ADC Trapper Forum

No Profanity *** No Flaming *** No Advertising *** No Anti Trappers *** No Politics
No Non-Target Catches *** No Links to Anti-trapping Sites *** No Avoiding Profanity Filter


Home~Trap Talk~ADC Forum~Trap Shed~Wilderness Trapping~International Trappers~Fur Handling

Auction Forum~Trapper Tips~Links~Gallery~Basic Sets~Convention Calendar~Chat~ Trap Collecting Forum

Trapper's Humor~Strictly Trapping~Fur Buyers Directory~Mugshots~Fur Sale Directory~Wildcrafting

Trapper's Tales~Words From The Past~Legends~Archives~Kids Forum~Lure Formulators Forum


~~~ Dobbins' Products Catalog ~~~


WCS
(Please support Wildlife Control Supplies, our sponsor for the ADC Page)






Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment #7850310
04/21/23 03:56 PM
04/21/23 03:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
B
BrianC. Offline OP
trapper
BrianC.  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
Looking for thoughts from those of you who have been at this game for a little while.

I'm looking to make a significant investment in the Beaver side of my ADC business. I am curious when it comes to traps do you put a high priority on "higher end" traps to potentially go the lifetime or "more bang for the buck". I absolutely love the thought of buying top quality but living in the real world every dollar has to be stretched as far as it can go. Here's some of the pros and cons I have weighting in on right now....


Pro's/Con's
'Higher end" traps have the potential to outlast more abuse. I say this cause I don't believe any manufacturer makes junk. If taken care of and used as intended all are quality.

Buying "less expensive" traps allows more equipment to cover more jobs equals more revenue. Also more equipment can mean doubling down on the hard to catch beavers which means happy customers and off the job off to the next sooner.

Buying "higher end" traps sometimes means the difference between the animals destroying or putting out of service traps which ties up assets, takes additional time sometimes back at the shop/house making repairs, in general driving up cost.

Buying "less expensive" traps doesn't hurt near as bad when stolen. (I try to intentionally keep less expensive traps to set in places I feel this could be a possibility but we all know it's gonna happen when we least expect it).

Buying "higher end" traps sometimes have that edge through manufacturers design or add ons that can mean the difference between catches and misses.

We can play this game forever but I think you get the picture.

I know the skills and knowledge of the trapper FAR OUT WEIGHTS the equipment. Just looking for thoughts from a business owners perspective in our line of work.

Thanks in advance,

Brian

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7850459
04/21/23 08:31 PM
04/21/23 08:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,986
Midlands South Carolina
S
SGT. C Offline
trapper
SGT. C  Offline
trapper
S

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,986
Midlands South Carolina
I have settled on 330 & 280 belisles, mb750, 3/32 snares. Dobbins lures, Minnesota timber lure and sac oil.
I use the kiss thory. Keep it simple stupid.
Yes, it does hurt to lose quality gear to thieves. But, for adc work it is a must. I've caught beaver by the tail in 330 belisles.
Use the same equipment over and over. Sets go in alot faster and easier.
Sarge


Getting old is a fatal mistake

Always looking for reloading componets

I know a beaver or two, because I've seen a beaver or two
Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7850730
04/22/23 10:01 AM
04/22/23 10:01 AM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Jim Comstock Offline
trapper
Jim Comstock  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
I have probably used as much different equipment as anyone, footholds, bailey, hancock, snares, conibears of all sizes, built my own unique self supporting conibears, shot many beaver and now settled in with our swim through Comstock cages for the past 13 years because they work best. I still have all of my old gear, but it doesn't see much use. We don't use cages because we make them, but because they can be used anywhere without worry about pets or people, while they are far more versatile and quicker to set and easier to place than other traps. Still trapping every day, we managed another 20 beaver in the past few days, upping the total to 1,867 since October 29, 2010. I will never say that I don't need or want any or all of the other devices as situation dictates, but they are fill ins. So far this year I have caught only one beaver in a pair of CDR's. For efficiency there is good reason to have as many different devices as possible, but I know cages are faster to set than conibears. When you don't have to wire off or stabilize or narrow channels you soon realize that merely setting and dropping in cages is hard to beat. They don't really need camo either, unless you need to hide them from people. When you invest in high quality equipment you get high quality results. Nothing worse than a sprung trap or escape. You learn that after you have spent a month trying to catch a wised up animal that you missed and should have been caught the first night. When it comes time to sell a business or just retire, if you have quality equipment it sells quickly and often for good portion of your investment, which means that it cost very little to use the good stuff when amortizing the difference between purchase and sale price over the years, probably pennies a day.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7850784
04/22/23 11:06 AM
04/22/23 11:06 AM
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 4,106
Frazee, MN
B
backroadsarcher Offline
trapper
backroadsarcher  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 4,106
Frazee, MN
Once you made the investment you are done in most cases. I am still using 330's I purchase 40 years ago. Same with foot holds. #4 Victor double long springs are a good trap. Of course I still buy some new stuff just to scratch the itch.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7851084
04/22/23 08:56 PM
04/22/23 08:56 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Jim Comstock Offline
trapper
Jim Comstock  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
I have the itch every day of my life when it comes to new stuff, always looking for newer and better gear. "You are only as good as your equipment," an article I wrote in the 80's. Conibears I bought nearly 60 years ago were sold 30 years ago when BMI first made magnums. The day I found out about Belisles I bought a bunch of them and never regretted it. If your conibears are not magnums you are missing the boat. Magnums have saved me a bunch of times. For anyone who has not yet caged beaver, unless you do it yourself you will never know the advantages. I have always been open to learning about anything new and different and to this day if someone would show me better I wouldn't hesitate to switch yet again. I know theft is a concern, but now after catching 2 more beaver today, up to 1,869 in beaver cages now, I have never had any cages stolen. I set cages differently than conibears much of the time so many times people would not know where to look for them and would not just stumble upon them. There are no give away wires or stakes. Brush or logs can be placed at random on or near the cages so there is little for anyone to find. I have lost some conibears over the years, but not all that many, while there have been long periods without issue. I would never buy a lesser conibear to save a buck or a lesser anything for that matter. The sickening feeling of a loss can be remedied with reliable equipment. No worse feeling than a loss or miss in low end gear when you realize that the best equipment just might have saved you. But, rather than just take it from me, its best to ask the guys who are using them see what they say. I know one trapper in Canada who has a pair and caught over 500 beaver in them while a Washington trapper has by now taken at least 1,000, averaging over 100 per year.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7851452
04/23/23 10:43 AM
04/23/23 10:43 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Brian Mongeau Offline
trapper
Brian Mongeau  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Jim, what are the downsides of your traps? They are obviously effective. Cages in general are bulky and heavy. Fighting brush, mud, etc with a couple cages is exhausting. A road culvert is no biggie, but needing to get off the road with no access for a quad? In CT we can't drown anything under our nwco lic., so caging would require dragging it out alive or dispatch on site. Discharge of a firearm near a residence is not always feasible.
I use Koro and Hancock live traps when carrying is close to vehicle access also, so I know how far I want to carry heavy equipment. Besides the danger part of the clamshell types (been smacked twice). I don't do a ton of beaver work, but may be placing an order. Thanks.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: Brian Mongeau] #7851498
04/23/23 12:00 PM
04/23/23 12:00 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,315
Nebraska
silkyplainscoyot Offline
trapper
silkyplainscoyot  Offline
trapper

Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,315
Nebraska
Originally Posted by Brian Mongeau
Jim, what are the downsides of your traps? They are obviously effective. Cages in general are bulky and heavy. Fighting brush, mud, etc with a couple cages is exhausting. A road culvert is no biggie, but needing to get off the road with no access for a quad? In CT we can't drown anything under our nwco lic., so caging would require dragging it out alive or dispatch on site. Discharge of a firearm near a residence is not always feasible.
I use Koro and Hancock live traps when carrying is close to vehicle access also, so I know how far I want to carry heavy equipment. Besides the danger part of the clamshell types (been smacked twice). I don't do a ton of beaver work, but may be placing an order. Thanks.



Technically, beavers don't drown. Perhaps if NWCO was presented with the correct information, maybe that could be worked out. There was some good research information presented on this.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7851589
04/23/23 02:43 PM
04/23/23 02:43 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Brian Mongeau Offline
trapper
Brian Mongeau  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Silky, this is CT, facts don't matter here. Just like every other extremely liberal state.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7851663
04/23/23 05:00 PM
04/23/23 05:00 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Jim Comstock Offline
trapper
Jim Comstock  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
First, no danger with the Comstock beaver trap, user friendly, pretty benign, not like the clamshells. A hancock is 33 pounds, bulky. A Comstock is 22-23 pounds, much lighter. I will be 73 this year and have worked with them since I was 60. I use bungie straps with clips on a single and carry it on my back while pulling a 24 wide sled with 2 more if need be. They are bulky for sure, but I can carry 16 in a 78" pickup bed. I set few traps and don't have to stay long most of the time. Sometimes I just set one or two, but may set a bunch if I have a wide spot that needs more. Much of what I do is roadside, but I have hauled them more than a half mile up a mountain at one point and was very glad I did when I saw what I was dealing with, requiring a wide versatile trap. When you see how much more is now "settable" when you have a cage compared to conibears you will realize it's a good trade. Warrior has said that carrying is more work, as it is, but he also points out that setting cages is much better for speed setting and what you can do with them once on site. So much that was off limits with conibears is now all but perfect for a cage. As far as dispatching and all that you are allowed to do, that is a state issue. We usually set them under water. If they must be set on top, it's no different than the clam shells, where you can shoot. These cages will all but float in muck and can be set on any hardpan at any angle. I have balanced them on bedrock and boulders more than once. Culverts require nothing more than set and slide them in. The diagonal on an 18 inch wide trap is 21, so it slides up and out of site in culverts as small as 24 inches. We also have a 12x12 that will fit even an 18 inch culvert.

What is also a plus with cages is you have to carry no wire, no stakes, no frames, no stabilizers, nothing but traps, a potato hook, nippers and some castor, such a clean and simple operation for a guy who generally has way too much junk loaded up, "just in case." I do all I can to avoid slide wires, weights and all the junk that goes with footholds and conibears. Oh, brush can be an issue of course. Since I have the nippers with me, I will take a little time to whack some of the vines and stuff when I know I will be making a few trips, which removes the aggravation of getting snagged up, proving to be well worth the effort with a little cutting.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7851692
04/23/23 05:36 PM
04/23/23 05:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 19,884
St. Louis Co, Mo
B
BigBob Offline
trapper
BigBob  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 19,884
St. Louis Co, Mo
Very interesting post!


Every kid needs a Dog and a Curmudgeon.

Remember Bowe Bergdahl, the traitor.

Beware! Jill Pudlewski, Ron Oates and Keven Begesse are liars and thiefs!
Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7851727
04/23/23 06:21 PM
04/23/23 06:21 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Jim Comstock Offline
trapper
Jim Comstock  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
There are still many trappers who have not yet considered cages for beaver, still thinking about the limitations of the former cage traps that most think of, single door, gravity operated, pan traps used on land or in very shallow water with lure. It's very rewarding to surprise people with success with something new and improved. I remember when we told Paul Winkelman that 18 inch long double door traps would work for woodchucks, which was followed by the expected skepticism. He said that a trap that short was just too short, no question about it, until he tried them. He didn't realize we had already caught 50. When skeptics become believers it makes it all worth while. When Randy Volk appeared in an article in Trappers Post saying that he had caught 300 beaver in the swim through cages I had to call him and ask about it. Right off he said, "no that's not really true." Disappointed, no one likes to hear about exaggerated stories, especially me when it concerned the swim through beaver traps. Then he said, "It was over 400." But, the best quote I will never forget from Randy, "You have greatly improved the quality of my life." Because conibears were illegal without permit in Massachusetts, cages allowed him to trap everywhere and anywhere he wanted for the first time in years with a practical trap to be used in runs like conibears.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7851754
04/23/23 06:58 PM
04/23/23 06:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Brian Mongeau Offline
trapper
Brian Mongeau  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Thanks Jim.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7852596
04/24/23 08:10 PM
04/24/23 08:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
B
BrianC. Offline OP
trapper
BrianC.  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
I appreciate the insight. Live trapping beaver is definitely something I will be working on in the future. The investment in quality seems to be the running theme and I couldn't agree more when possible.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7853130
04/25/23 02:25 PM
04/25/23 02:25 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Jim Comstock Offline
trapper
Jim Comstock  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
One important thing I've learned is that with cages and conibears, or even snares at times for that matter, if beaver are already trap shy due to an encounter with a fur trapper during the season, they won't hit anything they can see. Usually when I set cages it's a quick in and out proposition with dumb ones, a day or two if there is a pair of beaver. When I set cages, like conibears, I expect to connect quickly. If beaver avoid what I know are good cage sets the first night, I'm ready to go to a new plan the same day on the spot. I don't like to waste time hoping they will someday hit them. If there are dumb beaver and the traps are in good runs you don't have to wait, so when I have left traps for additional days it never has been productive.

I set 3 cages in a small creek in Feb, got nothing first night which told me two things, there was only one beaver and also told me he was smart. Two smart ones are really rare, so usually I bang one if there is two. I didn't have other gear with me like I should have, so I fenced the creek with the 3 traps, but as expected he avoided them the second day. Had him the following day in a pair of CDR's.

Just set a finger coming off a small pond on a gold course, the only narrow spot I could easily see. Set it with no luck for 5 days as the crew checked them. Was planning on going down to look for something else to set yesterday because I didn't have a lot of confidence in the sets, but had both beaver yesterday. I was busy with other beaver in the other direction and so didn't mind leaving them, but by no means would have made daily trips for nothing. Still ended up with only two trips in the job in the end.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7853469
04/26/23 12:03 AM
04/26/23 12:03 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 681
Iowa,
E
eedup Online content
trapper
eedup  Online Content
trapper
E

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 681
Iowa,
Brian who will be your customers with bvr problems? Urban areas or timber, I have duke 330, duke magnum, belilse 330, Jim's cages, folding bvr swim thru and Hancock plus snares and footholds I use them all during the course of a year in many different situations. My timber stuff the various 330's are my go to, snares and foothold also. Counties or municipalities or private landowners get more cage use. Welcome to the fun....that last bvr can be a big headache !

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7853470
04/26/23 12:11 AM
04/26/23 12:11 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 681
Iowa,
E
eedup Online content
trapper
eedup  Online Content
trapper
E

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 681
Iowa,
I've had different thoughts on that Jim. Sometimes patience gets the bvr for me. This is usually timber work. Countless times I've caught em all but one and I try adding this or that, then add more and invariably a week or more later I catch it in my original set and im done. I don't know if they were "smart" or just had different habits than the norm. I get paid hourly and mileage on all bvr jobs easy ones don't cost the owner much....ones that have been messed with and take time...cost em lots more.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7853480
04/26/23 02:08 AM
04/26/23 02:08 AM
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 249
WA/AZ/NE/IA
D
DVinke Offline
trapper
DVinke  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 249
WA/AZ/NE/IA
I have had female beaver hole up for 7 days.
Is it the time of year?
I would encourage every professional beaver trapper to document what works for the time in the year you are trapping.




Daveís not here.
Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7853790
04/26/23 03:37 PM
04/26/23 03:37 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Jim Comstock Offline
trapper
Jim Comstock  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Could very well be the time of year for the females, giving birth? Just had one not come out for several days after taking 3 good sized males, one 50#. She would not touch a dam, even with major holes. The home owner pushed the house with a back hoe, the house which I had puddled earlier in the week with no luck, and then she came out finally. No idea where she is now.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7853875
04/26/23 06:52 PM
04/26/23 06:52 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Brian Mongeau Offline
trapper
Brian Mongeau  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 912
Killingly, CT
Eedup, my beaver work is rural residential and state DOT/secondary roads. DOT jobs are usually roadside culverts. Had a couple town parks. No HOAs or railways yet.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7854076
04/27/23 12:10 AM
04/27/23 12:10 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 681
Iowa,
E
eedup Online content
trapper
eedup  Online Content
trapper
E

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 681
Iowa,
Oh, I was addressing the op .......hard to recommend gear without knowing what he's working or thinking he'll work

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7854103
04/27/23 03:29 AM
04/27/23 03:29 AM
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
B
BrianC. Offline OP
trapper
BrianC.  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
When it comes to customers majority for now are privately owned water impoundments. Usually in the form of ponds (we callem tanks in Texas), some creeks and lake front properties. Few true timber jobs. I use any and all resources to get the job done as soon as possible. Including shooting them in open water. Time is money and I try to give my customers the best job as soon as possible. I live in a unique area where my customers are mostly either newly acquired landowners typically from the metroplex wanting to live the "country lifestyle" or investments. With all the growth we are seeing more gated HOA's. I want to take on these clients for the volume and potential reoccurring jobs. Although, these typically are going to require live capture.

With all that said I would like to build my inventory and reputation to take on local municipalities and possibly timber companies.

One bonus is I am the only dedicated trapper for hire in the county and surrounding. The county has a animal control but they always refer beaver to the State Parks and Wildlife if they even get a call.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7876998
06/02/23 06:34 PM
06/02/23 06:34 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,436
Sumner, Mo.
C
claycreech Offline
trapper
claycreech  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,436
Sumner, Mo.
Quality equipment pays for itself and holds its value if taken care of.
Iíve got Jimís beaver cages. Beaver catching machines. I donít use them in the summer nearly as much because we have what must be the highest turtle population in the world lol. Scouted a job today, and a pair of Jimís cages will be placed tomorrow.
The more types of traps that you have at your disposal that you can match to the time of year, terrain, etc. that you have confidence in and you are proficient with, the more successful you will be.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: claycreech] #7877697
Yesterday at 09:38 PM
Yesterday at 09:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
B
BrianC. Offline OP
trapper
BrianC.  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 27
TX
Claycreech, I couldn't agree more about have an arsenal of options.

Re: Beaver Equip.Today's Cost vs Tomorrow's Investment [Re: BrianC.] #7878103
3 hours ago
3 hours ago
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Jim Comstock Offline
trapper
Jim Comstock  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 364
New York
Always good to have a variety of equipment and good equipment. I guess I have a bunch of some traps, conibears and cages and one or more of everything else for beaver. Having traps that keep working is a must. I caught 100 beaver in the first cage of the type we have now before I gave it to Tom Parr for the museum. Had a trapper from Canada stop by this spring to pick up some more beaver cages who had used two of the swim through cage traps for a few years in his business. Asked him how many he had caught in them. He said over 500 and they were still catching.

Page 1 of 2 1 2
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread




Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1