Hey Dave, thanks for the show of support. ( But you can't elect a guy that so old that he could keel over at any moment )

I will do my very best to stimulate great debate. ( I've gotten so old that I can't remember why I had a problem in the first place )

Just kidding; I passed 12 people my age on the highway today. Those old farts don't drive very well, do they?

One of my problems is this: If you are reasonably young and making a huge amount of money, why are you running for office?

I could actually understand why the present people ran. They truly believed that the former officers were stealing. What?

I know nearly everyone personally and I have to say, I would trust nearly all of them, old and new.

What I would do, if I were an elected official of the National Wildlife Control Operator's Association is ask everyone who is reading this post, what they would like us to do as your National Association, to make things better, easier, and more profitable for you? ( After reading this post, maybe I should run for office. ( At least dog catcher )

Dave, would you re-post? I didn't get to see your original entry.

Dave, glad this thing got brought up. I just received the new ballot for NWCOA, and although I'm not dismayed, I am somewhat flabbergasted. We have, count them, not one new member running for office. Now I can't say that others were deemed unfit to run, but if that was the case, I'm sure everyone wants to hear about it!

We have Jason Reger running for President which is a marked improvement if you are asking me!
My Opinion: Why would a guy that runs ( as far as I know ) any extremely successful company want to get involved in NWCOA problems?

We have Charles Parker running for Vice-President.
My Opinion: Charles is not one to make waves, but he's a follower not a leader.

We have Mike Tucker running for treasurer again. ( Obviously, once is not enough )
My Opinion: I've always liked Mike. Anyone who can handle Minnesota politics, can handle anything.

We have Vikki Rawe running for secretary. ( Not only is Vikki very nice but her husband is first rate also )
My Opinion: She seems to love everyone. ( That will change )

We have Charles Holt re-running for General Organizer. ( Would stand behind NWCOA if they were al-Qaeda )
My Opinion: Who could you ever get to beat him? ( The next election, he'll run for another office )

And I'll be running for central director

Paul:

Out of your 5 points....
1) Must be passion...or insanity.
2) Then, Charles picked the right job.
3) ...
4) Let's hope not.
5) Well, you need experience in the team...

Hopefully, everyone will keep the peace during this next era. Besides, after obammacare blows up...who will have the energy to argue about anything else?

Civics Question: Why even have an election if the offices are running unopposed.

Robb, I guess that's where the flabbergasted part came in. Kind of like to know if these are the only candidates who wanted the job.

Robb, I guess that's where the flabbergasted part came in. Kind of like to know if these are the only candidates who wanted the job.

Jordan: I didn't mean to slight you. I just don't know you well enough to have an opinion, but that will change.

Well...did anyone try to run that is not on the ballot?

I understand ex NWCOA Presidents are not qualified to be put on the ballot.

I would actually join and vote to give for Jordan .

Robb - They can run for other offices for sure.

Not exactly DAVEK - read the bylaws .

1) No write in candidates are allowed.
2) Must now be a member of good standing for at least two years to be eligible for office.
3) Officers can run in a office more then two years if they are unopposed.

Consecutive is a key word here.

Incumbent is another key word.

FUNNY! a week later all of a sudden this is a popular topic. I figured when I got my ballot everybody else already had theirs for two weeks, it takes pony express that long to get here. Dave Schmidt pointed out to me that Eric Arnold is on the list of guess speakers for the Expo, that is excellent!

Jordan as someone twice your age I hope I can give a little advice and constructive criticism. Pay more attention to your constituents then you did to me and three of my fellow WCOs last time in New Orleans. We tried to meet you and say hello and you blew us off like a swarm of annoying skeeters. Same thing at the NTA.

Noted.

JMO, the telling thing to me is that even now after how many years of existence we are still seeing the same names year after year. Other than Bud where is the new blood or the recruitment and grooming of the next generation.
Now that is not to ascribe malice or wrongful intent in any way. Just an observation from here. Could it be to large a task for a few or is the day to day so burdensome that no view to the future is possible? And before the requisite call for volunteers to step up I must again reiterate the one claim from the great unwashed that obviously has yet to be met, "what's in it for me". Sorry to put it so crassly but it is the bottom line that motivates all of us. If there is something in it for me then someone has failed to do his marketing because I never got the memo.

It is probably more of a "calling"...like priests feel. That said, I would support increasing dues so that people get paid some sort of salary for their time.

Bite your tongue Dave, the last membership fee price jack was twice too much. Don't get me started.

Listen...I am not running anytime in the next decade. We really need to pay these folks a similar rate as if you outsourced the job (which we may want to do someday). Winkie has a point...why would anyone operating a sucessful business do it? Why not pay someone in the industry that has the passion...and may need the money? That would be a win win.

Hey Everybody Look, Dave K is the only one with a viable solution and I'm embarrassed that I or some other member didn't think of it first.

The only way NWCOA will ever be run to the satisfaction of the majority of us, ( And I really don't care which side you are on ) is if we pay outside ( or even inside ) people to make the hard calls without regard to anything but the good of the organization.

Just in case you haven't noticed, by-laws have made it nearly impossible for anyone that used to be a NWCOA representative, to run for office today. To put in words we can all understand, If I wanted to run for the office of NWCOA president, I would have had to agree to everything they stood for and been a member in good standing for the past two years.

Or in other words, I would have had to give up my membership in the GOP and become a Democrat two years ago and then getting my name on the ballot would still be their call. A Democracy NWCOA isn't!!!

P.S. I would love to be proven wrong and my apology is only a heartbeat away.

Now, Paul...that just is not true. You do need to be a member for 2 years. To put this into better terms people can understand: A incumbent (current) president can not serve more than 2 consecutive (back to back) terms, unless unopposed. They could serve every other term!

That said, all past Presidents can pay dues for two years and run! Frankly, it might not be too late to pay for 2013 and 2014 at this point....

If you plan on complaining the next few years, I urge you to run. If there was someone that meets the requirements and was denied the opportunity to run, please speak up.

Okay, I'm confused. ( Which seems to be the norm lately ) So what part is not true? ( Since I agree with everything you said ) And I don't mean to start an argument but isn't there something about the sitting board deciding if you were a worthy candidate and deserved to be put on the ballot? ( I believe that this is meant to keep out candidates like serial killers, Hillary, the head of HSUS, and me )

If voices want to be heard, become a member....

Paul - the bylaws that Robb posted on previous page state that you have to be a member in good standing. This means that you paid your dues. It has nothing to do with popularity with the board. You could run, if you join for 2 years. You could even have an opinion...

So what you are saying is that as long as I'm a two year member in good standing, I can run for office even if I'm a protectionist?

Yup. That is step one. Step twp is winning the vote of the majority of members.....or run for uncontested position.

Dave, that's what has me bothered; all positions are uncontested. ( Which is why I made that post about approval from the board )

I'm not looking for trouble, just someone from NWCOA agreeing to your posts. ( I promise I'll keep my mouth shut if you're right )

P.S. I don't know which is worse; the not knowing by me or the not caring by everybody else.

It's the latter...not caring by everybody else. If any member was denied an opportunity to run....now is the time to speak up. Otherwise, for the next term, I (for one) don't want to hear any complaining.

For what it's worth, I have worked with everyone on the ballot, and have no reservations about any of them. In my view there should be no question about the competence or integrity of these candidates. They are all good people and should be applauded for donating their time for the betterment of the industry.
NWCOA isn't perfect, however that's not the fault of the people who are participating, it's the fault of the people who aren't participating.

Steve for president

First I need to commend the officers of NWCOA for the hours and hours of time that is involved. Regardless of my opinion of some of the positions taken, I know it takes a great deal of time to address some of the issues that have arisen over the past several years.

For those of you who do not know. NWCOA is under contract with an organization to handle the day to day operations of the organization. Exactly what their responsibilities and duties are, I don't know. I would venture to guess they are recruitment and member retention, along with some fiscal responsibilities.

I am happy to see that Eric, from WCT Group has been retained as a presenter for their annual convention. He is knowledgable and very thorough in his presentations.

Any way you look at, the people involved as officers of the organization give of their time (and their loved ones time) on behalf of the industry and in doing so should be commended.

I wish all who are selected the best of luck.

Paul I would be willing to bet that all NWCOA board members past, present and future have been commanded not to ever post on Tman. We're just a bunch of rabble rousers. If I'm right Jordan will disappear after the election when they implant his micro chip. I am assimilated, take me to our leader.

Come on now...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ttk4Ia-PW-0

Thats not exactly right Dave .You just don't know their screen names. NWCOA officers post often here using nickname screen names .

Microchips? Jordan is no follower Dave. Many of us also know him as a innovator , doing business as Bud's Traps and formerly Editor - Publisher PWCM Magazine . I am gonna bet when given time Jordan will do a fine job and make a difference. I was actually hopeful of seeing a lot of new blood this year in addition to Jordan Budenski.

I just have a problem calling this an election.

I see a one party system in control that could easily hand each other "Guidons" or "Marbles" then all the bother of time and expense to elect themselves to unchallenged officer positions.

How can these unchallenged officers lose anyway.

Sorry Dave, but that's just not true at all. I am a former board member, and never at any time while I was on the board or since I left has anyone at NWCOA commanded or even suggested that I shouldn't post on Trapperman.

It's not a Mafia, just some good people doing their best with limited resources.

Ease up guys, see the little smiley face? doesn't that mean humor? Robb I know most of the alias, even Proline quit posting which surprises me. I'll crawl back into my cave now.

Dave, Dave, Dave, Proline just posted a couple of days ago. Our new president elect ( Mr. Reger ) is sworn to mend fences between WCT and NWCOA. ( So you and I should get the first phone calls ) I want you to have a more positive outlook. ( Okay, Obamacare kind of killed that for me too )

So...it appears the no one was denied the opportunity to run for office.

I do not have a problem with requireing that one be a member to run. Has anyone been denied membership?

I have been watching this thread unfold and can say I am glad to see some of the nice things being said. I think a lot of people bring up some good points, and Like Robb said, its tough to call this an "Election" when we are running unnopposed however we still need to follow procedure. I plan on introducing a change to allow for skipping the expense if all positions are uncontested as it just makes fiscal sense.

In regards to Paul calling me a follower and not much of a leader - he's right about following. I will always follow what I know is right, and of sound judgement. I think I have fulfilled the duties of a leader whether he would consider me one or not. I stepped up and served at my expense, and continue to. Volunteering to go to Pest World in Pheonix last week to man the NWCOA booth and attempt to sign up new members, and new vendors for the EXPO cost me a weeks pay in my personal business - I had to shut down all of my jobs and schedule all new work for at least a day after my return. Yeah that costs me $$$.
So yeah, I'm stupid too...???

In regards to NWCOA Officers posting on here, the board has forever discussed what an officer can or cannot post in regards to NWCOA and its positions, and or actions mostly because of the contentions that come out of it. Everybody makes mistakes, mis-quotes policy or doesn't remember who said what or when - its just human nature and can affect future membership opportunities. Some people think contention is good for business as it gets people talking - but I think it can only do harm. I can't speak for everyone on the board but me personally, frankly I just haven't had the time to hang out here. In fact the only reason I am here right now is someone told me Paul was on here bashing me.

So I read it, and at first I was like screw him and pounded out some words - then I deleted them and remembered how much time I used to waste on my own forums and NWCOA's arguing with people over one thing or another - or moderating fights which was a real treat, lol.

Anyways, I thought about it and realized life's too short and I got work to do. Jobs to quote and animals to go get. I also know that Paul has never met me and can only go off of what he's being told or sees - so whatever, good for him and his opinion. I kind of liked the old Paul who wrote me kind words on my Wildlife Operators Forum which btw I still own and operate - a forum that was once the critical place to check and be DAILY. (It's a ghost town now, but that's OK I made some great friends there) My forum still offers free advertising for all NWCO's and I plan on reinventing it over the next year in a big way.

If anyone on here has any questions about NWCOA give our management company a call or call me. I am sure I can answer your questions very quickly. There is a lot of good information right there on NWCOA.com (that I built from scratch for free to NWCOA during my term)

Anyways, enough with me tooting my own horn. If you have some suggestions for the direction of NWCOA there are 3 new people coming on board so yeah there's some new blood too!

OK, off to work...

Mr. Parker; a couple of things: first of all I guess my assessment of you may have been slightly off since you're the only one that had the leadership to reply! ( This wasn't bashing, by the way. If we were all leaders, we wouldn't have any employees )

Secondly, we have met but apparently I didn't make enough of an impression for you to remember. Touché!

I guess in retrospect I've gotten over the terrible way that some things have been handled in the past and I would like to see some or all of the newly elected NWCOA board members start posting on T-Man. If you want to gain membership, there is no cheaper way than to post on here.

P.S. If I get out of hand again, there is always Dave K. to reel me back in.

Paul:

I would love to see you sign up for NWCOA as a gesture of confidence in the new board. Then, you will have the ability to influence how the organization is run.

Dave

I have only one regret, that I deleted my original post. Chuck good to see your post, maybe things will improve, I refrain from using the word change because I hate change. I remember when the glaciers went through and changed everything, that sucked.
PS
for the too serious ones the smiley face means humor.

Talk about dealing with change! Walkin' upright and wearing clothes in public was a serious adjustment for me...oh, yeah, and being told "You can't take your horse in here!" Civilization! Bah!
Parker, I'll toot your horn for you. Mr. Charles Parker is one of the most valuable, helpful, unassuming guys I've met in any industry. I've never heard anybody with an unkind word for Charles (well, there was UK, but that was years ago, and Chuck was his usual disarming self against Kirk's unfortunate rant)...cuz he's never deserved it.
A credit to humanity and our industry, Charles Parker is.

Dave are you vying for a cabinet post with the new regime with that big wet dupa kiss? I sure wish there was an icon for that.

No, don't even know what a dupa is, but I bet it involves a brown nose. Just giving the man his due.

It's tough getting people to run becuse it is a lot of work and more headachs than perks. Its tough to be on the board because Charles is right it does cost you money and not only time spent with your family but quality time. My wife used to ask me how much was I getting paid to be attacked by a vocal minority because the silent majority only give you support when you see them. Other board members worked and thought about NWCOA twice as much as me and all they got was twice as much critisism.
I still believe in the NWCOA concept and hope the new board gets a lawyer that can tell them how they can do the right thing and return the monies to state associations that I promised to safeguard their money. I don't think any present board members have benefitted personally I think the mistake they made was spending to much time looking back at the old board missing what was in front of them.
I think their is very much strength in numbers and I think NWCOA's numbers are down. I plan on joining again next year.
I think instead of a 250 professional membership and a 125 150 whateever it is associate member it should be a 125 professional member and a 250 or higher sustaining professional noone wants to be anything but a professional member. All professional members should be allowed to vote or run for election.
Return state associations money.
It's ok to disagree as long as we are swimming in the same direction.

Three cheers for Mr. Brooker! Get the money back to the states and I'll guarantee at least two memberships. ( And my state is not involved )

Three more cheers and another membership if the money is returned.

There is a process...go get it...or move on...

DaveK, I have got to think that at some point this becomes a real win for NWCOA. Patching fences and insuring membership at the same time. As a matter of fact, if this thing would work, I would send in two grand for my son and I to cover the next four years. Everyone knows my feelings about NWCOA; wouldn't this be a great time to call my bluff? ( In front of everyone )

I hope it is that easy. But, I think you are asking NWCOA to return fees to a currently non-existant NWCOA state chapter. How about they donate all their funds to make a wish....and start from zero? Seriously, we all need to forget about it and move on....

Dave, the chapters are only defunct because NWCOA closed them down without a word of warning. The state organizations are still there and they're still tax exempt. You can't tell me that one tax exempt group can't help out another, They do it all the time. What I'm trying to do is to make this as financially painless as possible. I, as much as anyone, am trying to make everyone "forget about it" and Brooker's idea seems to be the best way to make that happen.

It would create another wrong. The funding would help other state funds consisting of different people then what made up the former chapters. I just paid my dues...why would I want my contribution to go toward a non nwcoa organization in WI? There is no fixing it...that would keep everyone happy. Think of a new folks that joined...or the old member that retired or quit membership.

You would be better off disolving the organization and donating the funds to the humane society. Since, that is not likely to happen, you need to just be the bigger person and forget about it. Just pray about it on Sunday.

Dave, what are you talking about? We are not talking about individuals here; we are talking about organizations. If I pay my dues to NWCOA and then suddenly die, are my dues going to be refunded because they might benefit someone that I don't even know? Of course not. We are not talking about dues in the first place. We are talking about money made for state treasuries through donations, auctions, maybe even bake sales. If this had anything to do with NWCOA dues, the subject never would have been brought up. ( A good example of that is Wisconsin. All we had coming was a percentage of dues that we paid to be NWCOA members. It's their money and we never mentioned it again )

P.S. The only reason I bring this whole mess up again is because I think that there might even be members of the NWCOA board that don't understand what the problem is. Nobody wants their dues refunded; they just want the money that belongs in their state treasury back in their state treasury. And I for one, am willing to go the extra mile to see that this happens.

Except your state nwcoa chapter does not exist. I thought that there was a way to get the money returned. It required that you start a state nwcoa chapter in your state. The process did not allow it to be returned to a completely different organization in the same state. It is not money for the state.....it is money for a specific organization within a state.

Dave K were not talking about any money that NWCOA set aside for chapters its money that independant chapters sent to NWCOA for safe keeping aqnd when the chapter program was scrapped which it should be those monies are what they should have returned. Not the 20 dollars per member set aside from your national dues for the chapter. I can see the argument that that money was reappropriated but not the treasuries of the state associations given up to NWCOA for safekeeping.
Maybe it would be easier if you would send Winkelmann and me 1000 dollars each to hold for you and we will give it back to you when we decide your going to spend it well. Until then we keep it. Maybe we should try to get the Iranians to send us their bombs until they need them then not let them have them back it would solve a lot of problems.
We NWCOA took state associatians money then got a lawyer to say it was illegal to give them back their money. That can't be right but I am not trying to start a big argument about this I am just trying to communicate with the new board to ask their lawyer how they can legally give people back their money. Doing the right thing will benefit NWCOA greatly.
Anyone who reads this I will tell you the same thing I told state associations send your money to me and I will take care of it. Only don't send it to NWCOA send it to Paul brooker, 1629 louisville road, frankfort, ky, 40601. If you want it back and I don't think your going to waste it or talk bad about me I'll send it back if I have any of it left.
If you don't like that go to church and pray for me you'll feel better.

Dave, how can any membership benefits for current members be destroyed? Since you seem to be the only person taking part in what Brooker, Bethell, I, and others had hoped to be a healthy discussion, I plainly do not understand you. You have no interest in running for any NWCOA office, you certainly haven't been a member long enough to understand just about anything, and yet you have an answer for everything except solving problems of the past and perhaps even a 10% to 30% increase in NWCOA memberships.

I find this whole series of posts nothing more than amazing. I am arguing with a guy that doesn't have a clue what is going on, has no interest in NWCOA or its seminars, and I truly can't find any reason at all for your not wanting to move ahead. I will gladly talk to any member of the NWCOA board on how they can improve relations and actually gain membership, money,and clout. But these inane discussions are over!

Paul...you answered your first question towards the end of your first paragraph....then explained it a little more in the second sentance in the second paragraph. It really sucks that I have no interest. Yet, I continue to pay my dues in hopes that the old men will grow up. Why? Because your old penpal says it is the right thing to do...to keep the organization going.

OK let s see this thread was started to ask why there were even elections for positions that were unopposed. (Because NWCOA has to by bylaws.) But just for a second think of the howls of outrage that would of been posted if we would not of held elections!!!Talk about a crap storm. So to me the start of this thread and some of the comments just shows that even though this board is following the rules some still find a way to find fault and give a ration of crapola.

Now take a look at this thread (how long it has gone on, number of posts) which is anti board/NWCOA and is on its way to being another epic bash NWCOA thread here on Tman. Compare this thread to the post I started on NWCOA being at the WCT event. A nice positive post that has how many replies? Who posted to it? How far down the page is it now? And what speaks volumes is who didn't post to that thread.

Paul B in your post you talk about NWCOA searching for another lawyer to give an opinion that you agree with. This board did not shop around for a lawyer to give us an opinion on this issue (He was picked by a past NWCOA board member)and we follow that opinion based on his expertise in non-profit law. That you (as a past board member)would suggest that we shop around for a lawyer to give an opinion...gives me real pause. Don't like what your lawyer has to say so you just shop around to you find one who agrees with you?

Dave K has it right. Don't like direction of NWCOA join, become active, come to meetings, join a committee (where the real work is) or stay on these forums bashing NWCOA. I don't see the point unless it is to affect NWCOA's ability to get new members. No board members spend much time here, they are not reading this and I am not taking it to them.

And I agree with Paul W as most are non members these are inane discussions... if you want a voice join.

Once again I regret deleting my original post, it was positively positive. Sorry you missed it Chuck, my intent was not for it to take the tack that it did.

This comment brought to you by the new kinder gentler Dave.

Thanks for responding Charles. If you could persuade any other board members to post on here, I would do my best to keep everything civil. This site still seems to me to be one of the best ways for you to get new members without spending a nickel.

If you are wondering why the sudden change in disposition, it's really quite simple. I have personally never lost so much as a nickel to NWCOA. As a matter of fact, I'm sure I owe a percentage of our success to NWCOA seminars. My big problem was the bashing of people that I had come to know and respect. Since this has all but stopped ( My guess is because of interment and perhaps incarceration ) I have no reason not to trust the new board.

P.S. At my age, Alzheimer's may have also played a part.

Thanks Dave. I did miss the start of this thread and it is good to know it did not start out as a bashing. Bravo to the kinder nicer Dave.

Paul W.

Sorta went both ways though huh? Many who I also consider friends were ran down as well. Much was reactionary very few (if any) threads started by board members bashing anyone or anything. Lets call it water under the bridge. Very difficult discussing NWCOA on an open site especially internal subjects that pertain to members only. I agree this site would be a great way to reach potential new members but look back on just this thread and it gets a little rough for NWCOA and all we did was follow the by-laws. Like I said before if NWCOA said we were going to give away Tomahawk traps there would be some who were mad about them not being the pro models.

I took no offense but I was sorta shocked to see my name, Al-Qaeda and support in the same paragraph when the FBI knocks on my door I will send them to see you.:)

Plenty of committees that need members to work within ranging from Wildlife services (how to fight competition) to training and so many more. Would really like to have you, your son and every other operator to be a member and active in the assocation. If you get a chance stop down to NOLA and the EXPO I am sure you will find it (while different in some ways/same in others) a good event. Sorry I missed you in Lexington and I asked Al about you (I though you two were joined at the hip).

Take care Paul.

The FBI was here already. ( I figured you sent them ) They wanted to know if any of us ADC guys were terrorists. I told them it depended on which of our customers they asked.

Al dodged a bullet. If I'd have been there we would have shared a room and then he'd be on all the same crazy medication that I've been on. ( See my post on Doctor's business strategy )

P.S. If you ever decide to give away Tomahawk traps, let me know. I think I can get you upgraded to the Pro Model so you won't be criticized.

My ballot went in the mail today. I wonder who's going to win??

I am gonna call the election early unofficially lol

Congratulations Jason Reger President Elect. my good friends Charles Holt, Charles Parker, Jordan Budenski and the other men and women who ran un-opposed this year. (I don't have a list to quote everyones name sorry.)

I wish each you much success with the NWCOA offices you begin to serve.

Mr Reger

I have one real request of you and NWCOA.

Tear down those walls that divide us from the past !!

Bring an end to the division that has done nothing more then implode this industry !!

I have read some positive things in this thread about NWCOA and WCT working closer together.

I hope this is just the beginning of greater things to come.

I hope that all of NWCOA's future ballots run opposed and everyone in this industry support this board and future boards.

I concur with Robb I never was bashing NWCOA I was speaking to them and making suggestions for their an the industries future. The industry needs NWCOA and NWCOA needs the industry. There is strength in numbers a backbone is useless if you have no muscles, all politics are local and a national association needs a local presence. I'm going to listen for a while.

Paul B.

The place to listen and help would be on .info or at the membership meeting. And lets be blunt many who have been involved in these threads are not supporting NWCOA, WCT or anything else.

I agree a state presence is needed. But as you know from your term as GO there was little to no compliance from chapters. And being chapters, compliance was necessary due to tax status. I am sure you asked for such compliance as did I and looking at minutes/paper work we got from past board you had just as much luck getting that compliance as I did. That lack of compliance and the jeopardy it placed NWCOA's tax status in was what resulted in the chapter program being switched to a affiliate program. That switch was not a snap, take a look at the by-laws at www.nwcoa.com those represent hours and hours of work by members on committees bringing policy to board for review and suggestions and/or changes then back to committee and then, when it looks good, off to lawyer to make sure it is compliant with non-profit law.

In a nut shell the difference between chapters and affiliates is the freedom from oversight. Sure support of NWCOA's mission statement, code of ethics and supporting NWCOA in both word and deed is needed from an affiliate. That support is for the association not for board members whoever they are. A lot of the flack NWCOA has taken is not due to policy but who implemented that policy. Sure there were some policy decisions that some would not be proponents of no matter who proposed them but there were also some who applauded those changes no matter who put them forward.

Then it comes to membership. To me no matter how long one WAS a member, how vocal a non-member is, their voice carries no weight when I have to vote on an issue. I have to listen to members and base my vote on the input of a majority of membership no matter my personal feelings. Not trying to be a donkey but listening to non-members concerning policy to me seems to be a form of subsidizing. If your not vested in the association how can one's voice have weight compared to a paying member?

A long time member asked me to ask you if you remembered NWCOA's welcome at it's inception? How was NWCOA received when it was brought to forums and to some who worked in the industry and how the policies and code of ethics of NWCOA was thoroughly trashed by some. This member also assured me that we were not the first board to be called elitists or questioned by those who thought the status quo was the way to go. You all had the cajones to stand up to that and build a trade association and I applaud you all for it. And while not asking for applause for this board or future boards I hope they have the cajones to continue to push the envelope just as you all did. Change is often painful (and Dave S hates it:) )and a trade association has to evolve or become irrelevant/stagnant just as our businesses would become without new products, techniques or methods.

Many on this forum have no interest in these issues. So I would like to invite you, Paul W, Tim any anyone else to join and either discuss this on .info or even better come to New Orleans and attend the membership meeting and discuss these issues face to face. I hoped you, Paul W or others would of wanted some discussion in Lexington and I did have some but the only way I see this division to end is for those with issues to become ACTIVE members, put aside who is in office or who is proposing changes. Look at changes from the inside, add your insight and work together to elevate our trade association.

Charles, one of the most intelligent quotes that you've said is about face to face conversations. It is almost amazing how a customer that you've never met, and is mad as heck, can have an entirely different disposition when met face to face. I guess that this is one of the reasons that I am pleased with the new board. I've met you all face to face. ( Even if Parker doesn't remember )

Everyone of you has a very successful business and the only reason that you ran, I guess, is because you felt that you could help. You remind me a lot of the first board. They needed this job like I needed another hole in my head. I wouldn't mind coming to New Orleans at all but I don't see that happening this year. ( But you never know ) I would actually love to be one of the guys that helped tear down the walls.

Paul,

Hope you can make it!

And not one to ever miss a chance to promote NWCOA and gain members (with the side benefit of helping you become one of the guys who helped tear down the walls). How about you and PJ join up and as part of my G.O. duties let me encourage one of you to become a representative or co/rep for your state (Not a huge work load or time suck until I hit you up to help with the affiliate program but we are working on a process to stream line that and avoid the majority of time suck from volunteers). Numbers are great but (I believe) an engaged membership is key to a successful trade group or association. That's what NWCOA needs..members that are passionate about the industry and even more specifically a passion for certain aspects of the industry and for those members to become active in committees that represent those interests/passions. You get enough members like that success will follow and with success will come more members who want to be a part of those successes or reap the benefits of membership.

Charles I concur with what NWCOA did with the chapter issue except for one small issue that needs to be corrected.
I think I was friendly with you and Vicki at the WCT but I didn't think it was a time to discuss issues. I was having to good of a time and I hope u all were too.

Paul,

You were most definitely very friendly (as always), Eric was gracious and welcoming (and I expected nothing less). And both myself and Vikki had a very good time. I am glad the board directed us to attend, I know you guys don't have horns and it was good for those on the outside to see that we are hornless as well. Looking at the discussions on forums I am sure some expected a donnybrook but what can't be seen on those discussions is that we have all broken bread, shared a laugh or maybe even had a wee nip together

There is much more that connects us than separates us. Every member of NWCOA boards past and present has wanted to elevate our industry and protect it from outside groups such as PETA, HSUS and unjust regulations from those who don't understand/devalue our industry. Methods to reach those goals may be different but the goals are the same. The future boards of NWCOA will also have a different method from the current board and I see that as a positive, thing's change and NWCOA's way of dealing with those issues should evolve as well.

Hope you will think about coming to New Orleans you have much to offer and while terrifying the thought of doing the Bourbon Street stumble with both you and Christian boggles the mind.

Charles,
Thanks I'm thinking

I'm not. If you get two Pauls thinking at the same time it causes a lot of confusion in the universe because it's never been done before.

The date on this quote is 11/22, I received a surprise envelope in the mail yesterday 12/9, my ballot got returned. The kinder, gentler Dave is being tested. My ballot was returned because the wrong mailing address for the attorney was printed on the ballot. the ballot has a Canal St, New Orleans address on it but the retuned envelope says it should be Baronne St, N.O., the forwarding request was expired so it took the post office 17 days to get it back to me. So who's the D.A. that printed the wrong address? And no I won't post this on NWCOA's site, I've found that site very user unfriendly.