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AR question #7737926
12/08/22 12:36 PM
12/08/22 12:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Yes sir  Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
I got an AR , palmetto lower , red x upper. 16" stainless slim profile barrel in 5.56 nato. Shots 1.5 groups at a 100yds with the best ammo I've tried on a good day and up to 3 inch groups or more with other good ammo on not so good days. Trigger isn't the best but I can over come that. Can a guy put together a better shooter without spending a bunch of money. Would the same setup shoot better with say a red x heavier and longer barrel? Would like a little better performance for shooting coyotes. Tried about 6 different loads and none of it being the real cheap stuff and none of it being super expensive stuff either.
Where do u think I'm losing the accuracy at? I'm guessing it's the bolt carrier or the barrel...????
Does seem to be quite over gassed ( I'm guessing that's the right term).
I'm not a gunsmith or AR nut so I looking for a simple fix without spending a bunch of money if it's possible. Would like to put together another one with same lower if I could get 1 1/2 groups with a wider range of ammo if possible.

Last edited by Yes sir; 12/08/22 12:45 PM.
Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737931
12/08/22 12:46 PM
12/08/22 12:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 1,497
Louisiana
AirportTrapper Offline
trapper
AirportTrapper  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 1,497
Louisiana
Are you shooting 5.56 or .223 through it? What is your twist rate and bullet weight?


If it makes a track on this earth , I can catch it.
Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737932
12/08/22 12:47 PM
12/08/22 12:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,922
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,922
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
I would try a better trigger.

Even higher priced ARs need the trigger swapped. First thing I did when I bought Daniel Defense weapons.

Re: AR question [Re: AirportTrapper] #7737933
12/08/22 12:47 PM
12/08/22 12:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,922
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,922
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Originally Posted by AirportTrapper
Are you shooting 5.56 or .223 through it? What is your twist rate and bullet weight?


And these are good questions too.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737935
12/08/22 12:48 PM
12/08/22 12:48 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Yes sir  Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Tried both. From 70 grains to 55 grains I believe. The best is with the lighter bullets in 223. 1 in 9 I believe.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737942
12/08/22 12:52 PM
12/08/22 12:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 6,635
Wabash, IN USA
Flipper 56 Offline
trapper
Flipper 56  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 6,635
Wabash, IN USA
I would change barrels if it didn't shoot any better than that. AR stuff is cheap right now. Is this with open sights or are you using a scope, trigger upgrade makes a huge difference as well as optics. Depends on what ranges you will be shooting as to what the 100-yard accuracy needs to be. Replacing the handguard with a free floating one can help too. It's a 1 x 8 twist, what bullet weight are you shooting and is it FMJ ammo?


"Where Can A Man Find Bear Beaver And Other Critters Worth Cash Money When Skinned?"

Re: AR question [Re: Flipper 56] #7737954
12/08/22 01:00 PM
12/08/22 01:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Yes sir  Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Originally Posted by Flipper 56
I would change barrels if it didn't shoot any better than that. AR stuff is cheap right now. Is this with open sights or are you using a scope, trigger upgrade makes a huge difference as well as optics. Depends on what ranges you will be shooting as to what the 100-yard accuracy needs to be. Replacing the handguard with a free floating one can help too. It's a 1 x 8 twist, what bullet weight are you shooting and is it FMJ ammo?

Norma fmj all the others hollow points. Some mid range priced labeled target rounds. Could I expect better accuracy out of a different red x barrel or are they just not up to that quality. What reasonably priced barrels would u recommend. New mid range Athlon scope. Looking fir a 250 yd coyote gun.

Last edited by Yes sir; 12/08/22 01:00 PM.
Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737965
12/08/22 01:12 PM
12/08/22 01:12 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,031
Coldspring Texas
Savell Offline
"Wilbur"
Savell  Offline
"Wilbur"

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,031
Coldspring Texas
... you’ll shoot your eye out kid


Insert profound nonsense here
Re: AR question [Re: Savell] #7737973
12/08/22 01:16 PM
12/08/22 01:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Yes sir  Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Originally Posted by Savell
... you’ll shoot your eye out kid

U only live once just as well go full speed

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737980
12/08/22 01:25 PM
12/08/22 01:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Yes sir  Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Any suggestions on triggers, handguards, barrels or any other components would be appreciated if not too much trouble. Like I said I'm not an AR guru and theirs so many options it's a little confusing. Thanks.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737994
12/08/22 01:34 PM
12/08/22 01:34 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 507
SC Iowa
btomlin Offline
trapper
btomlin  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 507
SC Iowa
I like my 3.5# PSA match drop in trigger. I got the flat version. It was on sale for $80 I think. Made a world of difference to me.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7737997
12/08/22 01:36 PM
12/08/22 01:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
danny clifton  Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
D

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
mine shoots everything put in it good

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.223_Wylde_chamber

[Linked Image]


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7738003
12/08/22 01:41 PM
12/08/22 01:41 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 507
SC Iowa
btomlin Offline
trapper
btomlin  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 507
SC Iowa
^^^my 223wylde 1:8 does as well

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7738010
12/08/22 01:45 PM
12/08/22 01:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 6,635
Wabash, IN USA
Flipper 56 Offline
trapper
Flipper 56  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 6,635
Wabash, IN USA
These triggers are very nice and crisp and easy to install. Full metal ammo is never good for an accuracy test in my opinion. I handload for accuracy with nosler ballistic tips for coyote hunting. You could try some, you might have to do more experimenting to get it sorted out. I have seen barrels that wouldn't shoot no matter what and needed to be used as a draw bar pin on the tractor.
The stock Palmetto triggers pretty much suck and always get replaced or polished and JP springs added.
If you have a friend with an AR that shoots well, put his upper on your lower and see what it does.
Have fun figuring it out and you will learn a lot.
[Linked Image]


"Where Can A Man Find Bear Beaver And Other Critters Worth Cash Money When Skinned?"

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7738041
12/08/22 02:20 PM
12/08/22 02:20 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,042
SE Kansas
K
K52 Offline
trapper
K52  Offline
trapper
K

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,042
SE Kansas
Knew a guy that worked at Sierra several years ago and he said the only reason they made 55 gr. fmj is because that was a best seller for them. He also said it was the least accurate round they made but the public wanted them. He said they can make a much more accurate jacket by drawing it up from the base like their match bullets, rather than the nose for the fmj.

I would look at White Oak Armament for barrels your 1-9 twist is too slow for 70 gr. and Rock River Arms for their 2-stage match trigger.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7738050
12/08/22 02:30 PM
12/08/22 02:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 467
Southeast KY
K
K91773 Offline
trapper
K91773  Offline
trapper
K

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 467
Southeast KY
Does your rifle have a free float handguard on it or does it have a conventional front sight post and snap in handguards, does it have a carbine or mid-length gas system, did you buy it as a complete upper or did you buy a stripped upper and barrel etc. and put it together yourself?

Now realistically barrel length has little to do with accuracy at the ranges you are interested in, but barrel stiffness has a huge part in it, a short heavy barrel has better barrel harmonics (generally speaking) than a slimmer profile barrel or a longer barrel that is not as stiff. Palmetto State Armory has several complete uppers with free float handguards and various profile barrels on sale right now. I have had very good success with a 16" stainless 223 Wylde chambered barrel with free float handguard that I bought with them, it consistently shoots right around 1" with about everything you put in it except for cheap ball ammo which is still about 1.5 inches.

I am a big fan of the Larue triggers, I have other but I like the Larues better than any of them on a general use rifle, they have a smooth light trigger pull that is conductive to good accuracy but are heavy enough that you won't fire them to soon when your fingers are cold and stiff in the winter time.

I am not familiar with the RedX barrels so I can't speak about them.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7738153
12/08/22 04:18 PM
12/08/22 04:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Yes sir  Offline OP
"Callie's little brother"
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,063
Marion Kansas
Mine is actually the light contour not M4 contour and is 1 in 9 twist. I bought the upper complete. Don't believe it's a free floated hand guard.
And thanks everyone for the ideas and suggestions. Much appreciated.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7738176
12/08/22 05:16 PM
12/08/22 05:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 467
Southeast KY
K
K91773 Offline
trapper
K91773  Offline
trapper
K

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 467
Southeast KY
Ok, I went on their website and looked to see what you may have but they don't offer anything currently in a light contour, but most of what they offered did have a free floating fore end. If you could post a picture it might help people help you. But if I was going to rebarrel the upper, I don't think I would go with them there is not enough difference in their price for barrels and those of known quality to make it worth the risk. I would look at the Palmetto State Arms uppers with either a nitride coated barrel, a stainless barrel or one of their premium line barrels. Their uppers really aren't anymore expensive than Red X because they usually include the BCG and charging handle in the published price. There are better barrels out there but these should get you easily into 250 yard coyote gun territory. Also as a side thought have you called Red X and talked to them about it, I suspect they will say that it is within spec at 1.5 inches because they refer heavily to their stuff being mil-spec and the military minimum standard is 4 MOA or at least it used to be.

Re: AR question [Re: Yes sir] #7738180
12/08/22 05:22 PM
12/08/22 05:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 16,261
Iowa
~ADC~ Offline
The Count
~ADC~  Offline
The Count

Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 16,261
Iowa
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/102163288?pid=887715 - I have this trigger. It seems great to me for hunting. I'm not shooting paper.

Re: AR question [Re: Blaine County] #7738183
12/08/22 05:24 PM
12/08/22 05:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4,100
Bonner County, Idaho
Wild_Idaho Offline
trapper
Wild_Idaho  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4,100
Bonner County, Idaho
Originally Posted by Blaine County
I would try a better trigger.

Even higher priced ARs need the trigger swapped. First thing I did when I bought Daniel Defense weapons.


This.


Real name Eric
The sharpest hammer in the box of crayons.

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