For the people that live in the states that allow it ,what effects have you seen on your trapping coyotes and bobcats ? I seen where Tennessee is going to start it on private grounds coming this fall . From my understanding they have been fighting against it for sometime now and finally caved in ,shotgun only for now .

No effects at all.

The govt shoots them from airplane around here as well as calling them. I heard one guy shot 17 in one day from calling, that was just a few days ago. Locals show me pics of them stacked in piles from successful night hunts. Kill as many as possible if you care about the antelope and mule deer populations

We’ve had it in Virginia for years. No effect that can tell. I’m in SE VA and you’re hard pressed to find big blocks of private land anymore (+500 acres). Most all of the big stuff is private paper companies growing pines. I guess my point is that having open public land just doesn’t exist. The best you could do is get a multitude of permissions, but you’d still be skipping over tons of land as there are so many individual owners of 5-50 acres.

Nothing but bad. It’s negatively effecting them greatly and long term. They’re on egg shells 24/7. Daytime calling/denning suffers tremendously, they quit working trap sets, if they’ve been hunted over bait they quit working baits.

The number the shooters kill doesn’t amount to a hill of beans but they sure educate and ding up a pile!


I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again, if just half the shooters out there killed just half of what they claim they do, there wouldn’t hardly be a coyote left out there.

Even shot at they still come back to the baits.My brother shot 9 adult female coyotes at night on the family farm this year.There will be more moving into the area.Trapping season my brother will be catching more.

I can trap and shoot them at night and see a difference…for about 2 months. After that, it’s start all over again. Been trying to exterminate them for years and ain’t happened yet. There’s always a fresh crop every year, even shooting females during denning season doesn’t seem to help. Different areas (terrain) and populations can have different results.
What I’ve seen is if I can’t catch them, call and shoot them. Then again, if I can’t call them in, then trap them.

Please provide something besides your opinion that shows coyotes quit working traps when hunted at night? I understand you have a strong opinion on it, but if there is some sound scientific basis for what you are saying, I think we'd all be interested. To the Op, I dont think youll see much difference, we hunt them hard with hounds, callers and thermals in my area....and the trappers continue to get their share. I will say, youll know when you start getting the coyote numbers back in check because youll have red fox showing up in numbers again....and thats not a bad thing..!

I agree with Boone. Thermal boys educate and brag. As a trapper there a royal pain. Alot of trappers will lie to rancher to not let him know how many coyotes they actually took. Just cause trappers are secretive by nature. The thermal boys are the opposite. They brag big numbers but kill very few. I was talking to John Graham one day and he made this statement. Covid changed people. Thermal hunting has changed coyotes. Period! Just the way it is. The coyote have adapted and we as trappers have to as well. I'm not against guys thermal hunting but the average thermal guy comes from a far different background than the average trapper. Just the way it is! On another side note with my fur business I absolutely love thermal hunters. They have money to spend and it's nothing for them to drop a grand in cash. Overall there very nice guys that just found a new cool thing. Not sure how long it will last but it has definitely changed coyote behavior.

When you get paid to kill things it’s another tool. Doesn’t matter if it’s trapped or shot, as long as it’s dead.

Shooting them on one property....trapping them on the next.......properties in between have neither hunting or trapping...they're gonna keep coming.

Lots of calling pressure in my area plus the use of thermal scopes and suppressors some callers say they are harder to call now. The States at war with coyotes but they still persevere year after year. Seen 2 pales the other day when I was turkey hunting not a dark spot on either of them.

When you work the same exact property for 9-12 months out of the year on an ADC job you can see the evidence of coyotes working traps differently after they have been messed with. Down to where you may be running a pile of
Equipment trying to kill one specific coyote. The thermal guys around here sit in their pickup, set their lucky duck on the roof of the cab, pup distress on max volume and if nothing shows up they drive to the next slough and try it again. They kill the stupid one and educate the other 5. They tell me stories of doing that exact setup.

SoDaker, not doubting they are harvesting the stupid ones, just doubting that it is greatly affecting coyote trapping (other than there may not be as many coyote alive to get caught in your traps). Maybe things are different in the western open range country, but as you can see by the other responses, most folks arent seeing any negative affects. There is heavy pressure in my area feom everything...hounds, calls and thermals....and the coyote trappers are still getting their share. Again, maybe a geography difference.

Wolf Killed in Calhoun county Michigan by night hunters in January.
The next county East of the Kalamazoo Convention site.
I hear rumors of pressing charges.
Interesting story if you want to google it.
I say good riddance and leave the thermal hunters alone .
They are doing sportsman of all types a much needed service.
Never tried it but It looks like a great time to me.
Looks expensive and properties are hard to get permission.

At least this post tells me who the killers are and those that arent

Y’all do realize people have been shooting coyotes off bait piles long before the public ever knew about thermals or NV? I don’t see how shooting coyotes makes them trap shy.
Maybe trapping the same place 9-12 months out of the year has made coyotes trap shy. In one scenario you’re using sound to draw them in. In the other scenario you’re using their travel patterns and scent. One has nothing to do with the other.

Seems the night hunting pressure has improved the day hunting response here. The night hunting could negatively effect trapping simply by hunters being in the predators hunting areas at night and bumping them out repeatedly.

Sometimes shoot them back to back nights in the same places I trap, the ones that don't come to the call and rifle / shotgun seem to end up in the traps.... non issue for me

Bologna.

Don’t underestimate a coyotes ability to associate one with the other. Selection pressure is NOT exclusive to a single means.

Both are forms of human intrusion. Scent, sight, and sound.

At some point, ANY form of human intrusion is taken as a negative.

Human intrusion at night, normally a safe time, so much more so.

So your trapping scent could have a negative affect on thermal hunter’s success?

Hunters & trappers shouldn't be quarreling w/ each other.

Sure could.

But the thermal hunters probably gonna be more mad that a high percentage tool actually did the job and eliminated the coyotes. So the trapping scent is moot at that point.

I do both. It just a tool in the box for me. We don’t have fenced in areas, and not everyone down here traps nor do they thermal hunt. Any way we can reduce numbers is a win for landowners. I just got off the phone with a really large plantation asking me to come out and shoot, and they have a full time trapper. Different parts of the country have different needs. Y’all want them surviving for fur I’m guessing. We want them eliminated from the face of the Earth. Believe it or not there are thermal hunters that want them around as well. They’ll get permission from umpteen landowners and only hunt the property a few times a year. Landowners are starting to wise up though and get hunters/trappers that want them gone as much as they do. I tend to tick off both sides. The professional trappers come in and hit a property for 2-3 weeks and don’t come back for another 3-4 months. I hit a property a minimum of 4 weeks and leave when nothing is showing up on cameras or no tracks found. What I can’t catch, I’ll thermal hunt.
I hunted our hog population to where we haven’t had a pig on the place in about 4 months now. It was the same with the coyotes except about 2 months later others have moved in now.
The difference between the professionals and myself is they charge about $3000-3500 for 2-3 weeks of trapping regardless of catches. I just get paid by what I kill, cause I’m not a professional. I have a day job and on call every other week. All my trapping/shooting is done before/after work and I don’t feel it’s right to charge a fee for basically part time work.

Nobody wants to save em here hoss. Especially not in a $10 market.

This is sheep country. They don’t want them killed, they need them killed.

Boone is right especially where there are fewer people.
Coyote catch on fast, and a lot of them will just move to the next valley to avoid pressure.
They know the sound of the ranchers truck or ATV, when new ones come in they know it's not the usual rancher
Control guys would hate it if someone taught a coyote about scent and trapping.
They don't know what a trap is, but they know when something isn't right.
I learned most of my trapping coyote in Wyoming where there was a control guy working all year round.
I'm pretty sure it helped me learn to be a better trapper.
I've heard the same things Boone is saying from lifelong control guys

Here in Maine a lot of coyotes are right on farms and right next to houses.

Significant decline in cats. Not supposed to be shot at night though. Harvest numbers will come out in July and we will see if the cat harvest increased at the same time night hunting was implemented. I agree on it educating coyotes. Cats I don’t think it will.

I agree with that! gna be a lot of KS guys tagging cats that never have b4....

Yep. Those cats that come in at dawn are tough to see. Camouflage doesn't work too good with a thermal. I bet antler hunters won't be happy either.

I will be joining the thermal hunting cult here this fall, can't wait to do so, it is less hunters and more dogs here, although soon to be more hunters as people with the income and like to shoot dogs see the difference, at which time the properties and laws of hunting will change as they always do when people in mass end up doing the same thing, PRESSURE on the areas.

To think that coyotes are not adaptive to infringement on their domains at day or night is just happy thoughts to keep one from not moving from area to area !

Coyotes are one of the most adaptive animals on this world, it's the reason they consistently end up back in an area that's liquidated them !! This is no secret, ignoring the fact only increase's arguments from people who wish to ignore the fact.

Enjoy the new sport while you can as thermals will do the same thing to areas as trapping and hunting has always done, control of use to the area, thats worse to me than waiting for the dogs to move back in, which they will eventually, it's in their DNA !!

Y’all painting with a broad brush, lol. Trappers are out way more than thermal hunters, at least down here we are. Thermal hunters on the weekends I’d bet for most places and trappers are out daily.

I’d think on places that WANT them gone that you’d utilize every tool available.
Question for y’all, if you’re riding to check sets and see a coyote in a field/pasture/etc, are you stopping to shoot it or say I’ll catch him eventually?

Sounds like y’all are worried the thermal guys are going to take out a bunch of coyotes y’all could catch. If the goal is to rid the property of coyotes, I’d think the landowners would be happy with it.
Most stands are maybe 30min, sometimes less. Give a few vocals for a response and then switch to some prey, if nothing shows you move on to another spot or property.

I think y’all are confusing the term disrupting vs educating. It may disrupt a coyotes pattern but I don’t see it educating it on traps or how they work a set. Less coyotes to catch? Maybe. I mean if there’s only 4 on your property and they shoot two, then yeah, you now only have two to catch.

And I’ll say this, with an e-caller I now know where to put sets, lol. I live in the land of pine needles and leaf covered two tracks. There are few dirt spots for track ID, but that e-caller lets me know where those jokers live or are at sunset and sunrise. Spots get marked and traps set. Cameras are utilized quite a bit as well. When you have about 6 main roads and 40 miles of feed trails intersecting them you have to utilize them to figure out just where they’re roaming. Calling and hunting at night helps as well. The coyotes I don’t get a shot at has a set placed the next day. More times than not there’s a coyote waiting for me in a day or two. Sometimes it takes a week or more, depends on the time of year.

Killing coyotes is not the problem. Illegal here but very few are letting cats go. Cat populations do not rebound like coyotes. They are not as adaptable nor do they have big litters. Unlike coyotes the male does not help rear young but will kill them if he finds them. Same thing for deer with large antlers. Many wont pass them up. Shooting bucks wont hurt populations any but antler hunters are very protective of "their deer".

I think most in smaller states are miss judging just how many dogs are in the area to begin with.

When you are out in country thats large enough to hold many smaller states, it makes no difference, you can move clear out of the area for a week and come back and others have moved in, might not be the same in a smaller state. Due to the amount of dogs in that area, as well as the distance being covered with takers, takes them longer to move back in.

This might equate to seemingly less dogs for shooters and trappers to witness around.

It's quite easy to adjust ones thoughts to people pressure on many things, cause people move around a lot more and see less LOL

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From what I have witnessed they shoot a lot of everything and brag about it . Warden in this area turns a blind eye !

Coyotes are very profisant at least here in Maine anyways.The more you kill the more that simply move into the area from surrounding areas.

I’d caught 12 during the Spring trapping and killed 13 Aug-Sept. I thought I’d killed them all and was pretty proud of myself.
Quail season ends and I’m ready to start scouting for turkeys and heard three different groups the first week of March! So much for getting rid of them. Back trapping and hunting trying to do some serious reduction in numbers before fawning season.

Amen.

This^^^ is correct.

Boone and Sodaker are worthless turds probably just jealous that the thermal guys are whoopin em on numbers. I for one love going in after some sheep killing coyotes and hearing the rancher say “well I had some thermal guys from the city in here last week” that way you know there was some real tactical stuff going on from some guys who aren’t gonna have to deal with them after they go 1/3 and blast the male and high five each other on the way back to their lifted truck with a coyote hunter decal on the back glass. Thermals rule!

X2

You,me Jamie,Brad,Randy,Cal..ect have ALL educated coyotes!