No Profanity *** No Flaming *** No Advertising *** No Anti Trappers ***NO POLITICS
No Non-Target Catches *** No Links to Anti-trapping Sites *** No Avoiding Profanity Filter
If you can not discuss this topic like civil adults, please do not reply. You can agree or disagree with the President without bashing him. Likewise, although I am NOT one to do so normally... if I see any of you.... republican, middle-of-the-line or democrat personally insulting each other, I WILL use that notify button. So act like adults and discuss this rationally, PLEASE.
Personally, I believe ending the war without reopening the straight would have catastrophic results. It's a terrible idea and I really hope that his adviser's convince him to do otherwise. What do you all think?
Quote
WASHINGTON—President Trump told aides he’s willing to end the U.S. military campaign against Iran even if the Strait of Hormuz remains largely closed, administration officials said, likely extending Tehran’s firm grip on the waterway and leaving a complex operation to reopen it for a later date.
In recent days, Trump and his aides assessed that a mission to pry open the chokepoint would push the conflict beyond his timeline of four to six weeks. He decided that the U.S. should achieve its main goals of hobbling Iran’s navy and its missile stocks and wind down current hostilities while pressuring Tehran diplomatically to resume the free flow of trade. If that fails, Washington would press allies in Europe and the Gulf to take the lead on reopening the strait, the officials said.
There are also military options the president could decide on, but they are not his immediate priority, they said.
Over the past month, Trump has expressed various opinions in public on how to handle the strait, part of a larger pattern of giving conflicting goals and objectives of the war overall. He has at times threatened to bomb civilian energy infrastructure if the waterway isn’t reopened by a certain date. On other occasions, he has played down the importance of the strait to the U.S. and said its closure is a problem for other nations to solve.
The longer the strait remains closed, the more it will roil the global economy and boost gas prices. Multiple countries, including U.S. allies, are reeling from the downturn in energy supply that once flowed freely through the chokepoint. Industries that rely on items such as fertilizer to grow food or helium to make computer chips are suffering from shortages.
Without a swift return to safe passages, Tehran will continue to threaten world trade until the U.S. and its partners either negotiate a deal or forcibly end the crisis, analysts say.
Suzanne Maloney, an Iran expert and vice president at the Brookings Institution in Washington, called ending military operations before the strait is open “unbelievably irresponsible.”
The U.S. and Israel started the war together and can’t walk away from the fallout, Maloney said. “Energy markets are inherently global, and there is no possibility of insulating the U.S. from the economic damage that is already occurring and will become exponentially worse if the closure of the strait continues.”
Trump’s desire to end the war quickly is at odds with other moves he is planning to make. This weekend, the USS Tripoli and the 31st Marine Expeditionary Unit entered the region. Trump has also ordered elements of the 82nd Airborne and is considering sending another 10,000 ground troops to the Middle East, The Wall Street Journal reported. Meanwhile, he has referred to the war as “an excursion” and “a lovely stay,” yet he is also weighing a complex and risky mission to seize the regime’s uranium, the Journal reported.
On Monday, White House press secretary Karoline Leavitt told reporters that the U.S. was “working towards” normal operations in the strait, but didn’t list it among the core military objectives of targeting Iran’s navy, missiles, defense industry and ability to make a nuclear weapon.
Secretary of State Marco Rubio, speaking Monday to Al Jazeera, said the current campaign to complete U.S. military objectives will be finished within weeks.
“Then we’ll be confronted with this issue of the Straits of Hormuz, and it will be up to Iran to decide,” said Rubio, who is also Trump’s national security adviser, “or a coalition of nations from around the world and the region, with the participation of the United States, we’ll make sure that it’s open, one way or the other.”
The Trump administration had planned for the possibility of Iran closing the strait after the first bombs dropped. But once Iran placed mines in the water and threatened to strike tankers, traffic slowed to a trickle.
Senior officials repeatedly waved the problem away as pressure mounted on Washington to handle the situation. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth on March 13 told reporters Iran’s actions were a sign of “sheer desperation” and was “something we’re dealing with, we have been dealing with it and don’t need to worry about it.”
To circumvent the problem, Trump increasingly called on shipping companies to take the risk of sailing through the waterway. When that didn’t work, he switched to issuing threats directly at Tehran. Trump last week interpreted Iran’s leadership allowing some ships through as a concession, kick-starting the latest round of diplomacy he hopes could end the war.
But after saying Monday on social media that Iran was now led by a “more reasonable” regime, he threatened to target the country’s electric plants and oil sites—including oil-export hub Kharg Island—“if the Hormuz Strait is not immediately ‘Open for Business.’”
“President Trump is going to move forward unabated, and he expects the Iranian regime to make a deal with the administration,” Leavitt told reporters.
Current and former officials say they believe the ability of Iran to control the passageway will be blunted as its military assets are diminished.
“Once you’ve once you’ve achieved those strategic objectives, it naturally follows,” said Rich Goldberg, a former Trump National Security Council official now at Foundation for Defense of Democracies, a Washington think tank. “That is when you would focus on the Strait of Hormuz, because you would have done so much damage to their external threat, and you would have reallocated your military resources to that mission.”
Despite his threats to reopen the waterway, Trump and his team say the strait matters far more to countries in Europe, the Middle East and Asia than to the U.S., insisting it is not vital to America’s energy needs. Top aides in Washington have spent weeks asking allies and partners to plan for negotiations or operations to ensure a fifth of the world’s oil and gas can travel through the strait.
Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent suggested Monday in a Fox News interview that the U.S. or a multinational group could escort tankers. His comments didn’t signal any urgency to reopen the strait immediately.
“The market is well-supplied, and we are seeing more and more ships go through on a daily basis as individual countries cut deals with the Iranian regime for the time being,” Bessent said. “But over time, the U.S. is going to retake control of the straits, and there will be freedom of navigation, whether it is through U.S. escorts or a multinational escort.”
This month, nearly 40 countries—including the United Kingdom, France and Canada—pledged “our readiness to contribute to appropriate efforts to ensure safe passage through the Strait.”
Around 20% of the world’s oil supply is transported through the strait, and in 2024, 84% of crude oil and 83% of liquid natural gas shipped through the strait was bound for Asian markets, according to the U.S. Energy Information Administration.
Iran’s grip on the strait led the benchmark price of U.S. oil to close Monday at over $100 a barrel for the first time since 2022, and some financial analysts project it could surge to $200 a barrel if the war causes sustained disruption. to the waterway.
" If that fails, Washington would press allies in Europe and the Gulf to take the lead on reopening the strait, the officials said."
This means Israel, nobody in Europe has the backbone or the desire to do anything more than talk, and Iran knows it.
"Despite his threats to reopen the waterway, Trump and his team say the strait matters far more to countries in Europe, the Middle East and Asia than to the U.S., insisting it is not vital to America’s energy needs. "
True as far as it goes. Except it causes our fuel prices to go through the roof. The Americas produce enough oil for themselves, but if there is a kink in the flow in the middle east our prices skyrocket. Because the oil companies can ship overseas and get higher rates, so they ae going to charge higher prices at home or load up and ship overseas.
The thing that irritates me is that the day there is any news of oil prices going up, prices at the pump go up. That gas didn't suddenly cost more to produce, it was produced months ago out of cheaper oil and in most cases already delivered before oil prices started to rise.
Well, Savell, would you prefer to see the strait left closed, than a full regime change?
… naw I was under the impression we took out nuclear capabilities last year and were washing our hands of it to focus on mass deportation
… straight wouldn’t even be closed if that’s what was done
Well, that is true, but here is where we are now. No point beating a dead horse about what could have or should have been done. What should be done NOW?
Gotta find a way, a better way, I'd better wait
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you
Personally, I would have no qualms about nuking them back into the stone age. My only concern with that would be that it may well usher in WWIII and you KNOW we'd get dragged into that one way or the other....
Gotta find a way, a better way, I'd better wait
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you
The goal is to force Europe and some Middle Eastern nations to become involved in the conflict and in protecting the strait. It appears to be working because 30 nations are talking about doing just that.
Personally, I would have no qualms about nuking them back into the stone age. My only concern with that would be that it may well usher in WWIII and you KNOW we'd get dragged into that one way or the other....
…. Not us … let isreal do it … our tax dollars already paid for it
… the entire Middle East is a pariah… let them fight their own wars
… all we need to do is get our refineries converted to light sweet crude
.. not sure why we haven’t done that already
… almost like we’ve intentionally been reliant on oil from the Middle East ?
I think Trump got suckered into this fiasco. Maybe he'll get lucky and things will work out for his handlers, but I would reluctantly bet against that.
I'm not sure what we are supposed to discuss but I guess we can either (a) agree or (b) disagree with what Trump is doing in Iran?
Am I reading the instructions right?
Discuss whatever you'd like to discuss about it. Just civilly.
Just saying no personal attacks on other members, or the President, as those are Paul's rules.
Oh boy. Let's see if I can do this. Please read my summary points in the most civil tone.
I give all respect and thanks to the brave men and women serving in the Middle East.
This is however a foreign war (or whatever it is being called today) that was unnecessary. We have been hearing for decades that Iran is on the verge of having a nuclear weapon. Never happened. We were told that the Iranian nuclear program was "obliterated" last summer. Either that was not true or we had no reason for this "excursion." Whatever Iran did in the 1980s (which oddly is included in the justification) was over forty years ago--not a reason to attack Iran now. Yeah, it sponsors terrorism against Israel but the Saudis attacked us on 9/11 and I guess they are now our pals--not mine, but anyway.
We were promised no more foreign wars and have not heard a consistent reason for entering this one. I will not get into the congressional issues.
We are spending money we do not have. We are $39 Trillion in debt. We added another $3 Trillion over the last year.
We are wrecking our economy and it's going to get worse. Our economy should be booming.
The Democrats are going to crush the Republicans (or whatever they are now) in the mid-terms.
Most importantly, we are risking the lives of our servicemen and women unnecessarily.
And, now we are stuck. No exit plan.
And for what? A distraction from (rhymes with Lepstein) and because of governments in the Middle East who could not give a flip about the US--only using us.
I hope I complied with the rules of discussion. I tried really hard.
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591486 03/30/2609:58 PM03/30/2609:58 PM
Ending the war with Iran blocking commerce in the Strait of Hormuz is a huge global economic problem. And leaving all the enriched uranium available to the islamists to make dirty bombs with (even if their to make nuclear weapons has been terminated) is another huge problem.
I just hope those problems can be solved without us being pulled into a protracted war with a lot our boys being killed. Scary times for sure.
Each day is a gift. LIVE IT with gratitude.
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591491 03/30/2610:04 PM03/30/2610:04 PM
Spjones … I didn’t say it was anything new … just said they doubled down and the people didn’t rise up take out the regime
…. At this point we’re just spending tax dollars to make more Muslim refugees and terrorists … it’s like we’re in an abusive relationship trying really hard to justify it lol
Insert profound nonsense here
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591497 03/30/2610:09 PM03/30/2610:09 PM
Discuss whatever you'd like to discuss about it. Just civilly.
Just saying no personal attacks on other members, or the President, as those are Paul's rules.
Oh boy. Let's see if I can do this. Please read my summary points in the most civil tone.
I give all respect and thanks to the brave men and women serving in the Middle East.
This is however a foreign war (or whatever it is being called today) that was unnecessary. We have been hearing for decades that Iran is on the verge of having a nuclear weapon. Never happened. We were told that the Iranian nuclear program was "obliterated" last summer. Either that was not true or we had no reason for this "excursion." Whatever Iran did in the 1980s (which oddly is included in the justification) was over forty years ago--not a reason to attack Iran now. Yeah, it sponsors terrorism against Israel but the Saudis attacked us on 9/11 and I guess they are now our pals--not mine, but anyway.
We were promised no more foreign wars and have not heard a consistent reason for entering this one. I will not get into the congressional issues.
We are spending money we do not have. We are $39 Trillion in debt. We added another $3 Trillion over the last year.
We are wrecking our economy and it's going to get worse. Our economy should be booming.
The Democrats are going to crush the Republicans (or whatever they are now) in the mid-terms.
Most importantly, we are risking the lives of our servicemen and women unnecessarily.
And, now we are stuck. No exit plan.
And for what? A distraction from (rhymes with Lepstein) and because of governments in the Middle East who could not give a flip about the US--only using us.
I hope I complied with the rules of discussion. I tried really hard.
Ok, but like Savell, your post focuses on what you think should have been done. The truth is, that ship, or missile or whatever, lol, has sailed.
We are where we are at now. I'm more curious to know what people think should be done from this point forward.
Gotta find a way, a better way, I'd better wait
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: AntiGov]
#8591499 03/30/2610:12 PM03/30/2610:12 PM
The only thing posted about so far I believe 100% is we are not getting the whole story.
Distraction from Epstein? Sure enough possible. Stockpiles of enriched uranium? Maybe. Insurance shenanigans? Could be. Propping up the petro dollar? Likely some truth at least to that one. Maybe some truth in all of it.
One thing I'm sure of. Trump says a lot of stuff he never means. Just says it to throw people off. Could have said that to give the muzzies hope that he is losing conviction. Get them to step up missile launches etc. Expose more targets. (A complete guess on my part. I dont have a crystal ball either.)
Quote
willing to end the U.S. military campaign against Iran even if the Strait of Hormuz remains largely closed, administration officials said,
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Distance of the northern border of UAE from sea to sea is about half that of the Panama canal. Not a short term solution but would relinquish the hold over the Straight by Iran in the long run.
It's not an easy task for our country. It's not our interests only. Believe what you want, it's a personal choice, based on what you have read/heard/or been told to believe. I find it kind of strange, that the insurance companies are all based in the UK. If that's true, then the whole world has a problem. The UK is almost a Muslim country anymore. Plus the fact that the insurance companies are saying the Strait of Hormuz is loaded with mines! Here's a question, why is Iran allowing 8-30 ships through the Strait of Hormuz if it's blocked by mines? There's more going on than anyone here knows about. Why is Spain not allowing the USA of air traffic over their territory? Why are the European Pac not backing our country's plans?
You have to decide, weather you want a constant threat to our and our allies countries to continue, or not!
I see little possibility for the Iranian people to rise up and take control of the government from the regime when they have no weapons. I see no hope of the regime giving in to negotiations. They are jihadists. I don't foresee an easy exit for President Trump from this war.
I see little possibility for the Iranian people to rise up and take control of the government from the regime when they have no weapons. I see no hope of the regime giving in to negotiations. They are jihadists. I don't foresee an easy exit for President Trump from this war.
… I think it’s real easy to… decouple from isreal and muslim oil nations… convert our refineries to process the light sweet crude we export…. Deport anyone that puts the Middle East over the US and the third world types … end all welfare and foreign aide…..live happily ever after
Joined: Dec 2006 Coldspring Texas Spjones … I didn’t say it was anything new … just said they doubled down and the people didn’t rise up take out the regime
…. At this point we’re just spending tax dollars to make more Muslim refugees and terrorists … it’s like we’re in an abusive relationship trying to hard to justify it lol
I see little possibility for the Iranian people to rise up and take control of the government from the regime when they have no weapons. I see no hope of the regime giving in to negotiations. They are jihadists. I don't foresee an easy exit for President Trump from this war.
Just wonder why so many are over looking the fact that the population of Iran are unarmed! Why do you think so many want to unarm the most powerful country in the world?
Maybe Savell will chime in.......Its always been said the US enough oil capabilities to sustain us for the next 100 years. Are we not able to because of refiners? The US IS NOT GOING AWAY FROM OIL. PERIOD! The solar believers can get over it, ain't happening! I would think we have control of the out come of venezuela's oil now. Maybe control out come of Iranian oil? We have alaskan oil. Gulf of America oil. Need the Keystone XL pipeline built?? What gives?
------------------------------------- Paying Top Dollar for Alien Parts.
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591533 03/30/2610:59 PM03/30/2610:59 PM
I see little possibility for the Iranian people to rise up and take control of the government from the regime when they have no weapons. I see no hope of the regime giving in to negotiations. They are jihadists. I don't foresee an easy exit for President Trump from this war.
… I think it’s real easy to… decouple from isreal and muslim oil nations… convert our refineries to process the light sweet crude we export…. Deport anyone that puts the Middle East over the US and the third world types … end all welfare and foreign aide…..live happily ever after
… if anyone threatens us … take them out
… we’ve been used for entirely too long
First, we are the freest country in the world! Since 1776 other countries have been attacking us. Think about who has attacked us. Many that attacked us, are now our Allies. Except just one major country , Iran. As far as communist countries, they are intelligent enough not to mess with us. But they're working on a plan, and using other countries to weaken us. Where do you think I ran got their uranium ? Only certain people will remember. Russia has been an Allie of Iran as has China . Now you decide what we should do?
It's not an easy task for our country. It's not our interests only. Believe what you want, it's a personal choice, based on what you have read/heard/or been told to believe. I find it kind of strange, that the insurance companies are all based in the UK. If that's true, then the whole world has a problem. The UK is almost a Muslim country anymore. Plus the fact that the insurance companies are saying the Strait of Hormuz is loaded with mines! Here's a question, why is Iran allowing 8-30 ships through the Strait of Hormuz if it's blocked by mines? There's more going on than anyone here knows about. Why is Spain not allowing the USA of air traffic over their territory? Why are the European Pac not backing our country's plans?
You have to decide, weather you want a constant threat to our and our allies countries to continue, or not!
Don't use rational thinking ......lol
The Vink for chief moderator....night shift ...11pm- 5am best coast time zone.....Free Marty
I do not know what the best plan moving forward is. I guess it’s stockpile fuel personally.
I also know that the tanker insurance isn’t all based out of the UK, but that doesn’t get us much of anywhere other than having the odd bit of misinformation cleared up.
Last edited by rvsask; 03/30/2611:02 PM.
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591537 03/30/2611:02 PM03/30/2611:02 PM
a significant portion of all conflict in the middle east for the last 25 years is a proxy war with Iran , where Iranian arms , ordinance , propaganda and funding fueled those conflicts.
extreme Islam is a tool to wear down and destabilize the region and constantly eat at the resources and resolve of the nations trying to stabilize the region and the beauty of it is that it takes so little funding on Iran's part.
America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
… heck it might be the shias… there’s a Muslim minority around there that gets stirred up easily and will fight
.. not sure what the middle easterners all have going on …. Just know we’ve got problems of our own to fix
On that note, yes we sure do. It's just world problems are here also. It isn't going to be done over night, there's conflict within our powers to be that needs straightened out . Long before other problems can be solved !
We have met the enemy and the enemy is us!
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: charles]
#8591550 03/30/2611:56 PM03/30/2611:56 PM
… heck it might be the shias… there’s a Muslim minority around there that gets stirred up easily and will fight
.. not sure what the middle easterners all have going on …. Just know we’ve got problems of our own to fix
On that note, yes we sure do. It's just world problems are here also. It isn't going to be done over night, there's conflict within our powers to be that needs straightened out . Long before other problems can be solved !
…. Yeah ok … problems other people got us into
… keep your blinders on and don’t forget to dvr the mark levin show lol
Most Iranians are barely religious. The controlling Islamists in Iran are Shiites. The Shia/Sunni split happened back in 632 when Mohammad died. They have had trouble between the two sects, most of the time, ever since.
…. Bottom line is the strait is closed and energy prices are up because Trump took the adleson and aipac money this go round and the plan failed when iran doubled down
… so here we are again… and aside from nukes or boots on the ground there’s little other option
… heck it might be the shias… there’s a Muslim minority around there that gets stirred up easily and will fight
.. not sure what the middle easterners all have going on …. Just know we’ve got problems of our own to fix
On that note, yes we sure do. It's just world problems are here also. It isn't going to be done over night, there's conflict within our powers to be that needs straightened out . Long before other problems can be solved !
…. Yeah ok … problems other people got us into
… keep your blinders and don’t forget to dvr the mark levin show lol
If you think our own people didn't help other countries to cause our problems, you don't understand greed! There's people like Soros and, I'll stop there, or this would be political. That influence our country's problems! Then , I can't help you understand!
…. Bottom line is the strait is closed and energy prices are up because Trump took the adleson and aipac money this go round and the plan failed when iran doubled down
… so here we are again… and aside from nukes or boots on the ground there’s little other option
Not really, there's plenty of options. I think with help from the other countries involved in the Straight , and the NATO countries ( all sissies) got involved the problem would be solved. No boots on the ground. Just wait and see I could be wrong, as there will be a clean up, and there will be a need for aid for the civilians .
Last edited by Ohio Wolverine; Yesterday at12:34 AM.
Let the Zionist handle it on THEIR dollar ,wash hands and leave FOREVER .
This Islamo-nazi regime has been in power for 47 years. They have been at war with us and Israel since. They continually chant death to America (the big satan) and Israel (the little satan) at government functions. They and their terrorist proxi's have killed thousands of our military throughout that time and are continually attacking Isreali citizens. They were getting close in their development of nuclear weapons and would use them against us.
I wish we could have walked away and not have to worry about them ever again. But I think that is terribly naive.
Each day is a gift. LIVE IT with gratitude.
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: AntiGov]
#8591569 Yesterday at12:44 AMYesterday at12:44 AM
… so yeah Arabs bad Jews good … fight their wars at the expense of brave men … pay your taxes and high gas prices and vote for whoever mark levin tells you to
… carry on
Insert profound nonsense here
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591576 Yesterday at12:55 AMYesterday at12:55 AM
Same way Muslims have gotten a foothold here! Whole families lived in the same house , until each could get their own place. As much as 3-4 families in the same house.
Many Afghani, Pakistani and Burmese owned gas stations launder money from illegal opium sales. Pakistan has been filling the hole in the opium market left by the destruction of many opium fields in Afghanistan. They report fake high profits, pay taxes on them and send the money back to their home countries.
[quote=KeithC]Many Afghani, Pakistani and Burmese owned gas stations launder money from illegal opium sales. Pakistan has been filling the hole in the opium market left by the destruction of many opium fields in Afghanistan. They report fake high profits, pay taxes on them and send the money back to their home countries.
Keith[/quote
Please explain how they can do that. Not doubting you, but I have questions, as a neighbor from China had a business , that was doing well, then had to stay in business after it was a losing project. And still had more money than the neighbors around them? Moved to a higher rent area, and had no problems moving?
Lots of small and some pretty big businesses are set up to launder money. Businesses that take in large amounts of cash are especially useful for money launderers. Did you ever watch Breaking Bad, Weeds or Ozark?
Most illegal drugs are bought with cash. The government gets suspicious when large amounts of money are just stuck into a bank account, or transferred overseas, when there is no apparent legal source. Shipping large amounts of cash is risky because it can be found and confiscated or even stolen..
Drug dealers invest in businesses that take in lots of cash like gas stations, convenience stores, tobacco shops, barber shops and restaurants. They just add the illegal cash drug revenue to any legitimate sales from the business. Once the taxes are paid on that money, by the business, it can be transferred and used for legitimate purposes.
It sounds like your Chinese neighbor was likely laundering money.
Keith
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: KeithC]
#8591590 Yesterday at02:25 AMYesterday at02:25 AM
Lots of small and some pretty big businesses are set up to launder money. Businesses that take in large amounts of cash are especially useful for money launderers. Did you ever watch Breaking Bad, Weeds or Ozark?
Most illegal drugs are bought with cash. The government gets suspicious when large amounts of money are just stuck into a bank account, or transferred overseas, when there is no apparent legal source. Shipping large amounts of cash is risky because it can be found and confiscated or even stolen..
Drug dealers invest in businesses that take in lots of cash like gas stations, convenience stores, tobacco shops, barber shops and restaurants. They just add the illegal cash drug revenue to any legitimate sales from the business. Once the taxes are paid on that money, by the business, it can be transferred and used for legitimate purposes.
It sounds like your Chinese neighbor was likely laundering money.
Keith
Quite possible ! I know they used illegals ( suspected anyway ) to run the store for a few years. Housed them even after the business couldn't keep them working.
It takes awhile for a single ship to traverse the panama canal. It exists because the only other option is a trip around the horn. Straight of Hormuz is big. Wide enough for a lot of traffic. A canal is a bad idea. Probably more ships going through the strait right now than there would be through a canal.
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Boy, there’s some global “experts” posting, and a lot of regular people just stating their opinions. The experts don’t know the difference between the UN & NATO, fail to see the communist threat, mixing up religions and countries……. Entertaining thread for sure. Eventually the middle east will be turned to glass, and will drag everyone down with it, but I just hope the gas prices drop by summertime…… Open the straight!!!…….lol
Actually, Spjones is onto something with the insurance companies bit. It’s amazing how our forestry budget exponentially increases for ROW clearing when people can’t insure their $10M cottages due to fire threat near unmaintained ROWs.
Boy, there’s some global “experts” posting, and a lot of regular people just stating their opinions. The experts don’t know the difference between the UN & NATO, fail to see the communist threat, mixing up religions and countries……. Entertaining thread for sure. Eventually the middle east will be turned to glass, and will drag everyone down with it, but I just hope the gas prices drop by summertime…… Open the straight!!!…….lol
Problem with it turning to glass is like California falling into the ocean. To many of the residents have moved and started spreading the virus enough it cant be contained at this point.
Can someone explain to me why the US doesn't kill the people who are keeping this shipping channel closed? Seems like a simple fix to me
Seems to be in the works. Its hard ro get all the stuff that can sink ships that spread out and hidden. Also hard to kill off all the die hards thinking they are doing their gods work fighting the great evil from the west. Get great rewards for dieing doing it. It only takes a hand full with axcess to weapons. Drones that fly or run under water rockets missiles mines or crewed boats full of explosives.
Just the threat has had insurance carriers say they won't insure and ships going through the strait. I believe the insurance in shipping is bases in the UK and was one of their powerful levers they had left. I read Trump singed something saying the US would back the insurance on ships effectively removing the UK relivence on insuring ships they have held for centuries.
Insurance is important not just for the cargo and ship but ships won't be allowed in ports if not insured.
At least this is my take away from a little reading last week. May not be 100% correct its didn't do a deep dive and make sure the article oe my interpretation of it 0was 100% accurate.
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Bigmeat]
#8591677 Yesterday at09:41 AMYesterday at09:41 AM
mission creep noun (politics, military, idiomatic) Gradual expansion of the objectives, scope, and/or cost of a military mission without careful planning.
The strait of Hormuz is deemed a transit passageway, open to all and passage shall not be impeded nor suspended by anyone according to UNCLOS. ( United Nations edict/law) Accordingly, the United Nations should be protecting passage for shipping, and it should be moving as usual.
If the US were in a war with Hawaii, example being an ocean involved, neither side has the right to attack other nations shipping/passage which is not involved, nor bears reinforcement to either side.
Once again NATO proves itself pretty much useless at the people’s expense.
Osky
www.SureDockusa.com “ I said I don’t have much use for traps these days, never said I didn’t know how to use them.”
We won't open the Strait of Hormuz because we can't. We can get out of the Gulf, close all our bases and let the Gulf States pay a transit fee to Iran for every ship. In that way it gets reopened but not this year probably. Every other scenario keeps it closed longer. After the midterms Trump gets impeached and this time convicted and maybe that lowers the tension a little. Ultimately this is what happens whether we like it or not.
We won't open the Strait of Hormuz because we can't. We can get out of the Gulf, close all our bases and let the Gulf States pay a transit fee to Iran for every ship. In that way it gets reopened but not this year probably. Every other scenario keeps it closed longer. After the midterms Trump gets impeached and this time convicted and maybe that lowers the tension a little. Ultimately this is what happens whether we like it or not.
I do not believe the US has closed the strait, please source that info. Tankers or any other ships can go thru right now if they want, it’s reported some have. Iran is threatening shipping and commercial transit, charging illegal tolls which doesn’t mean your clearance free to go thru shipping is afraid of Iranian attacks. The US is not attacking shipping.
Osky
www.SureDockusa.com “ I said I don’t have much use for traps these days, never said I didn’t know how to use them.”
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591696 Yesterday at10:16 AMYesterday at10:16 AM
A few more days for Iran to decide .........death or open the straight
Probably both
…. How many times has that deadline been moved already ?
Number of times. An end is wanted, the other side says “no mas” we wanna talk, you stop and talk. They start up again you respond. Never been in a bar fight where enough is enough but the other side just won’t stay down? I have it’s ridiculous but is what it is.
Osky
www.SureDockusa.com “ I said I don’t have much use for traps these days, never said I didn’t know how to use them.”
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591700 Yesterday at10:23 AMYesterday at10:23 AM
We already did what we wanted to accomplish, allow the straight to be closed is Iran’s given win, the off ramp where they save face. Means very little to us. The opposition has taken the bait and will talk about it nonstop until the Trump card is played right before the midterms.
As for our soldiers, they’ve been training for this since they volunteered and sitting on the bench. Anybody who thinks they don’t want to be on the field in the game is past the age to have an opinion about it.
-Goofy
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591718 Yesterday at11:01 AMYesterday at11:01 AM
What I'm confused about is countries like the Saudis, Kuwait, United Emirate, etc. consider Iran a grave danger to the rest of the region. They want the US to destroy that threat. So, why don't we get them to start funding the war if that's what they want? With all their money it should be a done deal.
Every time I laugh, cough, or sneeze, my radiator leaks or my exhaust backfires.
Re: Strait of Hormuz
[Re: Savell]
#8591728 Yesterday at11:27 AMYesterday at11:27 AM
I will declare from the outset that I am not an expert and am, honestly, not spending a lot of my time watching the news or pondering these events at all. Nevertheless, here are some things I'm considering in this arena:
The US has been the global superpower since WWII-ish. In large part, this was because of our wealth and industrial capacity, which allowed us to build and maintain a large military, backed by big, expensive, high-powered, equipment/assets - jets, missiles, carriers, etc. However, technology is rapidly advancing, and now very high-tech, AI-powered, low-cost, and unmanned equipment are available everywhere, and that cheap high-tech equipment can still do a lot of damage to our expensive high-powered military. Thus, the US's advantage in the military arena has been lessened. It's a David-and-Goliath situation, and we're not David. Nations like China are beginning to look like they could become actual rivals to US global dominance rather than minor competitors or upstarts (there are of course other reasons for this, but we can stick to military might for now). This means that we are in a tech/AI race similar to the space race. In order to maintain our superpower status we must stay ahead on AI and other technology.
However, as cheap and available as all this new tech is, it still requires raw materials and fossil fuels to manufacture and operate. By controlling the supply of materials, the US can perhaps keep the upper hand. Hence, the US interest in Greenland, which can supply rare earth metals in addition to other strategic benefits, and Canada. An oil-rich location would make an excellent 51st state. Supposedly there were some gov't reps talking to Alberta separatists hoping to cut a deal. The US also recently...made changes...in its relationship to Venezuela, another oil-rich nation relatively close to home.
50% of China's oil comes through the Strait of Hormuz, and now it's closed. As much as that may hurt the US by raising gas prices, it'll hurt China a lot more. We'll see high prices in the US, but eastern countries will likely see shortages and rationing (some beginning already).
Like I said, I know almost nothing. Just trying to put more puzzle pieces together wondering if there is a larger strategy behind it all. The rhetoric and talking points on the news is where the at-home politics game is played, keeping the base happy or at least committed, blaming the right bad guys, offering the right amount of optimism and justifications and distractions, etc. I suspect the real game is likely happening at the global scale and is less likely to be discussed openly by any officials.
All you other experts can now feel free to rebuke or correct me as needed.
I will declare from the outset that I am not an expert and am, honestly, not spending a lot of my time watching the news or pondering these events at all. Nevertheless, here are some things I'm considering in this arena:
The US has been the global superpower since WWII-ish. In large part, this was because of our wealth and industrial capacity, which allowed us to build and maintain a large military, backed by big, expensive, high-powered, equipment/assets - jets, missiles, carriers, etc. However, technology is rapidly advancing, and now very high-tech, AI-powered, low-cost, and unmanned equipment are available everywhere, and that cheap high-tech equipment can still do a lot of damage to our expensive high-powered military. Thus, the US's advantage in the military arena has been lessened. It's a David-and-Goliath situation, and we're not David. Nations like China are beginning to look like they could become actual rivals to US global dominance rather than minor competitors or upstarts (there are of course other reasons for this, but we can stick to military might for now). This means that we are in a tech/AI race similar to the space race. In order to maintain our superpower status we must stay ahead on AI and other technology.
However, as cheap and available as all this new tech is, it still requires raw materials and fossil fuels to manufacture and operate. By controlling the supply of materials, the US can perhaps keep the upper hand. Hence, the US interest in Greenland, which can supply rare earth metals in addition to other strategic benefits, and Canada. An oil-rich location would make an excellent 51st state. Supposedly there were some gov't reps talking to Alberta separatists hoping to cut a deal. The US also recently...made changes...in its relationship to Venezuela, another oil-rich nation relatively close to home.
50% of China's oil comes through the Strait of Hormuz, and now it's closed. As much as that may hurt the US by raising gas prices, it'll hurt China a lot more. We'll see high prices in the US, but eastern countries will likely see shortages and rationing (some beginning already).
Like I said, I know almost nothing. Just trying to put more puzzle pieces together wondering if there is a larger strategy behind it all. The rhetoric and talking points on the news is where the at-home politics game is played, keeping the base happy or at least committed, blaming the right bad guys, offering the right amount of optimism and justifications and distractions, etc. I suspect the real game is likely happening at the global scale and is less likely to be discussed openly by any officials.
All you other experts can now feel free to rebuke or correct me as needed.
Interesting post. Thanks.
Gotta find a way, a better way, I'd better wait
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you
You're likely not wrong on the China angle. But,......confirmed yesterday, 3 Chinese ships exited the strait.
Also, you're incorrect on the 50% of Chinese oil. Stating 40-50 % of imported oil would be more accurate. In terms of total energy consumption out of China, the % is far lower than that. China has maybe been preparing for this day, far more than the rest of us.
Also, any hiccup in the energy costs out of China will surely be passed to all of us, unless we are to avoid anything out of China moving forward.
Ukraine has increased their drone production from 2000 annually to 4 million
Pretty scary stuff when multiple drones can work a target in unison, like a swarm of bees
The drones are being made in Ukraine, but most of the engineering behind them is ours. That's why Russia is struggling trying to ramp up to less than 1/10th that number.
if its our enginering why do ours cost somuchmore?
Because we hold it to lower tolerances. We allow less failures. We could build cheaper, but we have rules preventing it. Ukraine is building just good enough.
That strait is only 40km or miles across. I ain't no navy guy, but there's no way Iran could close it with the amount of US firepower in the region. Some are crying for help from NATO? Cmon man, you think a few countries helping out would get the ships rolling? Looks like another little skirmish that only had week one planned out. Time to put the big boy pants on and get it done, finish what you started......lol
We won't open the Strait of Hormuz because we can't. We can get out of the Gulf, close all our bases and let the Gulf States pay a transit fee to Iran for every ship. In that way it gets reopened but not this year probably. Every other scenario keeps it closed longer. After the midterms Trump gets impeached and this time convicted and maybe that lowers the tension a little. Ultimately this is what happens whether we like it or not.
I do not believe the US has closed the strait, please source that info. Tankers or any other ships can go thru right now if they want, it’s reported some have. Iran is threatening shipping and commercial transit, charging illegal tolls which doesn’t mean your clearance free to go thru shipping is afraid of Iranian attacks. The US is not attacking shipping.
Osky
Misunderstanding. The Straits are closed because of the war and lack of insurance. Sure anybody can take a chance on going through but they risk their ship and cargo except Chinese tankers. Iran is letting them pass. The US cannot change that. If we leave that may ease up over time. No where did I say the US is attacking shipping.
That strait is only 40km or miles across. I ain't no navy guy, but there's no way Iran could close it with the amount of US firepower in the region. Some are crying for help from NATO? Cmon man, you think a few countries helping out would get the ships rolling? Looks like another little skirmish that only had week one planned out. Time to put the big boy pants on and get it done, finish what you started......lol
The narrowness is why it is so easy for Iran to close it with mines and missiles.
I dont think I would want another state that votes blue, is accepting of the restrictions as they are.
Perfect......we don't want to have to put a name tag and licence number on our traps, follow a 24 hr check requirement, get permits to trap public land, submerge big conibears etc..We like to be able to trap fisher for 4 months, not 3 weeks, pack around shotguns with barrels less than 18", ride atvs on public lands and forests that are managed for hunting, not having to report harvested deer etc Those dang restrictions. lol
if its our enginering why do ours cost somuchmore?
Because we hold it to lower tolerances. We allow less failures. We could build cheaper, but we have rules preventing it. Ukraine is building just good enough.
Keith
I figured it was all the kick backs and money laundering bringing the price up.
The narrowness is why it is so easy for Iran to close it with mines and missiles.
Copy that, makes sense. Drones and I believe the mines are dormant and can be activated……electronically I guess.
Originally Posted by rvsask
[quote=Providence Farm] Iran should hire Canada.
I dont think I would want another state that votes blue, is accepting of the restrictions as they are.
Perfect......we don't want to have to put a name tag and licence number on our traps, follow a 24 hr check requirement, get permits to trap public land, submerge big conibears etc..We like to be able to trap fisher for 4 months, not 3 weeks, pack around shotguns with barrels less than 18", ride atvs on public lands and forests that are managed for hunting, not having to report harvested deer etc Those dang restrictions. lol
lol…..you saw the irony in that statement. We’ve got a lot of restrictions, but when it comes to trapping……some of the regs down there are completely ridiculous. I get the odd job offer in the US and the wage is quite lucrative, but then I think, “what about my trapping?” In the end, the moneys not worth giving up what I got here. I don’t mind coming down to blow some cash though!……lol
U.A.E. Wants to Force Hormuz Open and Is Willing to Join the Fight
The United Arab Emirates is preparing to help the U.S. and other allies open the Strait of Hormuz by force, Arab officials said, a move that would make it the first Persian Gulf country to become a combatant, after being hit by Iranian attacks.
The U.A.E. is lobbying for a United Nations Security Council resolution that would authorize such action, the officials said. Emirati diplomats have urged the U.S. and military powers in Europe and Asia to form a coalition to open the strait by force, a U.A.E official said, adding that the Iranian regime thinks it is fighting for its existence and is willing to bring the global economy down with it in a chokehold on the strait.
The U.A.E. official said the country was actively reviewing how it could play a military role in securing the strait, including efforts to help clear it of mines and other support services.
The Gulf state has also said the U.S. should occupy islands in the strategic waterway including Abu Musa, which has been held by Iran for a half-century and is claimed by the U.A.E., some of the Arab officials said.
In a statement, the U.A.E. Foreign Ministry pointed to a separate resolution passed by the U.N. condemning Iran’s attacks on its cities and to one made by another U.N. body, the International Maritime Organization, condemning the closure of the Strait of Hormuz.
The Emirati Foreign Ministry said there is “broad global consensus that freedom of navigation in the Strait of Hormuz must be preserved.”
Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states are now turning against Iran’s regime and want the war to continue until it is disabled or toppled, Arab officials said, though they have stopped short of committing their military. Bahrain, a close U.S. ally that hosts the Navy’s Fifth Fleet, is sponsoring the U.N. resolution, with a vote expected Thursday.
The U.A.E.’s newly assertive approach is a fundamental shift in its strategic outlook, said officials from a Persian Gulf state. The U.A.E.’s commercial center, Dubai, has long financed the Iranian regime. Emirati diplomats were racing to mediate between the U.S. and Iran before the war, an effort that included a visit to Abu Dhabi by Ali Larijani, an Iranian national-security official who later died in an airstrike.
Now, the Gulf state is falling into line with President Trump’s push for allies to carry more of the burden in the war, particularly to help open the Strait of Hormuz. The Wall Street Journal has reported that Trump has told aides that he is willing to end the war without reopening the strait, leaving the matter to other countries.
U.A.E. participation in freeing the strait carries risks. Positioning itself as a belligerent against Iran could set the stage for tension that outlasts the end of the war.
Iran has reacted by stepping up its bombardments of the U.A.E. After proceeding at a low level for weeks, Iran’s missile and drone attacks on the Emirates have risen sharply in recent days, including nearly 50 ballistic missiles, cruise missiles and drones on Tuesday. Tehran warned it would destroy the vital civilian infrastructure of any Gulf state that supported any operation to seize its territory and specifically pointed to the U.A.E.
“They could step into this war only to face a more aggressive Iran, continue to absorb hits to critical infrastructure and potentially investor confidence, and then struggle to rebuild ties with their neighbor, particularly if Trump elects to declare victory before reopening the strait or crippling Iran’s missile and drone capabilities,” Elizabeth Dent, a fellow at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy and a former official who focused on the Gulf at the Pentagon, said of the dilemma faced by countries in the region.
Iran has rained down more missiles and drones on the U.A.E.—almost 2,500 thus far—than it has aimed at any other country including Israel. Nonetheless, the U.A.E., like the rest of the Gulf region, had long tried to avoid defining itself as a combatant.
The Gulf officials said the country’s position has now changed. Before the war began Feb. 28, the U.A.E. saw Iran as a difficult neighbor with a logic to its political positions, one of the officials said. But the outbreak of the war revealed a very different regime that was trying to sow panic with strikes on hotels and airports in Dubai, the official said.
The Iranian strikes have reduced the U.A.E.’s air traffic and tourism, hurt its property market and led to a wave of furloughs and layoffs. They have also challenged the country’s fundamental selling point—that it is an oasis of peace in a rough neighborhood.
The U.A.E. has countered in part with tough financial measures. A notice on Dubai’s Emirates airline said Iranian nationals aren’t allowed to enter or transit the country, a step that followed government moves to close the Iranian Hospital and Iranian Club Dubai.
The Emirates’ new posture is most evident in efforts to reopen the Strait of Hormuz—a lifeline for its energy exports, shipping business and food. Gulf officials said the U.A.E. believes countries in Asia and Europe that are reluctant now would help clear the strait with the blessing of the U.N. Security Council.
Russia and China could veto the resolution, and France is proposing a different version. Even if the resolution fails, the U.A.E. would still be prepared to join the war effort, the Gulf officials said.
Iran is insisting on permanent oversight including a system of tolls. The Gulf states fear any diplomatic resolution would implicitly give Iran a formal say over the administration of the waterway and want it dislodged by military action first, the Arab officials said.
It isn’t clear that military action could open the strait. Any operation would require controlling not just the waterway but also the territory along its 100-mile length, potentially with ground troops, military analysts said.
“I don’t think we can do it,” said Rep. Adam Smith (D., Wash.), the ranking member of the House Armed Services Committee. “All Iran has to do is be able to keep the strait under threat, which means they need one drone, they need one mine, they need one small suicide boat.”
Gulf states that support military action feel that the consequences of having a hostile neighbor controlling such a vital conduit make it worth the risk, the Arab officials said.
A decision to join the military campaign would send a public signal of Arab support for the war, said Bilal Saab, a fellow at Chatham House and a former Pentagon adviser on the Middle East. It would also open up additional options for operations against Iran and for attempting to reopen the Strait of Hormuz.
The U.A.E. has bases, a deep-water port at Jebel Ali and a location near the entrance to the Strait of Hormuz that could be useful staging grounds for a U.S.-led operation to seize islands or to escort commercial tankers through the waterway.
It also has a small but capable air force with U.S.-supplied F-16 jet fighters that conducted airstrikes in Iraq alongside the U.S. in the fight against Islamic State.
The Emirates also has surveillance drones and a stockpile of U.S.-supplied bombs and short-range missiles that could help ease U.S. and Israeli shortages.
“The proximity along the strait means that you can team up and place different platforms there to protect shipping and go after Iranian targets on the other side of the Gulf,” said Grant Rumley, a senior fellow at the Washington Institute, a think tank.
The biggest reason the strait is so vital is because of one the type of oil being sold there is a way different grade than other areas of the world, its much more vital to those people there to have, which surprise's me they don't jump to help protect it more than they are,
The other is that other countries buy a lot of this oil and move it other countries like us to help our quality of oil to move ,
It only takes a second to sound the bell of oil being threatened thru the strait and it will jump like crazy !!
Any one watching oil on the stock charts can see this,, So every time Trump say's another five or ten days , just makes it that much longer it will stay higher !!
Sorry if my opinions or replies offend you, they are not meant to !
…I believe none of the bacon adverse people in the Middle East should have nukes as they’re religious zealots that believe in the Old Testament… the Quran and the Talmud … and none of those speak of us sorry gentiles in a positive way
…I believe none of the bacon adverse people in the Middle East should have nukes as they’re religious zealots that believe in the Old Testament… the Quran and the Talmud … and none of those speak of us sorry gentiles in a positive way
… JFK thought so too
… and that didn’t end well at all
Are you insinuating that Iseral had JFK killed? And why cut off the rest of the article, like CNN will only post the parts they like?
Last edited by Ohio Wolverine; Yesterday at11:06 PM.
Saw today that it was $3.65 a gallon . Alot of things going on right now over in the Strait , and even here with the pipeline from Canada , our 51st state.
![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2026/03/full-2100-289737-screenshot_2026_03_30_at_13_22_26_recent_posts_education_dojo.png)
![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2026/03/full-39098-289766-1000015992.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2026/03/full-39098-289767-1000015993.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://banners.wunderground.com/weathersticker/miniDial_both/language/www/US/UT/Magna.gif)
![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2026/04/full-105-289810-img_0118.jpeg)
![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2026/04/full-105-289811-img_0120.jpeg)
