Ok, it has become a standard in the trapping world to dye and wax traps, or to dip water traps.

Now, the only advantage I see to dipping water traps is to prevent corrosion. That's all good, but one caught coon is going to shine that trap up, and now it can corrode. And since most folks don't pull a trap after each catch and re-dip, why dip in the first place? If you don't dip, it will rust and blend in with a creek bottom just fine.

Then there's the land sets. I can see the advantage of waxing traps to minimize odor, but why dye? The trap is buried under the dirt.

I put some water sets out yesterday, brand new traps bought the night before and the went from the store to the water!

I think with coon it is a waste of time. For other water animals, that don't chew, it helps with corrosion and camo's the trap from thieves. All my land traps this year were dyed and now you'd never know they were ever dyed, unless they didn't make a catch. Heck, the ones that caught coon look brand new again. The cleaning part, in my opinion, is neccesary for canines, and as long as I have to boil them anyway figure I might as well throw some tree bark in the water to color them and maybe give them some natural odor.

i think its a waste of time to dye them. i dont wax them but thats it

I'm old school. I boil and dye my traps then wax them. I think the wax may make the trap scent free though game will know we have been in the area and around the set anyway. The main thing about the wax is it will make the trap lightning fast for it is so slick. Just boiling them and then waxing would work but like goldy said if you boil them you may as well throw in some bark or hard wood leaves, black walnut hulls etc.

Buck, As a traditionalist, learning from my mentor 55 years ago, I continue to dye traps with black walnut hulls/sumac berries and wax them with a blend of paraffin and beeswax - both land and water traps - including my Conibears. I have never used the synthetic dips.

I am not a metallurgist or a chemist, but over the years, as a scientist, have given periodic thought to the question of, "Why dye?"

Without supportive, concrete evidence, I believe that the tannic acid in the dyes somehow permeates and seals the pores of the steel to some extent in advance of the layer of wax, maximizing the integrity of the rust preventative coating formed to inhibit the invasion of iron oxide (rust.)

My traditional habit may be old and crusty-rusty, but all of my traps, including those over 50 years old, are still functional almost as if new, without rust or pitting in the steel.

That is what little I know, and why I continue to dye and wax all of my traps to this very day.

Tradition or necessity? For me - both.

A most interesting, provocative question from another man with an unquiet mind.

Jonathan

If they chew on most of my water traps they have to do it underwater at the end of the drowning slide.

I do periodicly dye and wax my water traps but not at the freguency I do land trap.

I dye my new traps after they are lightly coated with rust. The ones that are already dyed don't seem to rust that much more....

I wax them after I dye them(legholds only) to speed them up in their operation(I think this helps). Coni's are fine without any wax!




Scott (does this make me a traditionalist) B

Jonathan, I agree with what you said as well. I'm not much of a water trapper but I always dye and wax my traps every year. I just dye the few conis that I have. If for no other reason I like to know that my investment in traps is in some way protected.

I like waxed traps for weasel, helps keep the weasel clean. I like dyed and waxed traps for canines, cause I use various anti freeze. Keeps them from rusting till shined up by an animal.

Just dying would be fine in a very dry climate, in fact the federal wolfers just dye their traps for summer work. keeps the rust at bay a little. You can smell fresh rust as it is happening, so can the canines. Rust probably wouldn't matter if it werent out of place.

Boil and then wax all my canine traps. Do not dye anymore. Like someone else said they're buried it's waste of time and money to me. I never could get that dye to take very well anyways.Always flaked and looked crappy. I wax only for Coyote and fox. The wax keeps trap odor down, protects the metal from moisture damage/corrosion, and makes em faster..

Dying and waxing....tradition, or necessity?

I think if you die,you won't be waxing

I think the dyeing is a tradition,but I do it ritualistically every year anyway,it's where I do my final inspections of my traps to make sure they are all in good condition and ready for the line, and toss aside any that need some work,I don't think the dye is an absolute but it does help me in the garage to mark ready to go traps,need work traps,and already been used traps(dirty from previous catches). I do wax all my traps for corrosion protection,and to help them not to freeze down,also to fire smoothly and quickly. Maybe just do it all cause thats how I was taught?

I would have to say a little tradition, a little for the care of the traps (prolong life), and maybe just personal preference, but I would say there are definitely locations and applications where it is not at all a necessity. Some animals (uneducated as they may be) up here don't care if the trap is undyed/waxed AND unburied.

I've caught animals each season I've been up here with new shinies. And heck, I just recently read on a thread that the Marten Jedi, Takotna, never takes his traps out of the woods season to season.

All depends...

I don't do anything to my traps or snares, and have caught LOTS of stuff. That being said, I've also seen where wolves, fox, and others have come up to a set and completly avoided it.

Mostly tradition, but as I wise trapper once told me: You'll catch 9 out of 10 fox with doing nothing. But it will be that one that DRIVES YOU NUTS while trying to get it.

Jonathan, I just love reading your posts! Good diction and syntax, and with some validity to boot!

as far as waxing goes the reason has already been said, why do I dye them?, because thats what my dad has always done, I have good memories of the day every year before trapping season when he would do it, and i would watch, so he still does his and I still do mine, hopefully in a fews years my girls will have some of those memories to keep, so I guess its tradition, without the die the whole process just woulnd't be complete.

on a second note, when I pull my traps after the first run at my line, I redo them dye and all, as I do not have enough to run my line two or three times without using the same ones over

how much wax does it take for 2 dozen traps?

???? A little help????

Alaskan, Thank you for your kind words.

I ain't much, but I learned how to spell, finally, in 7th grade. Syntax is a pretty big word. Is that related to grammar, and that other one I heard about once - lexicon?

Jonathan

Like Jonathan has alluded to. Don't know where the dye thing started and it don't really matter now, it's an established method of preperation for trapping for most.

Dyeing the traps now does a couple of things first off it helps to seal the pores of the steel with a light coating of rust already present. How some may ask, by combining on a molecular level and keeping the oxygen atom from combining with the iron atom and resulting in rust which if left unheeded would eat your trap up. Actually it does not eat it up as it's a molecular decompistion of the metal.

Once the dye is rubbed or wore off the trap this rusting process begins once agian.

Second thing it does is help repel a certain amount of scent coming from the steel.

Waxing is a pain that seems to me was invented for pure marketing LOL, I'll never use it and have never even wanted or felt the need to mess with it. Once you mess your wax up it's wasted and you got to start all over again with it and your traps. It causes a storage problem with traps once done and if left out seems to be a magnet for any scent coming incontact with traps done or the wax itself stored.

That being said I do understand the reason why it is used and the help it can lend to a catch. Just not enough for me to mess with is all.

Phil, Nice to know you haven't "died" yet while burying a fox trap.

What is your prerogative of doing stuff in the stance of Buck's question? The younger crowd is on pins and needles to know.

Just wondering.

Jonathan

glenrosebeaver08, I use a kitchen kettle, I have about 20 lbs in it

For me, coon traps get no prep, other than physical adjustment. Coyote and cat--brand new ones get degreased and waxed. I feel it "locks in" any odors and speeds up the trap and protects it to an extent. Then after they are good and used and start to rust from use and catches, they get dyed in walnut hulls and then waxed.

I used to try to rust brand new traps in vinegar or various other ways, then dye and wax, but found it to be too time consuming and then I realized I didn't have any reason to--like you said, they are going in the ground so I don't need camo, except for exposed cat sets, but in that case the dumb cat don't care what the trap looks like, shiny or black. I only dye after rust from natural use after a season or so because I can't stand to have my traps look crappy.

I dip mine, and I do it to protect the traps so they'll hopefully last me many seasons to come. Also, a black trap blends in better from people than a bright orange rusty one. Also, last year I had a 330 that was starting to rust, and I caught a beaver in it. I couldn't get that rust mark out of the beahver's fur, so I don't think I'll be letting my traps rust.

I/ll just touch on the dip being rubbed off by coon leaving bare metal to rust. That happens and I didn't like it as well. I went to dipping coon traps in cheap barn paint thinned with water. That mixture wears alot better than dip and actually protects the trap against rust. Speed Dip is a scam.

Great response Jonathan,

I would answer both except that there is still no other way to get the effects that the 2 provide me and my traps.


Dyeing traps has nothing to do with the color, so to those of you who do not dye them because they will be burried anyway, maybe you should do some research about this thing you call a sport you do cause that has nothing to do with it.

Waxing has nothing to do with odors... except it is a negative thing because wax absorbs any odor that is surronding it. So those of you waxing traps to make them odor free.... yep see above paragragh time for you to do some research and learn a thing or too as well.

Barkstone, I almost waddled with ink in reference to those contentions about dye, trap "color" in the so what? if buried, and the wax sealing in odor. Neither apply proportionately in the drift of my meager sense of what dyeing and waxing is intended for, at least by me - solely to maintain the longevity and life of a trap as a tool because of my investment in them.

I bought them on purpose - to hang out with me until the day that I am planted.

Mine will live beyond my allowed time on this planet.

Jonathan

Tradition, maintaining your gear, it is all part of the ritual of fall trapping. As stated above my traps will be here long after I am gone....Tom

I'll give you a little information about why I am skeptical about dying doing much to prevent corrosion. My background is nuclear, first as a reactor operator in the Navy, then as a commercial nuclear plant operator, and now as an inspector of nuclear reactors, and I've been trained a little on different types of corrosions, their causes, and prevention. But I'm no metallurgist by any means, and most of my knowledge is in the area of stainless steel and the various types of corrosion which affect it.

None of that training included anything about using the types of dyes we use as a coating, so I have no educational background which give me anything to go on as far as its effectiveness or ineffectiveness. But I do know that in order for a coating to be effective against corrosion, it must exclude oxygen and chlorides from contact with the metal. And when you think of chlorides, don't just think of salt from hands or salt applied at a set to keep the trap from freezing. Many materials can transfer chlorides, including the plastic in a tub in which you store your traps.

I also know that generalized corrosion (rust) if it is the right KIND of rust is effective against further corrosion, because it excludes oxygen from contact with the base metal. Many carbon steel components are deliberately "rusted" during manufacture to provide a "good" rust coating, under controlled conditions such as temperature, oxygen content, etc.

I also know about various types of pitting corrosion, galvanic corrosion, chloride stress corrosion cracking, intergranular stress corrosion cracking, etc. And a trap is under conditions in which all of these types of corrosion can occur, except maybe the IGSCC, which typically occurs in stainless steel in high temperature conditions.

I have no doubt that dipping can reduce corrosion. It is a solid coating that can exclude oxygen and chlorides. But I'm not sure about dye. The "coating" is so thin, does it really exlude oxygen from contact with the metal? And I'm not sure it fills pores in the metal all that effectively. After dying, you can still see the pores with the naked eye, and the only way it can reduce corrosion is if it is preventing contact of oxygen and chlorides with the metal.

I think the BEST preventer of damage to traps from excessive corrosion is a good coating of "good" rust which prevents contact of oxygen with the base metal. I think it is much more beneficial to a trap than dying. Dying may have some benefits, but it may not, either. Like I said, I'm not sure about its ability to exclude oxygen and chlorides.

I think I can get in touch with some metallurgists whose job is to analyze corrosion and flaws in the materials in nuclear power plants. It might not be real soon, spring at the earliest, but if I get a chance I think I'll ask them how effective the dye is.

Buck you have the product in front of you LOL, one can be a control the other the experiment, one dyed and the other not, you can see which will waste away quicker.

How many here have traps that are pristine as the day they bought them that they never dyed? Compared to those they have not used but dyed and just hung up? Which are worse for wear, without having any wear? Putting them in the ground will just aggravate the condition as well, dyeing some how helps this process slow down.

Don't take a rocket scientist to see something is helping slow the corriosion process!

I don't have near as much background in metalurgy as you do, however I've got enough with my background that tells me the dye is worth the effort and it's showing me that every time I use it.

I'd have to disagreee with a good coating of rust for small things, light wieght things like traps. Where you have a considerable amount of mass that might hold some wieght in the long run, but for smaller things there is enough ambient pressure for the oxygen to press past this coating of rust.

There's a reason that most bridges are coated with heavy encapsulating coatings and where it's wore off one can see how fast rust does it's thing when continuing forces help it.

Myself, I can't see where having a continued amount of rust accumulate on one's traps is benificial in the long run. When it does start to show or stay, once you knock this off you have lost some of your parent material and the process starts all over agian.

Trapping on a regular basis does not lend it's self to building up any kind of protective layering of rust for most active users of equipment. One has to protect the equipment in a quicker and more sustainable manner.

Not trying to make waves or cause anyone greif with this, so don't be taking it as a personal arguement on the matter! But there is something to the dye process that helps corrision resistance for trapping.

Im glad im not real smart, lmao.

While messing around with some traps in the shop just now, I got to thinking about how logwood crystal or hickory nut dyes could inhibit corrosion.

Now, I know that the pH of a solution in contact with metal will affect the corrosion rate. And some soils are more alkaline than others.

So could it be that the deposit of tannic acid on the metal is maintaining a more favorable pH while the trap is in the soil and that is why dying helps inhibit corrosion? Seems plausible to me.

I want to see a MB-550 or 650 in stainless steel! Now THAT would be the ultimate! Why has no-one done this?

Cost!

Anyone who drives a vehicle where roads are salted knows rust does not protect from further rust in those circumstances. Rust spots need to be treated to prevent further corrosion.

Anyone using an untreated trap with any kind of salt antifreeze will soon see their traps rust away.

btw, I find oil based paint works well for body grippers.

I definitely wouldn't use an unwaxed trap if using salt. Wouldn't take long for it to be completely ruined.

That's what I was thinking, lol. Guess my reason that I posted earlier is shot. Oh well, I don't need to get all technical about it. It works for me so I'm sticking to it.