I picked up a batch of 200 snares last year really reasonable but they all had 350 pound breakaway S hooks. In my experience even the 285 pound is a bit much for deer and cougar. In Idaho we are required to have either a BAD or a deer stop. Deer stops don’t help much on neck catches.

I’m not sure where a guy would use 350s instead of 285s. They’re too light to reliably hold wolves. Too heavy for deer and cougar, maybe if elk or bear were the only likely incidentals. Id still go with 285s.

So I’ve been replacing all the 350 pound BADs with 285s. I’d go a bit lighter if I could find some. Maybe 235-250 I think would be the sweet spot. In my experience deer can open a 285 but not always enough to release. Some do. Some don’t.

I was left with all these 350 pound breakaways and am loath to throw stuff away. I had a bunch of small L locks I don’t use. Mostly a cam lock or mini pro lock guy now. It dawned on me I could use these 350s with a small L lock on my 3/32 cable extensions as a drowning lock for raccoons and mink should the occasion arise. It’s small, shouldn’t interfere with things as an extension cable and ready for the odd drowner when needed. I won’t be using them for beaver.

I'd be very leaey of that. Repeated pumps bya coon, beaver or otter before they go down the site may cause the s hooks to open.

Hal had a great thread if I can dig it back up in the testing of BADs. He found that the single if the load changes to failure point of the BAD.

I’d be shocked if a coon could open a 350 pound breakaway. And like I said, I won’t be using them for beaver. In fact there are no beaver in the drainage where I trap raccoon. And I’ve never seen any sign of otter.

Raccoons can go through a plywood roof to get into a house ...

Hals thread:

http://sullivansline.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=8854

I’m certainly not trying to start an argument but after reading post after post for literally years about the need for welding J-hooks and S-hooks and nobody seems to consider the poundage and relationship of bads! Regardless of whether a trapper is using snares, CR’s, or footholds, terminal connections are used under the same or very similar conditions! If a Gd-Dnm coyote can't open a 285# bad, why in the world would a trapper be concerned about welded terminal connections???

Marty, I agree with your conclusion on the BAD poundage's 350# is a odd size BAD.

I have been using the 280# Sullivan BAD on my long coyote/bobcat snares. I have not lost any coyotes yet. They have worked Fairly well on mule deer sized or bigger animals.

I would like to test some lighter weight BAD's if I can find some made in the USA.!!!!

Coyote's Bobcat's and larger animals will investigate baited raccoon pocket sets? So I would build my anchoring system accordingly!! Nice to see you are preparing for trapping season.

Agree 100% I have caught some big coyote with 285 BBD's and they don't even start to open them up. Plus I don't weld any j- hooks or any of that. Never have had a problem. We have big coyote in this area.

If you read Hals thread, the devices are generally stronger than the rating depending on the test used.

Seldom,

I don’t weld my J hooks for coyotes. I weld them because I have wolves and cougar. I doubt if the average cougar could open my J hooks but I’m sure a wolf could as could a big cougar. And much of my line borders native ground. They don’t have much of a sense of humor about non natives trespassing to recover a wolf who opened up a J hook.

My original post was in regard to making use of the 350 pound BADs on my extension in the off chance I need to use them as a coon drowner. Instead of throwing them away. I would never use BADs with non drowning footholds.

Marty I have caught some incidental wolves trapping. The only way they would open up j hooks is by chewing on them which I haven't seen. After release I have checked everything over and the trap usually gets the brunt of the abuse. Usually coil springs and spring pins need to be replaced. I would think a cougar would test j hooks more but then again I have no experience with them.

I’ve had other guys tell me they caught wolves on unwelded J hooks and I have no doubt they’ll hold most wolves. I’ve also had a wolf trapper here show me J hooks that failed on wolves. Because of my proximity to native ground I’ll keep welding my hooks.

My wolf traps and some of my coyote traps (No BS K9 Extreme) will close on an elk or young beef hoof. If the trap is anchored solid they can pull out when they hit the end of the chain. Another reason I want my J hooks welded. I don’t want either running around with my trap for jewelry.

You guys have smaller wolves back there. I've known guys to catch wolves here with unwelded J hooks also. But I've also known multiple ones that have opened up and had the wolves leave wearing their trap. About fifteen years ago a guy I know caught one in a coyote trap he didnt have the J hooks welded on (he was also wolf trapping the same area with wolf traps all welded up, why he would think that his coyote traps wouldn't need it I don't know). I tracked that wolf for a few days with the trap on, then I tracked it the rest of the winter missing two toes.

Marty you are braver than me. I wouldn't trust them BADs. If the L-lock catches on the bend just right, it'll give considerable leverage and that can make it much easier for a coon to open it on a good lunge IMO. Doesn't matter to me what you choose to do. I think 90% of the time you'll be ok. But I thought I'd explain my thought process in it.

For a lighter breakaway you might check out Marty Senneker’s 265lb breakaway at his Canadian Coyote Company website