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Re: Curtilage question [Re: white marlin] #8418146
06/11/25 07:46 PM
06/11/25 07:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline OP
trapper
warrior  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
Originally Posted by white marlin
Originally Posted by warrior
At no time have I ever consented for anyone to enter and wander my property without permission..


is your property posted against trespassing?


No, as all land is posted by law in Georgia and most southern states. Down here the burden is on the trespasser not the property owner to know the property lines. No excuses and only a handful of exceptions, game wardens/surveyors/utility workers. The game warden one is on the way out though with courts in Tennessee ending open fields and a case in Alabama heading that way as well.


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Re: Curtilage question [Re: CTRAPS] #8418150
06/11/25 07:48 PM
06/11/25 07:48 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline OP
trapper
warrior  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
Originally Posted by CTRAPS
Throw a tarp over everything on your property.


Not allowed by code. You can but the tag thing still applies. Now just how they will know raises 4th amendment issues. They abuse that as they're fines come in below the costs of fighting it.


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Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418154
06/11/25 08:01 PM
06/11/25 08:01 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
danny clifton  Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
D

Joined: Dec 2006
williamsburg ks
sell it or tag it


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418155
06/11/25 08:02 PM
06/11/25 08:02 PM
Joined: Feb 2020
Indiana
P
Providence Farm Offline
trapper
Providence Farm  Offline
trapper
P

Joined: Feb 2020
Indiana
Originally Posted by warrior
BTW, in that case where I was told state law doesnt apply. Cat in foothold killed by stray dog. I took it to a bench trial in front of her and in spite of state law clearly saying cruelty does not apply to a nuisance animal to be removed from a home or business I was found guilty of misdemeanor animal cruelty for the one killed by a stray dog not under my control but not for the one that was caught and released, unharmed, to animal control when i was facing two counts not for the dog but for the traps used.

This old bat makes it up as she goes along.

Yet she keeps getting reelected every four years.

If you were to look at the gallery of her courtroom and take note of the demographics you'll see an interesting low value economic common denominator and surprisingly, it's not black. I've yet to see any notable person of the county in front of her bench.

I attempted to appeal that case to state court. Sure just post a 1k bond and this bailiff will escort you to the jail to be booked in before release once you pay the bond.

I paid the 300 fine instead.



That's often the choice we make. I got a bs careless driving ticket in KY on an out of state youth hunt when my daughter was 7 now she is 23 so its been a while back . I had to go to court 4 times they keep continuing it. that was 2.5 hr drive one way each time and some missed work. Cost me a few thousand added up to "WIN" my case. Would have been much cheaper to just pay the ticket and that's what they count on most people to Do. I have just a little to much old stubborn German in my blood to back down when I'm right even if it cost me in the long run.

Last edited by Providence Farm; 06/11/25 08:03 PM.
Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418205
06/11/25 09:30 PM
06/11/25 09:30 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
east central WI
D
Dirty D Offline
trapper
Dirty D  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Nov 2014
east central WI
Originally Posted by warrior


No, as all land is posted by law in Georgia and most southern states. Down here the burden is on the trespasser not the property owner to know the property lines. No excuses and only a handful of exceptions, game wardens/surveyors/utility workers. The game warden one is on the way out though with courts in Tennessee ending open fields and a case in Alabama heading that way as well.


What I think the question about posting your property has to do with is its assumed that anyone, including LEO can reasonably walk up to your front door and knock to sell/talk/ or whatever with you.
If you land is posted, including the path to the door and driveway that might be legal justification to keep everyone including LEO off your property period.

I'm no lawyer but that's my understanding.

Re: Curtilage question [Re: Dirty D] #8418236
06/11/25 10:17 PM
06/11/25 10:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline OP
trapper
warrior  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
Originally Posted by Dirty D
Originally Posted by warrior


No, as all land is posted by law in Georgia and most southern states. Down here the burden is on the trespasser not the property owner to know the property lines. No excuses and only a handful of exceptions, game wardens/surveyors/utility workers. The game warden one is on the way out though with courts in Tennessee ending open fields and a case in Alabama heading that way as well.


What I think the question about posting your property has to do with is its assumed that anyone, including LEO can reasonably walk up to your front door and knock to sell/talk/ or whatever with you.
If you land is posted, including the path to the door and driveway that might be legal justification to keep everyone including LEO off your property period.

I'm no lawyer but that's my understanding.


Not sure on that one. My understanding is that gated property has that effect and I've contemplated fencing the front but I'd need some sort of automated drive through gate as I can't reasonably stop in the road to open and close a gate.


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Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418266
06/11/25 11:05 PM
06/11/25 11:05 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Missouri
U
undercover Offline
trapper
undercover  Offline
trapper
U

Joined: Apr 2018
Missouri
Curtilage is the area that surrounds your dwelling that you keep maintained or fenced. It's the area that you take care of at regular intervals. Think of the mowed yard around your house. That's an easy way of understanding the concept. There are seven exceptions to a search warrant requirement. As mentioned by another on this topic, open fields is another exception. At least that's what I learned in college and then the law enforcement academy. I'm sure some will ask "what about this or that". Look up the seven exceptions and maybe some case law on those exceptions. A trapper site is probably not the best place to ask for legal advice but it's a great place to vent and get opinions from people that have watched Adam 12 (dang...I miss that show).

Last edited by undercover; 06/11/25 11:06 PM. Reason: spelling
Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418287
06/12/25 12:07 AM
06/12/25 12:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2008
Alaska and Washington State
W
waggler Offline
trapper
waggler  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jan 2008
Alaska and Washington State
What kind of code violation are you talking about?
How can they cite you for having an expired tag if it is not on a public road? Never heard of such a thing.


"My life is better than your vacation"
Re: Curtilage question [Re: waggler] #8418290
06/12/25 12:10 AM
06/12/25 12:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline OP
trapper
warrior  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
Originally Posted by waggler
What kind of code violation are you talking about?
How can they cite you for having an expired tag if it is not on a public road? Never heard of such a thing.


Derelict vehicle in yard type infraction. The defining item is the tag not condition. It could be up on blocks as long as the tag is current.

Read that as pay me.


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Re: Curtilage question [Re: waggler] #8418294
06/12/25 12:29 AM
06/12/25 12:29 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Idaho Falls, ID
G
Grandpa Trapper Offline
trapper
Grandpa Trapper  Offline
trapper
G

Joined: Nov 2011
Idaho Falls, ID
Originally Posted by waggler
What kind of code violation are you talking about?
How can they cite you for having an expired tag if it is not on a public road? Never heard of such a thing.


I never did to. Surprising a southern State is doing this.


An old man roaming the Rockies
Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418306
06/12/25 04:38 AM
06/12/25 04:38 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
danny clifton  Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
D

Joined: Dec 2006
williamsburg ks
Couple towns in my county require a tag on any vehicle. One of the reasons i dont live there. Dont keep old cars on hand but if they have ordinances like that they are to far in other peoples business. Were you unaware that was an ordinance? Now you know. Your not getting out of paying that ticket. So put up with it or move. City judge does what the city wants or loses his cushy job.


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418321
06/12/25 06:24 AM
06/12/25 06:24 AM
Joined: Feb 2009
Montana
USMC47 🦫 Offline
trapper
USMC47 🦫  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2009
Montana
I’d wonder more which neighbors complained.


The deadliest weapon in the world is a Marine and his rifle.

www.derricks-nm.com
Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418332
06/12/25 07:02 AM
06/12/25 07:02 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
City living....

Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418355
06/12/25 08:35 AM
06/12/25 08:35 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
wyoming southeast
D
danvee Offline
trapper
danvee  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Mar 2010
wyoming southeast
The county has records when you purchase tags and know that yours was outdated and the vehicle was on your property and registered to you they didnt have to see it just issue the citation based on probable cause like any other violation.

Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418358
06/12/25 08:49 AM
06/12/25 08:49 AM
Joined: Feb 2020
Wyoming
wytex Offline
trapper
wytex  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2020
Wyoming
Drone, they flew it over and saw what you have.
Many, many states and counties are using them now for property tax assessments.
If it is a county ordinance then good luck fighting it.

Re: Curtilage question [Re: danvee] #8418378
06/12/25 09:27 AM
06/12/25 09:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline OP
trapper
warrior  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
Originally Posted by danvee
The county has records when you purchase tags and know that yours was outdated and the vehicle was on your property and registered to you they didnt have to see it just issue the citation based on probable cause like any other violation.


I seriously doubt any of our code enforcement are that savvy.


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Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418383
06/12/25 09:40 AM
06/12/25 09:40 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
wyoming southeast
D
danvee Offline
trapper
danvee  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Mar 2010
wyoming southeast
It all comes up on a computer but go fight it.

Re: Curtilage question [Re: wytex] #8418384
06/12/25 09:41 AM
06/12/25 09:41 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior Offline OP
trapper
warrior  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
Originally Posted by wytex
Drone, they flew it over and saw what you have.
Many, many states and counties are using them now for property tax assessments.
If it is a county ordinance then good luck fighting it.


I'm not really interested in fighting it per se but I got real heartburn over a warrantless search of my property. As others have said and I freely admit there was plenty of probable cause to believe that the vehicle had an expired tag. Just being backed in and immobile for a long period of time and inoperable is probable enough.

But cause is not warrant to search, particularly as this wasn't a movable crime scene or exigent circumstances. I would even go so far as to say there was more than sufficient probable cause to convince a magistrate to sign off on a warrant but they did not do that. Instead they conducted a warrantless search of the property. Especially eggregious considering it was done without consent and while I and the wife were not home.


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Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418531
06/12/25 02:03 PM
06/12/25 02:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
McGrath, AK
W
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
white17  Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
W

Joined: Mar 2007
McGrath, AK
Originally Posted by warrior


But cause is not warrant to search,


I think you are mistaken about that.


Mean As Nails
Re: Curtilage question [Re: warrior] #8418785
06/12/25 09:54 PM
06/12/25 09:54 PM
Joined: Dec 2020
Wisconsin
Scott__aR Offline
trapper
Scott__aR  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2020
Wisconsin
Probably a municipal code dealing with unregistered vehicles not under cover (keeping a junkyard). Went though this a few years ago, someone ( probably new to the area) complained. Vehicles had been on the property for years. County sent a notice of the code ... "only two unregistered vehicles allowed on the property not being under cover.". County commissioner had come out to review the complaint, saw four vehicles on the property and reasoned their was a 'possible' violation. There was no way that they could have verified a violation from the public access. The county sent a notice of the code and 30 days to remedy the situation. It was a county wide crackdown, something to do with having a code related to junkyards. We had to provide photo evidence to the commissioner's office that the property wasn't in violation. And yes the property is posted.

As a side note, when my first wife divorced me, the sheriff delivered the summons at 10:00 pm, but only drove up to the trespassing sign on the driveway. I don't know if it was the sign or the LGD that was the deterrent. He did apologize for having to deliver the papers when I went out to see what was upsetting the dog.


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