we have our fur-bear workshop coming up, and on the agenda is posting sign that we have traps out on roadway and trail. Has anyone in your state's had this come up and if you did what did you do to defend not having to do this,

That’s akin to putting a sign on every house front door saying “ Money in top drawer in back bedroom”.

I would have to agree. This proposal came about because someone had a dog caught in two different legally set traps two years ago. He wants trappers to put signs up if you have traps within 25 feet of a road. We need help in how to stop this before it actually gains traction. Here’s exactly how the person is trying to justify signage.
“
First, thank you to the MDNR and the Furtakers for this opportunity to share our ideas and experiences with you. Over the last two years, we have discussed this with multiple members of the National Resources Commission, Michigan DNR personnel, and a couple of prominent members of Michigan trappers organizations. These discussions have led us to believe that it is possible to work together to create new tools to protect adults, children, and leashed pets, without restricting the activities of trappers.

We have had two encounters with legally set traps while walking our dogs on leash along roads and two-tracks through state land near our home, which we do almost every day. The first was a very close call with a conibear trap by a creek near a county road; we were able to pull her back at the last second, but know that if we’d seen it a moment later she might have died. The second time she was caught in a leg hold trap that was set within three feet of a two-track we often walk; she made a full recovery but it was an agonizing experience, we were both injured while trying to free her, and we had the financial burden of an urgent vet visit. While both traps were perfectly legal, we also were following leash laws, using well-traveled trails, and otherwise doing everything that should make it possible to enjoy a walk on public lands without it turning into a traumatic incident.

In the interest of public safety, we propose the following requirement: If a trap of any kind is set within 25 feet of a public road, drive, or trail, a warning sign must be posted in a highly visible place along the trail in both directions, 100-150 feet before the trail’s nearest point to the trap (or first trap, if multiple traps are set close together).

These signs should be designed for maximum visibility and clarity. Example: an 8”x10” reusable sign with a red outline and red lettering reading “Warning: Traps Set Ahead”, and smaller print including clarification that there is no required set-back for traps from the trail. A hiker seeing this sign would be able to turn around or, if they choose to proceed, exercise extreme caution.

We have looked into the cost of producing signs and it seems quite reasonable; we suggest that the state should produce and distribute them for free.

It may be necessary to come up with a different warning system for those furtakers who set a large number of traps across a wide area. Online mapping technology may be a useful tool in that situation.

One concern we are sensitive to is whether the signs will put traps at increased risk of being stolen or tampered with. We do not believe so for the following reasons:
1. Because the signs do not need to be right by the trap, a person would still have to search very hard to actually find the trap.
2. People who are concerned about traps are more likely to simply avoid the area, or at least having been suitably warned, will not be shocked when they come upon a trap and are less likely to react rashly.
3. By doing their job of preventing encounters with traps, the signs would also protect those traps from being sprung through accidental contact.

Trappers who are particularly concerned could also simply set the traps farther from a trail, avoiding the need for signage. Our belief is that by working actively to promote greater public safety on public lands, furtakers may get greater respect and therefore experience less theft and interference.

In many rural areas, state lands which allow hunting and trapping are for many people the best (or only proximate) places to hike; even in parts of the state where there are other options, the general public should still be able to enjoy these state lands safely. Even those who are aware that trapping is allowed on these lands are limited in their ability to mitigate their own risks, especially if hiking with dogs or children, without knowing when and where there are actually traps set.

Michigan already has some laws meant to mitigate the severity of certain trap encounters, but we hope you’ll agree it is never acceptable for humans or pets to become trapping victims. The ultimate goal should be prevention.”

yes, we [trappers] are against it, but we need to come up with, good reason why?

Lol

Working almost exclusively in town I fully understand the issue. While it would be nice to think that simple signage would alleviate all possible negative interactions human nature says otherwise.

What is the almost instinctual reaction to a wet paint sign?

And that doesn't even take into consideration the subset of the population that holds criminal or malicious intent.

If signage is a must I've found that a generic closure of the area with no trespass without explanation as to why is much better than offering a reason for exploration or tampering.

Does the sign say “steal me”? So each hunter will need to put up a sign “ I’m hunting over here” it makes about the same sense. I’d add a component to the trapper Ed class on avoiding issues not enough integrity in the world for this to come out positive.


I’d put up a M44 sign to avoid problems that would get the job done more efficiently.

What do the folks that are required to use them have to say about them? I’d start there.

We have a law here that states traps can’t be set on paths or trails commonly used by humans or domestic animals. I’ve had a hard time coming to the acceptance of the fact that the new trap setters don’t always possess common sense. To a kid now, a 220 bucket a hundred feet behind a subdivision is a long line. Personally, I would never set a trap along a public daily walking trail with people and dogs, especially a 220. Even if legal. I’m afraid it’s going to catch up to us through incidents of not very knowledgeable people setting traps affect the rest of us greatly just due to the publicity factor. It’s happened in several states. Sometimes in order to cut off future problems I believe it’s better to, for lack of a better word, concede sometimes and work with wildlife agencies to show we realize the issues and want to work with them. Now though sometimes any show of concession, like on guns, they just go to the next thing on the list.
We had an issue here with a public wildlife management area, a coon feeder ( yes they do that here) the houndsmen we’re using to “ concentrate” their dog training, a trapper, a 220 bucket and a group of coon hunters and dogs. The problem with public ground is that there’s no landowner go between for the users. We actually put forward the offer of no 220’s on public wildlife management areas. We can still use them on private property, otter crossovers, groundhog dens and such.Sounds like you are having a similar issue.
Now, I stand firm on the position that a trapper that has permission on private property is absolutely blameless if the catch a domestic that has no permission (night hunter) that goes on the property and gets caught. Same goes with free roaming deer chasers.
You might want to look at a tweak of wording that is completely within the trappers spectrum of understanding and leave the public out of it. I certainly would oppose telling everyone where my traps were. All the problems or things that come up there’s a tendency to jump straight to the trapper being in the wrong. This is certainly not the case.

My Beagle Club did a study on "no trespassing" signage and came to the conclusion that Dogs can't read, and have NO idea what a fence is.

The "adults and children" is the part that gets me and tells me right off the guy is full of crap:

protect adults, children, and leashed pets,

Most ardent antis refuse, flat out, to leash their dogs too so I'm skeptical, to say the least, about the leashed part as well.

The issue is dogs and traps no matter how many times they lie.

On Public lands here in Idaho I have seen warning signs on posts along two track roads that traps are set for animal control and it is illegal to disturb the traps. But then again, this is the West

It's the law here and I hate it.

Keep setting near public access roads and trails and your going to lose your right to trap In those areas.

It’s getting more difficult these days to rabbit, coon or bear hunt and not trespass. Lots of fences, signage going up and more and more people with feeders out for deer and turkey that don’t want a pack of dogs running through their property. Trappers and hunters in Kentucky are required by law to have permission to enter private property even to retrieve game or packs of dogs. I’ve seen coon hunters here turn dogs out in someone’s yard they have permission to park and let the dogs go all over neighboring properties saying dogs can’t read. Same with rabbit hunters and railroads. The railroads are really bearing down on rabbit hunters here. Years ago everyone hunted the railroads. Things have changed a lot.

Agreed, out of sight out of mind. But what about dp's, cages, submerged, elevated, enclosed, and any other dog safe method?

Those sets would work.
But would a law have to be set In place to prohibit sets other then the ones mentioned?
You catch the wrong persons dog and you may lose that type of trap. That's what happened here In WI with the 220.

Signs are just going to give anti's and Johnny Sneakum a starting point to find your traps. They may not find them all but will certainly find catch circles and live/dead animals.

True Brian, especially a live animal within 25' of a road or trail. Sign or no sign.

"within 25 feet of a public road, drive, or trail,"

They should know, without signs, that if it is trapping season there is a chance of being traps in areas open to legally trap.

True but that would mean that they had to accept personal responsibility for their actions and not place all the blame on someone else

Same here only with coyote hunters. They get permission on one small parcel of land only to run the entire county stating that dogs or coyotes don't understand property lines. I fear the day I catch someone's hound only to discover that $500 dog is now worth $5000 even though I have permission to be there and they don't. Hunters and trappers need to stick together or we will all lose our hunting and trapping privileges.

That's what already happened here in MI too. We already have the dp's, cages, submerged, elevated, enclosed, and any other dog safe method rules for the most part.

thanks guys but not much help yet ?

Sorry, I don’t think it is an unreasonable request. Get your traps off of the public roadways and trails. Seems like common sense.

You're kidding, right?

Heck no he’s not! Why do you think Dahlgren is having trouble coming up with a good reason against it for chrissakes???

Keep it up.Before you know it we're going to have to justify why were trapping on public lands,whether its next to a trail or in a cedar swamp.Ask the trappers in New Mexico and Arizona about that.

If we had a DNR that actually had a set and stood up for us we wouldn't have to justify everything we do all the time.The two examples given,one was legally set and one was illegal.2 tracks up here would be considered public roadways and they've been trapped since they were made.Trails on public land,is a deer trail illegal to set?I'd say any trail on public land whether a deer trail,abandoned logging trail,abandoned driveway would all be illegal,any place there's A path could be declared illegal. Who came up with the 25' rule,if your walking your dog along this 2track and hes not on a leash what guarantee is there he ll stay with in 25' of you? Actually,its my understanding in this state if he isnt hunting hes supposed to be on a leash.If he takes off and gets caught 100' from the road are we still responsible?If not now how about in the future?
This is a tough one because if they go along with it,it will open up a huge Pandora's box.

The first thing should be a clear definition of a public roadway.Not some vague "its up to the local C.O.'s definition " nonsense.Trails?What kind of trails?Public hiking trails?Any trail that permits a person and a dog thru the woods?Does this include mink trapping on a right away or trapping a beaver colony damming a culvert?Does the rule start on the shoulder of the road or from the center?Ask them about the definition of the leash law,why is it when the dog in a trap story hits the media the leash law is never mentioned,including by our DNR.Also,the DNR should be hitting back on these "we're doing it to protect kids and adults" stories .Demand A print out of people reportedly injured by traps and the circumstances surrounding them.I smell a conniving rat here by the way that letter is written .It boxes us into a corner and they're trying to blow it up in our face.

It’s everywhere.



Here’s another one of their’s.

Here is a sign I posted voluntarily.


Another one of mine. This sign is near the trailhead. It also lets other trappers know I’m already there.

ATA has developed signage years ago. It is a general heads up to dog owners as well as trappers. I don’t have a good pic handy but I’ll try and find one. We have had success deflecting most setbacks etc by stepping up with this general advisory signage. Signage to raise awareness and reduce conflict. I think it helps some guys think twice about maybe setting someplace questionable.

You think setting traps where you have a high probability of catching someone’s dog is going to help?

The unfortunate truth is that we are way outnumbered. Less than 5% of the population hunts, and the number of trappers is a fraction of that. The general population tolerates hunting/ trapping because it generally doesn’t affect them. Well, start affecting them and see what happens next.
Use your head, do whatever you can to reduce conflict. We won’t win at the ballot box when the wheels start squeaking.

We used signs when setting on the railroad for nuisance beaver.No chance of the public coming across them,it was to let the other Railway workers know to be aware there were traps set for beaver in the area.
You are only asking for trouble setting traps in areas the general public frequent.,signs or no signs.
What is the use of putting signs at traps back in the bush,no one is going to see the sign.

Our federation has signs available for trappers that state-"This is a trappers trail,there may be traps and snares set on or near this trail
Be advised it is illegal to tamper with traps."

They are used at the trappers discretion,no requirement to post your trails.

General signage helps raise awareness and reduce conflict.

That all on the surface sounds logical but when you really boil the water out of the pan it makes you nothing more than a boot licker, things die so that you can live ( I didn't make the rules) and those that oppose this do only because there bellies are full...God forbit that day ends.

I agree Grumley, but that’s not the point. I guess it’s a choice between a quick end to trapping by being stubborn, or keeping the tradition alive as long as possible by using some common sense. It’s not a question of if trapping will end, the question is when. I don’t like it, but you don’t need to look too hard at the world and the country to see the writing on the wall. Our mission is to keep it going as long as possible.

I'm of the belief that before plastic food hits the market reality is gonna hits us frist... just my opinion.

And I hope you are right.

Not sure I agree with this..but what passes passes..

Been the law in Oklahoma for years. My take on it: The few that do put up signs, leave them there and never take them down. You drive past the same “Traps” sign all year long, year after year. Some are painted on gates, some on old tires hanging on fences, some on neat little cut out boards. No one pays attention to them anymore because you don’t know if there are actually traps there or not. Most trappers I know don’t bother putting them up. Pretty much ineffective for their intended purpose. With that being said, if it gives the lawmakers a warm fuzzy feeling and allows us to keep our trapping rights in that state then maybe that’s what needs to be done. I wonder if states like New Mexico would have tried this, if it would have made any difference.

Tell you what, if it passes I'd buy a couple hundred signs and put them up EVERYWHERE trapping is legal in the area. Cover every trail and anywhere else signs are required to trap. Keep them wondering if there are traps there or not. Let those who would steal them look over a few hundred places where there probably aren't even actually traps.

You'd for sure get a lot of exercise using that kind of solution !!!

I like it.

w

I like the idea, but I wonder if they could ticket you for that.

And you think by posting these signs that's going to help?Anybody who's ever done any amount of predator trapping up here has trapped these roads.I noticed you didn't respond to my questioning on what's a public roadway or trail.As far as what's palatable to the public at the ballot box,a law saying we have to advertise where our traps are located isn't going to make us.Our state is controlled by the mobs in southern Michigan,you should know that,you live not too far from them.Whether or not we put up signs doesn't mean 2 sh%+$ to these people they want us gone.I seriously doubt you've ever trapped these areas or conditions by the sound of it.One more thing,LE's ambition to prosecute trap thieves can be summed up in 3 words,little to none.Is there going to be a concentrated effort prosecute these degenerats after we advertise where our equipment is?I doubt it.

some good points made , thanks

It’s the sign requirement that really gives me a problem. I’m not concerned about people stealing my traps 25+’ off a trail because they’d be more likely to steal a trap set on the trail if they could find it anyway. What really concerns me about the signs is the safety hazard that certainly can be created. There are people, zealots, who will go to great lengths to stop me from trapping by spiking or making the trails unsafe for me personally, my truck, and /or my quad.

About trail designation. The DNR already has a double handful of trail designations by their DNR Forest Roads Web Map program. In my County I use this a lot because I do have a lot of square miles of State lands with a vast multitude of logging trails. As it is right now, I can find many logging trails less than 1/4 mile long I’m prohibited to run the quad on but not necessarily trucks!! If I can give one piece of advice to the MT&PC (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman), be darn careful not to fall into another trail designation trap!

We have “leash laws” here, that is to say the owner must be in control of their dog at all times whether tethered or not. We have bird hunters, rabbit hunters and coon hunters here as well as some pretty liberal trapping regs.

The last incident I can recall, the owner was ticketed for not having control of the dog. This was before social media where an individual can tell their own set of facts to gin up sympathy for stupidity.

I think the DNR should put out that trapping season starts on the date that it does and warn people about it. if we mark trail heads , I believe that the anti will bring their dog and try to get them caught in a trap?

You think setting traps where you have a high probability of catching someone’s dog is going to help?
. [/quote]
And you think by posting these signs that's going to help?Anybody who's ever done any amount of predator trapping up here has trapped these roads.I noticed you didn't respond to my questioning on what's a public roadway or trail.As far as what's palatable to the public at the ballot box,a law saying we have to advertise where our traps are located isn't going to make us.Our state is controlled by the mobs in southern Michigan,you should know that,you live not too far from them.Whether or not we put up signs doesn't mean 2 sh%+$ to these people they want us gone.I seriously doubt you've ever trapped these areas or conditions by the sound of it.One more thing,LE's ambition to prosecute trap thieves can be summed up in 3 words,little to none.Is there going to be a concentrated effort prosecute these degenerats after we advertise where our equipment is?I doubt it.[/quote]

I don’t think signs are the answer and your points about what defines a trail are valid. I think the answer is taking it upon ourselves to not set areas (roads, known walking trails) that are most likely to be used by dog walkers and avoid the conflict in the first place. Do our best to keep it from becoming a ballot issue, because that we won’t win in the long run. If that had been done then Dahlgren might not be in this situation.

From experience signage won't make any difference to those that oppose trapping other than drawing more attention to the area for them to concentrate their harassment of trappers,, and I would question the dog owner that says the animal was leashed and throw the brown BS flag when they say it was, have seen dog walkers in the fields unsnap the leash as soon as out of sight of the Trailhead, dogs running free, chasing deer and anything else that moves

I think what's confusing people here is the term "public roadway or trail". Visions of a gravel road or trail with families out enjoying the day with their dogs come to mind of most people.In reality these roads,or 2 tracks here in the U.P, run for miles and miles with no large urban areas nearby.The only people for the most part using these trails in the fall are hunters and the few trappers.Is it possible somebody walking their dog would run into a set?Sure it is,my point is it isn't any more probable than anywhere else on state land.There are not hordes of people waiting to jump on these trails,the population of the whole U.P. is around 300,000.I don't care how careful you are,or how many laws you pass,dogs will get caught,somehow,somewhere.And in this media atmosphere with everybody a photographer thru their cell phone it gets posted on social media.Again,that's forcing trappers to answer for everything gone wrong whether its our fault or not.I personally don't set tight to 2 tracks because I had too many things gone wrong,I never caught a dog,but coon and sometimes fox that couldn't pull the drag out of the bed so its right there on the road,skunks caught and spraying any truck that drove by,etc.So really,I tend to stay off the road anyway.But I can see really easy where this is headed.

I think dog walkers and trail users should have to post signs whenever they do such. I don't think this is an unreasonable request.

Many of us gave thoughts and opinions on the subject, but not much advice to Dahlgren. I think most trappers don’t want to post sings and don’t want conflict, but that ship has sailed and it is being forced, so now it’s time for damage control to steer the outcome to our best interests.
My “solution” would go something like this:

Warning sings must be posted for any lands traps placed in these locations:
1 - Less than 50’ from any public roadway or trail that is being maintained by the state, county, or town.
2 - Less than 25’ from any man made trail for a distance of 1 mile from the nearest public roadway that is being maintained by the state, county, or town.

If you don’t want to place signs, then don’t place traps in these locations.

I don't know. It's worth trying though, I just wouldn't tell everyone.

So just give up? That is exactly what they want you to do. You let them win on this and they will take a bigger bite next time. No sir. You need to fight to keep everything you have AND fight to improve upon that. Mi. giving in and "compromise" has them losing more and more and NEVER gaining back anything they have lost. Look at their cable restraints for example. They are virtually worthless now with their restrictions on them.

Hey Joe
you have used your quote "You think setting traps where you have a high probability of catching someone’s dog is going to help?" several times now. Do you really think any of the guys answering your question does that?
As far as I read the original letter didn't say they were using designated paths. Just 2 tracks and roadways.
My question is Why should it be trappers responsibility to protect your dog if it isn't being walked in a known safe place?
just

I had a beaver removal in a nature preserve that required dogs to be on a leash. Had an incident with a black lab that a hiker let run and play around the beaver dam about 150 feet from the nearest trail. The dog was unharmed besides a bit of a sore paw, but the preserve property manager thought signs would be a good idea. I agreed with him that there was a chance they could encourage people to actually keep dogs on a leash, so I said “Sure, as long as you agree to pay for any stolen or damaged equipment!” He thought about that for a minute, then said, “well the dog wasn’t hurt, and we do have the leash rule, so lets just forget the sign idea…”

Really?Not much advice?I thought he got good advice on where to start.That ship has sailed?Why?Because a dog was caught?Out of the thousands of traps set in this state every fall I can assure you it wasn't the only one and it won't be the last.And we're not rolling over and playing dead to placate these people.Go back and read the letter again and pay attention to his wording.The naive ones reading this post aren't the ones who are against the signs,there the ones who think if we play along with this it'll resolve any and all conflicts about trapping on public land .It'll only be the beginning.

Oh yeah, many of you are the same people that think Trump can win.
Good luck winning trapping support at the ballot box if you keep setting stupidly.

How much trapping have you actually done?

I assume you are talking about designated walking trails or is it every road trail or opening where someone "Might" walk" If either one is so then hikers dog walkers and bikers should have to pay an access fee OR buy and carry a hunting or trapping license since Gov. Snyder Pittman Robertson funds have been accessed to build trails and streamside parks He designated birdwatchers and hikers were "Sportsmen too"
In this part of Michigan many two tracks that used to be called firelines have been blocked off by the dnr and its no accident these parcels have manicured and maintained walking paths on them with Free Parking at trailheads
its not good but making others pay for accessing public land and putting restrictions on when and how is all i can say to you

As a side note if i do set on public land i'm old and forgetful so a good gob of skunk alongside the road helps me to remember

Since 1986. Not sure why that matters though.

I had permission to trap predators on a National Seashore. The head ranger allowed buckets only with signage on the bucket that said "Danger Trap". You can imagine what a few tourists did to those buckets.
I placed most buckets in extremely thick areas. One day I found a woman digging at the base of a tree, many yards from a pathway. She said she was geo-caching. I had to look up what that was. She had a dog with her on a leash.

Some local residents fed raccoons and feral cats. Park service asked me to keep a daily log of all animals - except feral cats. We agreed to relocate any live cats that were caught in my 220s. Sounded good.

I carried a letter authorizing me to trap on the park property and wore an NPS vest. One ranger challenged me but lost.

Did this for 2-3 years during the season. The Dept of Agriculture trappers came in March with no restriction at all. They were good. Unreal what they removed in one week.

I finally donated all my gear to the NPS. Got a nice tax deduction. Only profitable year I ever had as a hobby trapper.

I can't give a good answer for M I problem. But the public land l hunt and trap has signage at the entrance that read. Hunting=Trapping=Fishing.
this area is closed to all other activity from September 1 thru February 28 . Division of wildlife.

To your first question, I think I only typed that once, but yes I do think some on here think it is their god-given right to put traps anywhere they want.

Second part- let’s say it was someone hunting on the 2-track - who would be responsible for a bullet that was fired indiscriminately?

One thing I'm seeing is this is more of an issue where the public has free access to lands not their own.

It's really not an issue down south where all land is posted by law. Even public lands require some form of written permit.

Right Warrior.

And Utilitarianism generally rules - the greatest good for the greatest number.
News flash - we aren’t the greatest number.

Michigan citizens own 4.6 million acres of state land that is managed by the Michigan Department of Natural Resources (DNR). The land is managed to protect Michigan's natural and cultural resources, provide quality outdoor recreation opportunities, and foster regional economic prosperity.

And posting signs will turn all that around.Hunters are behind the 8 ball too.If you had a referendum on hunting in certain states I got no doubt it would go down too

This will be my last post on this topic.
Be smart my friends, avoid conflict.
Consider these stats:
Trappers in the US ~200,000
Households with dogs in the US ~65,000,000
That is 325 to 1. I don’t like those odds if it comes to a vote.

Well thats too bad that you wont post anymore.
Do you know how many of those 65M walk their dogs along public roadways?
Very few i would guess.
Of those few do you know how many dogs are on a leash?
And of those few how many have a reasonable length leash that they can control their dog?
Control the dog...Control the dog...Control the dog
just

Ok, I lied, this will be the last post

All dog owners (lovers) can vote against trapping, not just the ones with caught dogs.

I understand both sides. But I also understand being smart about what you enjoy. I trap private property and have run into the same issue.

One property landowner just got some “shed dogs.” I asked where they roam and he said his wife will walk them to the first field and that’s it. I told him I wouldn’t set up front is stay midways and back and confirmed via map where all sets were and did I need to move any. The answer was no. Day 3 I get a call, id caught one of his dogs. I told him he was lucky because I was on the property already, he wasn’t. His wife decided to walk the property with the dogs and one got caught. I pulled up and she was hysterical telling me she had the vet on standby and she’d rush him there as soon as I could release him. These were Labs and she held his neck while I released his paw. He licked me and went back to roaming. She couldn’t understand how he was walking because his paw was broke. I called the dog with my “man” voice and he came and sat at my side. I asked her to show me which paw was broke. She was so hysterical at the time she didn’t even know which paw had gotten caught. I called the landowner and all he did was laugh. Still trap his property to this day.

Another property I told landowner and manager I had conibears out for beavers…NO DOGS on the property or Id pull and never come back. A week later my camera goes off of dogs and trucks everywhere. I flew there calling the out of State landowner at the same time. Apparently the manager decided they’d run some hog dogs. But guess what, the hogs don’t go where you think they’ll go and the dogs have pursuit. I told him if a dog got in one before I got there it was on him and the dog owners aren’t going to be happy. Luckily he reached his manager and they got all the dogs rounded up before anything bad happened. I was a little on the ticked off side and made everyone gather around and took a stout stick and set one of the Belisles off. When that stick snapped I told them thats the same sound it would’ve made on their dogs neck. Pulled everything and the next time he called my prices has went up. Still trapping that property and he doesn’t even allow his manager out there the three weeks I’m there now.

Personally I’m all for being smart about it. If there’s a chance a dog can happen upon a trap, especially a conibear then I don’t set there. Footholds are a little different, we get strays all the time, but I still don’t set property lines if there’s a paved road or houses…even on private property. I don’t want the hassle or the landowner getting calls if someone finds their pooch in a set before I get there. It just common sense honestly. It is private property so legally I can set anywhere on that property, but it’s just not good relations for everyone involved. Y’all may have read about me talking to a neighbor of the plantation property and about Sarah his Boxer. She was about 300-350yds from the property line and .65miles from her house when caught. Owner never knew, lol.

Just keep a good relation with those around or use the same lands we do.

I brought this topic up during a g&f meeting to ban trapping.
I suggested maybe add signs in very popular areas by non hunters and non trappers stating something like... Warning: hunting or trapping may be occurring, don't be loud and keep pets on leash. Harassment to hunters and trappers or excessive noise is interference of hunting and is subject to criminal punishment and or fine.

I've had several experiences where non hunters have ruined my hunt because of noise, pet dogs. I've known lots of people to be harassed for hunting. Then there's the whole crowd of people that say I didn't know hunting happened here in the nf or blm

When I first started in the mid '70's there were 2 states with laws that stood out,one was I believe Connecticut and I don't remember the other.One state you couldn't set a predator trap unless it was in the water,the other state it had to be set in a 8" burrow.This was to protect dogs.There.Lets go to that,that'll make um happy

You make a good point. However we must remember your average citizen is very likely to have had a negative encounter with a dog somewhere along the line. Traps, not so much. So yes trappers must exercise restraint but so must dog owners. it's a 2 way street.

4.5 million people
Dog bites pose a serious health risk to our communities and society. More than 4.5 million people are bitten by dogs each year in the United States, and more than 800,000 receive medical attention for dog bites, according to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control (CDC). At least half of those bitten are children.

I'd never put up with having signage of any sort ! I used to trap for a few bird clubs and let them all know where they would be and that they were not hunting in those areas any way due to rotating fields. An exercise in futility, the very next check I had shot up fox, coyotes, coons and skunks because they were helping me !! Had another visit with the land owner who was the one requesting the trapping, told him I would have to charge for lost fur if something wasn't done to control my "help", he suggested flagging them, LOL, thats when I went to night vision and thermal later on with calling, was not as high a take rate as trapping but it was a compromise the owner could live with. You will never stop people from messing with your equipment if they know your are in the area, no matter what some say, there are to many who don't care.

As to leash laws, out here two tracks are usually 6 feet across, if one is hiking on a two track and the trappers is 25 feet off the road setting, just how long is that leash have to be to let that animal get that far off the road, nothing mentioned about leash lengths, which is a big thing now days to keep all dogs and other pets requiring them to be on them and under control, obviously this is not the case when these uneducated misfits go hiking and can't control their pets, I would certainly bring that up for discussion as if they were even on a ten foot leash the animals still could not get near any set 25 feet away.

You can always move out further as well and keep them out, there is no way a leashed animal is going to find a trap on its own while being held, unless that hiker or owner is doing the hiking of trail as well, which is mostly the case or the animals are not leashed until caught !

Alaska has the sign and set back issue come up every year. In my experience, most dog owners think their dog should have the right of way before anyone, or anything, else. As Drasselt posted, dogs are more a danger to humans than trapping. How many children die from being caught in a trap each year? Zero? How many from dog attacks? Between 10-20 per year.
Try googling statistics on dogs hurt by other dogs? If anything should be clear from the SCIENCE of statistics, dogs are what should be restricted on public lands. Not traps. Where I live the borough (Alaska version of county) recently created a definition for dangerous dogs. They did that so they had a definitive reason to confiscate dogs that are a danger to PEOPLE and other dogs. So far there has been no effort to define a "dangerous" trap.
Average Joe wants to pull back. Hide. We are outnumbered. I disagree with that attitude. Trapping is an important tool that controls diseased animals. Some of those diseases can transfer to humans and or domestic dogs. Trapping provides a public service at NO charge to the public.
The person requesting signs made this statement: 3." By doing their job of preventing encounters with traps, the signs would also protect those traps from being sprung through accidental contact."
Notice this person thinks it is the trappers sole responsibility to prevent dog encounters with traps. That is not a workable solution. The dog owner should be just as responsible by keeping their dog restrained and ON the trail/two track.
The nutcase also stated it isn't acceptable for humans to become trapping victims. When has that happened? What isn't acceptable is for humans to become DOG victims and the statistics say that is the more common problem.
Stand up for trappers, Dahlgren. The facts are on your side.

Dogs can be dangerous.
A couple weeks ago a friend of mine had her son attacked by a pit bull.he was able to knife it to death but still had to get a couple stitches on his forearm and inner thigh.

thanks guys keep them coming , advice is getting better

Just say no.