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Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639365
10/14/19 08:35 AM
10/14/19 08:35 AM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 7,803
pa
H
hippie Offline
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hippie  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 7,803
pa
If we stay, we better plan on staying forever because the Kurds can't protect themselves now and I doubt the ever will.

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639389
10/14/19 09:10 AM
10/14/19 09:10 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 7,656
Northeast Oklahoma
M
Mike in A-town Offline
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Mike in A-town  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 7,656
Northeast Oklahoma
Allying with any faction in the Middle East has always been a crap shoot. You can NEVER be sure that you won't regret it down the road...

We aligned with the Shah in Iran... Didn't work.

We backed the mujihadeen in Afghanistan... Precursor to the Taliban.

We backed Saddam to help fight Iran.

We back the Saudis.

We always go in with good intentions... But how do you help a region of the world where humanity is not a concern of the inhabitants who live there?

I can't really say I support either side of this debate because it seems there is no "right" decision when it comes to the Middle East. We might end up regretting NOT helping the Kurds... But chances are just about even we might regret helping them.

Mike


One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin
Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639396
10/14/19 09:15 AM
10/14/19 09:15 AM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 10,035
OH
Catch22 Offline
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Catch22  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 10,035
OH
I have absolutely no problem with bringing our Warriors home.


Disclaimer: I am currently drunk, yet still confident that this makes sense.
Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: Catch22] #6639474
10/14/19 11:56 AM
10/14/19 11:56 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 6,004
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Online content
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bblwi  Online Content
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 6,004
East-Central Wisconsin
Maybe bringing our troops out is the best call now but we are leaving our dirty laundry scattered all over the whole Mid-East. One does not build solid foreign policy relations by starting fights and then leaving after damaging whatever balance may have been there before entering. It has been a good way for us to test our weaponry and find markets for our military arms and technology, but at the expense of lives of many who we seem to discount as lesser humans even if they help and support us.

Bryce

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639500
10/14/19 12:43 PM
10/14/19 12:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,461
I70@OH/IN
OhioBoy Offline
trapper
OhioBoy  Offline
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Posts: 2,461
I70@OH/IN
I didn't see it mentioned, the sticky point is that...

Whenever we go somewhere like that, blow it up, and then leave, the inrush of people back filling that void creates another problematic group. That is what created Taliban, Isis, and etc. So its easy to want our boys to come home but the worrisome part is the future problems it creates and it potentially being a major problem. That is my understanding of it, I might be wrong. But I suspect loosing the generals that Trump has due this view point in particular tells me that they disagree with him / it too. That is the part that scares me.

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: bblwi] #6639501
10/14/19 12:47 PM
10/14/19 12:47 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,485
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
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Dirt  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,485
Armpit, ak
Originally Posted by bblwi
Maybe bringing our troops out is the best call now but we are leaving our dirty laundry scattered all over the whole Mid-East. One does not build solid foreign policy relations by starting fights and then leaving after damaging whatever balance may have been there before entering. It has been a good way for us to test our weaponry and find markets for our military arms and technology, but at the expense of lives of many who we seem to discount as lesser humans even if they help and support us.

Bryce


"Our military organization today bears little relation to that known by any of my predecessors in peacetime, or indeed by the fighting men of World War II or Korea.

Until the latest of our world conflicts, the United States had no armaments industry. American makers of plowshares could, with time and as required, make swords as well. But now we can no longer risk emergency improvisation of national defense; we have been compelled to create a permanent armaments industry of vast proportions. Added to this, three and a half million men and women are directly engaged in the defense establishment. We annually spend on military security more than the net income of all United States corporations.

This conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence -- economic, political, even spiritual -- is felt in every city, every State house, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources and livelihood are all involved; so is the very structure of our society.

In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the militaryindustrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.

We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together. "


Who is John Galt?
Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639518
10/14/19 01:24 PM
10/14/19 01:24 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 1,693
Dunbar, Wisconsin
P
Pike River Offline
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Pike River  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 1,693
Dunbar, Wisconsin
^Eisenhower?

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: Pike River] #6639526
10/14/19 01:39 PM
10/14/19 01:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,485
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
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Dirt  Offline
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D

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,485
Armpit, ak
Originally Posted by Pike River
^Eisenhower?


Yes. Who would be more knowledgeable about both sides of the military industrial complex equation? I'm sure it has only gotten worse.


Who is John Galt?
Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639530
10/14/19 01:48 PM
10/14/19 01:48 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 10,035
OH
Catch22 Offline
trapper
Catch22  Offline
trapper

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 10,035
OH
For one, It's not our job to police the world. I couldn't care less about what goes on over there, as long as it doesn't darken our door I say let them have at it. Secondly, I grew up as a kid during NAM and know how our Gov't hamstringed our Warriors, here we go again. If your gonna get'em, then dang it get'em. Thirdly, We defeated ISIS and that was the job, took years to do, now it's time to go. Lastly, we were only supposed to be there for a short while and what, 9 years later we are there, BS. All the blowhards in Congress, including Repubs that are running their mouths and slamming Trump for keeping a promise to us, bringing our troops home, need to either shut up or do what they are supposed to do. Declare WAR and then kick some butt.


Disclaimer: I am currently drunk, yet still confident that this makes sense.
Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: Dirt] #6639532
10/14/19 01:50 PM
10/14/19 01:50 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 1,693
Dunbar, Wisconsin
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Pike River Offline
trapper
Pike River  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 1,693
Dunbar, Wisconsin
Originally Posted by Dirt
Originally Posted by Pike River
^Eisenhower?


Yes. Who would be more knowledgeable about both sides of the military industrial complex equation? I'm sure it has only gotten worse.

+1!

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639662
10/14/19 06:37 PM
10/14/19 06:37 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 996
SE Nebraska
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trapperne Offline
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SE Nebraska
I heard some place the other day the Kurds have killed something in the neighborhood of 40,000 Turks over a period of time, I can’t remember exactly what they said. We turned iraq and Afghanistan into a parking lot for 10 percent of that so hard to blame them for the invasion

Last edited by trapperne; 10/14/19 06:38 PM.

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Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6639674
10/14/19 06:53 PM
10/14/19 06:53 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,008
Ohio
S
stinkypete Online content
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Joined: Apr 2010
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Ohio
The promise was. Fight the terrorist Push them back. Bring our troops home. Let the UN be the world police. Trump pushed the Russians out of Syria made them play nice. Let them back in. If people want freedom at some point in there existence they have to fight for themselves. Bring out troops home.

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6640075
10/15/19 05:55 AM
10/15/19 05:55 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,910
SEPA
L
Lugnut Online content
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Lugnut  Online Content
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,910
SEPA
[Linked Image]


Eh...wot?

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: trapperne] #6640434
10/15/19 03:34 PM
10/15/19 03:34 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,104
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
W
walleyed Offline
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Posts: 5,104
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
Originally Posted by trapperne
I heard some place the other day the Kurds have killed something in the neighborhood of 40,000 Turks over a period of time


That's a good start.


Member: New York State Trappers Association,
Oswego County Trappers,
Jefferson Co. Fur Harvesters.

I Support Non-Resident Trapping Nation-Wide

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6640746
10/15/19 10:31 PM
10/15/19 10:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 4,394
Virginia
5
52Carl Offline
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52Carl  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 4,394
Virginia
Someone pick me one faction in Syria or neighboring countries which is trustworthy of anything whatsoever.

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6641984
10/17/19 12:44 PM
10/17/19 12:44 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,910
SEPA
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Lugnut Online content
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Lugnut  Online Content
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VP Pence brokered a cease-fire between Turkey and Syria today. We’ll see how long it lasts.


Eh...wot?

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: Lugnut] #6642022
10/17/19 01:45 PM
10/17/19 01:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,104
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
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walleyed Offline
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Posts: 5,104
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
Originally Posted by Lugnut
VP Pence brokered a cease-fire between Turkey and Syria today. We’ll see how long it lasts.


What needs to happen now is the Kurds, The Syrian Government Forces, and the Russians

need to hit the Turks, and hit them hard and knock their arses back across the border.

Maybe even roll about 50 miles into Turkey, and establish a "Buffer Zone" on Turkey's side of the border.

Turkey started this little border dust-up so they are the aggressors. No need for fellow NATO members

to come to their aid since they started it as they are the bully in the region.

IMHO.

w


Member: New York State Trappers Association,
Oswego County Trappers,
Jefferson Co. Fur Harvesters.

I Support Non-Resident Trapping Nation-Wide

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: 52Carl] #6642026
10/17/19 01:49 PM
10/17/19 01:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 28
Custer Co, Idaho
S
sneaky Offline
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Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 28
Custer Co, Idaho
Originally Posted by 52Carl
Someone pick me one faction in Syria or neighboring countries which is trustworthy of anything whatsoever.

Coptic Christians. They've been reduced from 1.5 million in the late 90s to around 250,000 now. You guys can argue about Armenian genocide from a hundred years ago all you want, it's happening today right under the world's nose. Islam is the trendy religion now, no one wants to offend them, yet they are murdering and displacing Christians at an unprecedented rate. USMC Iraq veteran, Fallujah 04-05, Rutbah 08.


Sometimes nothing can be a real cool hand
Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6642028
10/17/19 01:51 PM
10/17/19 01:51 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,910
SEPA
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Lugnut Online content
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SEPA
That would be a violation of the cease-fire Walleyed.


Eh...wot?

Re: Iraq Veterans...Kurds [Re: J Staton] #6642029
10/17/19 01:51 PM
10/17/19 01:51 PM
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 28
Custer Co, Idaho
S
sneaky Offline
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sneaky  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 28
Custer Co, Idaho
I've been lurking for a while reading the forums, figured I couldn't let y'all have all the fun.


Sometimes nothing can be a real cool hand
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