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550, closed or offset #8024059
12/18/23 02:55 PM
12/18/23 02:55 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
east central WI
K
k snow Offline OP
trapper
k snow  Offline OP
trapper
K

Joined: Oct 2009
east central WI
Been getting a little more serious about canine trapping. I am running a mix of modified Duke 1.75's, 2's and MB 550's. All closed jaw. The dukes are inside laminated. I'm noticing the 550s are a little rough on feet, at times. Would offset jaws help with this? The traps have the stock chain, plus a swivel, 10 more inches of chain and a swivel at the double stake attachment. Mainly targeting coyotes, with the occasional fox. I've read that coon can pull out of the offsets, not too concerned with that, in today's market, but may weigh into my decision on what to buy more of.

Any input is appreciated.

Last edited by k snow; 12/18/23 04:50 PM. Reason: Corrected lamination
Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024071
12/18/23 03:16 PM
12/18/23 03:16 PM
Joined: Dec 2017
Kansas
Pawnee Offline
trapper
Pawnee  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2017
Kansas
I’m a OS guy. I switched to 550’s and the other brand probably 6 years ago and really like them.


Everything the left touches it destroys
Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024074
12/18/23 03:18 PM
12/18/23 03:18 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Swamp Wolf Offline
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Swamp Wolf  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
You will have more foot damage with offset jaws.


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Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024079
12/18/23 03:26 PM
12/18/23 03:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2012
Nevadafornia
L
Lazarus Offline
trapper
Lazarus  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2012
Nevadafornia
By state law, mine have to be offset. But I've never had an issue with these traps. I consider them one of the finest bobcat traps made. Easy on the foot, just the right size, and I love the rounded, smooth-faced jaw.

All that said, I think there are other options for canines.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: Lazarus] #8024082
12/18/23 03:30 PM
12/18/23 03:30 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
east central WI
K
k snow Offline OP
trapper
k snow  Offline OP
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K

Joined: Oct 2009
east central WI
Originally Posted by Lazarus
By state law, mine have to be offset. But I've never had an issue with these traps. I consider them one of the finest bobcat traps made. Easy on the foot, just the right size, and I love the rounded, smooth-faced jaw.

All that said, I think there are other options for canines.


Could you expand your other options statement? Bobcats aren't a big factor for me here in WI. Not something I am going to target with any regularity.

I am not limited to Dukes or MB's. I am open to all possibilities.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024084
12/18/23 03:33 PM
12/18/23 03:33 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
SW Pa
B
Bob Jameson Offline
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Bob Jameson  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
SW Pa
If you trap in different states, there are many that require offset jaws. I use both, I have seen no difference in foot trauma. I run a few hundred 550 MB's. Love the trap in 2 coils. For predators they are a great trap.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8024087
12/18/23 03:37 PM
12/18/23 03:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2023
Pennsylvania
elsmasho82 Online content
trapper
elsmasho82  Online Content
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Joined: Jan 2023
Pennsylvania
Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
You will have more foot damage with offset jaws.



Is that because the animal can slide?

Last edited by white17; 12/18/23 03:57 PM.
Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024089
12/18/23 03:41 PM
12/18/23 03:41 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Northern Mn
rick olson Offline
trapper
rick olson  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2012
Northern Mn
Offset hands down,the 550 isn't a good coon trap,but the OP was asking about canine's.I don't own a canine trap that is closed jaws.Close to 200 traps for canines.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024091
12/18/23 03:49 PM
12/18/23 03:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2023
Ohio
B
bleeohio Offline
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bleeohio  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2023
Ohio
I like os for canines for sure. I'm convinced most damage done is due to lack of good swiveling action. Os allows for higher lever lockup, yes not the best for coon but the 550s have smoother jaw faces that will let the tapered coon feet slide easier. Some love them, some not , it's what you get used to.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024092
12/18/23 03:50 PM
12/18/23 03:50 PM
Joined: May 2018
SW Georgia
W
Wanna Be Offline
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Wanna Be  Offline
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W

Joined: May 2018
SW Georgia
I notice more foot damage with the offsets. I really don’t care unless I have a feral I want to release. I do not want to lose anything with feet, losing is money lost whether it’s a possum or coyote.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: bleeohio] #8024094
12/18/23 03:55 PM
12/18/23 03:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2023
Pennsylvania
elsmasho82 Online content
trapper
elsmasho82  Online Content
trapper

Joined: Jan 2023
Pennsylvania
Originally Posted by bleeohio
I like os for canines for sure. I'm convinced most damage done is due to lack of good swiveling action. Os allows for higher lever lockup, yes not the best for coon but the 550s have smoother jaw faces that will let the tapered coon feet slide easier. Some love them, some not , it's what you get used to.

Some fella on the YouTube just said the same thing basically about lockup. Which I didn’t understand until put right in front of me visually. And he also said the same thing about swiveling, I can see how that makes sense. Now I’m totally confused about why some states would demand the use of OS

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024096
12/18/23 03:59 PM
12/18/23 03:59 PM
Joined: May 2018
SW Georgia
W
Wanna Be Offline
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Wanna Be  Offline
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Joined: May 2018
SW Georgia
They think it reduces damage to the paw. Some swear it does, all I can go by is my experience.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024097
12/18/23 04:00 PM
12/18/23 04:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2023
Ohio
B
bleeohio Offline
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bleeohio  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2023
Ohio
I think some states have been made believe that with the os jaws, the paw has better circulation while it is handcuffed. Thus being more "humane". Is it true? Not sure.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024099
12/18/23 04:05 PM
12/18/23 04:05 PM
Joined: Jul 2016
SD
T
TC1 Offline
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TC1  Offline
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T

Joined: Jul 2016
SD
Closed jaw all the way. With a cast wide face of the 550 the whole thought of damage is not even a factor. Lockup wise, never seen a coyote pull from a closed jaw, even marginal toe catches are still there when you arrive to take care of business. With an offset, doubt that would be the case. Not to mention the bonus critters that will be caught. Big skunks, coon and otters are not something I’m ok letting get away I guess…


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Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024100
12/18/23 04:07 PM
12/18/23 04:07 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Oscoda, Michigan
J
John-Chagnon Offline
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John-Chagnon  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2015
Oscoda, Michigan
On MB 550 Closed all the way. Those wide cast jars are great.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: bleeohio] #8024103
12/18/23 04:17 PM
12/18/23 04:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline
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Yes sir  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Originally Posted by bleeohio
I think some states have been made believe that with the os jaws, the paw has better circulation while it is handcuffed. Thus being more "humane". Is it true? Not sure.

Not unless the jaws are touching at there high spots. If the animals foot is what is stopping the jaws from closing the OS and closed jaws are basically putting same pressure on foot. I've measured some coyotes feet caught in traps and it takes at least 3/8 offset to not be squeezing foot with tight. Loose squeeze results in more sliding back and forth thus more foot damage.

Don't think with today's modern, well designed, well built traps the mechanical advantage of offsets is really much of a factor.i like closed jaws because I'm I want to hold every coon, possum and skunk thar steps on it.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024104
12/18/23 04:17 PM
12/18/23 04:17 PM
Joined: Oct 2023
Ohio
B
bleeohio Offline
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bleeohio  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2023
Ohio
The 550 jaws are rounded and smooth which may not be the best for toe catches. I just nabbed a big male yote the other day in a duke 1 3/4 os by the back foot with only two toes in a pee set. He had the place tore up big time so i know he had been there most of the night. The jaws on the dukes are sharper for lack of a better term and i've never measure but the offset looks to my eyes a little narrower? I've had pullouts in reg. jaw traps and i've had pullouts in os jaw traps. Part of the game i guess.

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024105
12/18/23 04:18 PM
12/18/23 04:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline
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Yes sir  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
OS "look" more humane

Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: k snow] #8024119
12/18/23 04:39 PM
12/18/23 04:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Wisconsin
T
The Beav Offline
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The Beav  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Wisconsin
I'm no fan of the offset jawed trap.

There's NO CIRCULATION In a critters foot with any trap. The foot swells up and that's all she rote. A critter chews on It's feet because there Is no circulation and no feeling.
The difference In the lock up factor between offset and a closed jaw trap In so minimal It dosen't make any difference.
I don't understand outside lams. When the trap goes off on the foot the Inside bottom edge of the trap jaw Is the tightest on the foot. Inside lams will help In this situation.
Swiveling will help with ligament and tendon damage but I don't see It helping with foot damage.


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Re: 550, closed or offset [Re: elsmasho82] #8024120
12/18/23 04:40 PM
12/18/23 04:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Swamp Wolf Offline
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Swamp Wolf  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Originally Posted by elsmasho82
Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
You will have more foot damage with offset jaws.



Is that because the animal can slide?


Yes...the foot is allowed to slide a little.

About 35 years of live marketing foxes and coyotes, where any cut is noticed by the buyer, and I paid close attention to what trap characteristics were best. Most trappers don’t pay much attention to a bloody foot, but I sure did. Sometimes that was the difference between a saleable coyote/fox and one I'd have to pelt or discard.

Over the years, it was easy to see that any offset jawed trap (didn't matter what brand) had a higher cutting rate (especially across the boney top of the foot) than a strong-springed regular-jawed trap. Not every catch with the offsets resulted in cutting, but way more than the regular jaws did....enough that I sold all offsets I had and replaced with reg jawed. All the traps need lamination.

As I mentioned, I kept very strong spring on my reg jawed traps. On the 1.5 & 1.75 sized traps I kept #2 music wire springs on them. I wanted the traps to clamp and not slide at all as the critter fights the trap. All my traps were top laminated and most were baseplated with center chain attachment....and a heavy duty in-line spring....about 12 to 14 inches of chain....staked down.....no drags.

Did I get a bloody foot with the reg jaws? Yep...but it wasn't very many....usually was a hard fighting, larger coyote.

My goal was a perfect foot aka NO cuts at all...just a crease across the pad where the trap's jaws were seated. Long ago, I gave up on finding or modifying the perfect trap for live market fox & coyote. I learned that trap doesn't and will never exist. You can have one or the other....as their feet are too different in size. Ultimately, I strived for the best coyote trap as they were the better $$ on the live market. And coyotes are easier to handle than a bunch of mean live foxes.

I've used about every common coilspring trap, both offset and reg, on the modern market.
Victor 1.5s & 2s, Sleepy Creek 1.5s & 1.75s, Bridger 1.65s & 2s, MB450s and 550s, Duke 1.75s & 2s.

I chose Sleepy Creek 1.5s and 1.75s regular jawed, top laminated, strong springs, custom chains.....as my go-to live-market trap. Had around 200 of em at one time.

I quit live marketing about 8 or 9 years ago. If I was gonna do it today, I'd use MB 550s reg jawed and target coyotes. Any fox caught would be pelted, unless they had good feet....which is sorta rare as grey foxes feet usually don't do well in an MB550....even a reg jaw....as trap is too big for em to be tussling with all night.

I use Bridger 2 dogless now as I don’t live market anymore. They only come in offset jawed version...mine are not laminated. I pay little attention to foot cutting today, but almost all coyotes, foxes, and some bcats have some cutting. Bobcat feet are less susceptible to cutting due to their thicker padded feet, especially their front feet.






Last edited by Swamp Wolf; 12/18/23 04:52 PM. Reason: Spelling error

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