to say about unity in Colossians 3:

But now you also, rid yourselves of all of them: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and obscene speech from your mouth. Do not lie to one another, since you stripped off the old self with its evil practices, and have put on the new self, which is being renewed to a true knowledge according to the image of the One who created it— a renewal in which there is no distinction between Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, and free, but Christ is all, and in all. So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness, and patience; bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so must you do also. In addition to all these things put on love, which is the perfect bond of unity. Let the peace of Christ, to which you were indeed called in one body, rule in your hearts; and be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God. Whatever you do in word or deed, do everything in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father.

Why didn’t Habakkuk take up his sword and add to the violence he was crying out to God about? Because vengeance is the Lords. Habakkuk’s call was for repentance and humbling ourselves before God....that’s our battle cry. I know my pride is a bigger threat to me in the big picture than anything the culture, democrats, or anyone else can do to me. Thanks for the verse mark i hope I’m not putting words into your mouth this is just what I see in the text as related to this topic.

In regards to the Old Testament stories, the point of them is to point to Christ. David vs Goliath, points to Jesus’ ultimate victory over sin and death and the rescue of His people. Samson, Deborah, Gideon....points to Jesus as our perfect judge. Jesus is out perfect, judge, perfect High priest, perfect intercesor, perfect mediator, perfect sacrifice, and perfect savior. When we read ourselves into the hero roles of the Old Testament we are missing the point, it’s about Gods glory, not us saving ourselves in His name, where He gets 99% and we get 1% credit.

The analogy of the man needing rescue and not taking the help is not in the Bible and irrelevant.

I humbly hope I’m making good points and have been praying about how to answer, since I’m home with sick kids and wife from work today.

Yes Vengeance is the Lord's because only the Lord can send a person to (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) for their sin. But justice belongs to the saints and the the only way to get true justice is to judge the the judgement that is already written in the Bible.

Like I shared from the Bible... evil men understand not judgment but they that seek the lord understand all things.




It will always be the job of Christians to judge righteous judgment. It will always be the judgment written that is righteous. These things will never change yet modern times has men choosing not to do no judgment which is why we are here. Remember what Jesus said to the Pharisees....
Matthew 23:23 KJV
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

See Jesus scolded them for NOT doing judgment telling them "ought ye to have done". Meaning they were wrong for practicing religion but not having faith, mercy, and doing judgment.

It's simple as I said. Most Christians just don't want to believe it.