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Self Defense Coverage Attorneys on Retainer #8058776
01/24/24 03:15 AM
01/24/24 03:15 AM
Joined: Dec 2012
N.E. Kansas
ksfowler166 Offline OP
trapper
ksfowler166  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Dec 2012
N.E. Kansas
A little while ago someone posted a thread asking about the Attorneys on Retainer program. I had never heard of them but decided to do some research. Well I was suitably impressed enough to join up and I want to explain what the AOR program is and its benefits. Since there seems to be people that just hear the name Attorneys on Retainer and make assumptions based on the name with no research what so ever. To be fair this was on the Defensivecarry forums not Trapperman.

For those who don't know AOR is a program designed to minimize the legal cost associated with a self defense incident. Along the same lines as USCCA, CCW Safe, ect. What sets AOR apart is that it is administered by the Attorneys for Freedom law firm as opposed to other programs that are backed by insurance companies. This is where the confusion comes in with comments to the effect of what's the point of retaining a law firm just pay them when you need them or that it will cost a lot to retain the law firm. To address both concerns point of the AOR program is to minimize legal costs so you are not paying hundreds of thousands of dollars as a result of a self defense shooting.

So when you sign up you will enter into an attorney/client fee agreement contract with the Attorneys for Freedom law firm. My contract stipulates I pay $357 per year in exchange I will at minimum (I will get back to that in a minute) have the firm represent me at no cost and pay for stuff such as expert witnesses, investigators, and other court costs and defense related expanses. This applies as well to any retrials, appeals, or civil trial.

What incidents does AOR cover? Well that is the nice thing about working with a criminal defense law firm and not an issuance company you don't get exclusioned to death. It is pretty straight forward.
1. You have to be charged with either a felony or misdemeanor.
2. The inciting event has to take place after you sign up for the program.
3. You can reasonably and in good faith assert you acted in self defense or defense of a third party.
That's it no if you are in NY or WA we won't cover you at all. I could be a prohibited possessor in a "sensitive space" while under the influence with a full auto Glock 17 and I would still qualify for coverage it really doesn't matter. Of course I couldn't rob a bank, demand money from the teller, and then shoot her that would not be covered. Since I clearly did not act in self defense. That being said they are a criminal defense law firm and would be happy to represent me in such a matter and would give me a 35% discount for being an AOR member. Now for something less ridiculous nothing above say it has to be deadly force or a firearm. It could be a fist fight or you pepper sprayed someone it would be covered just the same.

Some of the benefits of AOR vs insurance backed programs.
1. Available in all 50 states
2. No recoupment provisions
3. No dropping or denying coverage because it looks like a bad shoot or put another way they cover criminal acts.
This last one is important insurance companies are legally prohibited from insuring criminal acts. Who determines what a criminal act is? Well the obvious answer is you either plead guiltily or are found guiltily by a jury. How the insurance companies offer appeals coverage when the only way to get to an appeals trial is to be found guilty of a crime I do not know. The more troubling answer is the insurance company can look at your case and decide it was a criminal act and deny coverage as recently by USCCA.

Other things included in you AOR plan.
1. Bail bond coverage of $50,000 cash or $500,000 secured though you would still need to put up the collateral.
2. Scene cleanup
3. Mental health services
4. Reimbursement of confiscated firearm
So the at minimum earlier is because in the event a state classifies the above benefits as insurance they will not be offered in that state. Since the Attorneys for Freedom is a law firm not an insurance company.

How does all this work? I have been talking about an Arizona and Hawaii based law firm while I am in Kansas. Anyways wouldn't it be better to have a local attorney who knows the law, the judge, and the workings of the courts? To address these last points first, the law is easy just pull the statutes. A local attorney knowing the judge and the workings of the courts can be a benefit. Which brings us to how do you get out of state attorneys to represent you? Out of state attorneys can be admitted Pro Hawk Viche to practice law in another state. This among other things requires a local attorney to sponsor them and assist with the case. So you do get the benefits of local knowledge and if you have a local criminal defense attorney who you like you can request them to be the Pro Hawk Viche counsel. What happens if the Attorneys for Freedom are denied Pro Hawk Viche? That is not likely since there is supreme court precedent that you have a right to the counsel of your choice. But in that event they would pay for local counsel of your choice to defend you.

I think that covers everything of importance that I can think of. Obviously I have condensed and left stuff out if anyone has question I will try to answer them as best I can. Maybe take a shot for every time I wrote attorney.

Re: Self Defense Coverage Attorneys on Retainer [Re: ksfowler166] #8058783
01/24/24 04:08 AM
01/24/24 04:08 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Coeur d' Alene, Idaho
J
James Offline
"Minka"
James  Offline
"Minka"
J

Joined: Dec 2006
Coeur d' Alene, Idaho
These guys here are too smart to need an attorney.

Jim


Forum Infidel since 2001

"And that troll bs is something triggered snowflakes say when they dont like what someone posts." - Boco
Re: Self Defense Coverage Attorneys on Retainer [Re: James] #8058785
01/24/24 05:11 AM
01/24/24 05:11 AM
Joined: Feb 2020
Indiana
P
Providence Farm Offline
trapper
Providence Farm  Offline
trapper
P

Joined: Feb 2020
Indiana
Originally Posted by James
These guys here are too smart to need an attorney.

Jim


Well I did pick up it available in all 50 then states except 2. But it's my 5th or 6th 16 hr shift and I. Have been up now over 32 hrs since I didn't get to sleep any today also I very well may have missed something?

Re: Self Defense Coverage Attorneys on Retainer [Re: James] #8058819
01/24/24 07:33 AM
01/24/24 07:33 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
MD
D
DaveP Offline
trapper
DaveP  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2007
MD
Originally Posted by James
These guys here are too smart to need an attorney.

Jim



I don't need a criminal attorney.
I need a CRIMINAL attorney....

Uh, oh!
I'd better call Saul!

Re: Self Defense Coverage Attorneys on Retainer [Re: ksfowler166] #8058922
01/24/24 10:48 AM
01/24/24 10:48 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Henry Co, IL
3
3togo Offline
trapper
3togo  Offline
trapper
3

Joined: Jan 2018
Henry Co, IL

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