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Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: charles] #8508354
11/21/25 11:24 AM
11/21/25 11:24 AM
Joined: May 2019
Saskatchewan
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rvsask Offline
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Saskatchewan
Originally Posted by charles
Do you think our national can wipe out illegal drugs if it was a national priority? I do

Trillions of dollars later and no closer to winning the war on drugs than in the beginning, heck maybe even further away. I'm not sure you can fully stop anything, illegal or not.

Also, it is nice to see some Christians following some of Jesus' teachings. Sometimes I wonder if religion is just a label and often the actions of the religious show that it is. This thread gives hope despite also indicating that it is a label for some..

Last edited by rvsask; 11/21/25 11:26 AM.
Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508384
11/21/25 12:15 PM
11/21/25 12:15 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
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Trapper7 Offline
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MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
Originally Posted by Dan Barnhurst
Who gets to choose what parents they are born to, their birth nation, ethnicity, religion they are taught by their parents, skin, eye and hair color, political biases? What would your life be like if you were born in Africa, Colombia or China or Haiti or Gaza or ---?

How will Christ judge all of us fairly when we are all born and raised in such different circumstances, with different advantages or disadvantages?

I believe all of us on earth are children of a loving God, brothers and sisters. And Christ teaches us we should love one another, even our enemies.

I believe as a nation we must defend our interests around the world, control our borders, and deport illegal aliens, and guard against muslim terrorists and sedition from within.

It's easy to hate an entire class of people that have harmed us or our ancestors and that mean to destroy us. But how does God view it all?

I remember watching a youtube video during Desert Storm. It was taken from the air at night with night vision. Two men in a big truck stopped, got out and retrieved a big shoulder fired rocket launcher from the side of the road. When the tracers from our shells came in from the side totally obliterating the men and the truck, I remember feeling totally thrilled by the efficiency our enemies were killed with.

A few seconds later, I remembered a recent talk in church about us all being children of God, brothers and sisters, and that we should love one another, even our enemies. But it's not easy to love our enemies that want to kill our troops and us. And I thought about it for a long time. What were those two men's childhoods like? How were they taught? If I were born in their shoes would i do any different? I know it was wrong for me to be exhilarated with watching them die. But I know it was the right thing for our military to kill them.

I think we should all step back and think about "There but for the Grace of God go I" once in a while. How would you be any different if you grew up in their shoes?

If the rest of the world felt the way you do, it would be great. Unfortunately, they don't. They have no regard for human life or freedom. Thank goodness we do and will defend those rights.


Got a photo from a speeding camera in the mail. I immediately sent it back - way too expensive and really poor quality.
Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508385
11/21/25 12:16 PM
11/21/25 12:16 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Green County Wisconsin
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
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Joined: Sep 2013
Green County Wisconsin
Originally Posted by Dan Barnhurst
Who gets to choose what parents they are born to, their birth nation, ethnicity, religion they are taught by their parents, skin, eye and hair color, political biases? What would your life be like if you were born in Africa, Colombia or China or Haiti or Gaza or ---?

How will Christ judge all of us fairly when we are all born and raised in such different circumstances, with different advantages or disadvantages?

I believe all of us on earth are children of a loving God, brothers and sisters. And Christ teaches us we should love one another, even our enemies.

I believe as a nation we must defend our interests around the world, control our borders, and deport illegal aliens, and guard against muslim terrorists and sedition from within.

It's easy to hate an entire class of people that have harmed us or our ancestors and that mean to destroy us. But how does God view it all?

I remember watching a youtube video during Desert Storm. It was taken from the air at night with night vision. Two men in a big truck stopped, got out and retrieved a big shoulder fired rocket launcher from the side of the road. When the tracers from our shells came in from the side totally obliterating the men and the truck, I remember feeling totally thrilled by the efficiency our enemies were killed with.

A few seconds later, I remembered a recent talk in church about us all being children of God, brothers and sisters, and that we should love one another, even our enemies. But it's not easy to love our enemies that want to kill our troops and us. And I thought about it for a long time. What were those two men's childhoods like? How were they taught? If I were born in their shoes would i do any different? I know it was wrong for me to be exhilarated with watching them die. But I know it was the right thing for our military to kill them.

I think we should all step back and think about "There but for the Grace of God go I" once in a while. How would you be any different if you grew up in their shoes?



Luke 3:14
Then some soldiers asked him, “And what should we do?” He replied, “Don’t extort money and don’t accuse people falsely—be content with your pay.”

soldiers and cops were sort of the same thing back then but I think that it is rather understanding of you have a job to do , do it well with the least violence needed and don't abuse your power.


I think it is ok to be Yeah , for the safety pf our GI's they took out the threat before it could harm them. but in the next breath maybe you say , and may those two souls rest in peace.

think of the wars of England and France like the 100 years war , they were Christian fighting Christian often over god , seems such a waste , any way Muslim seems so anti Christian and I suppose it is , yet it is the same god of Abraham that we both recognize. again seems such a waste.

deporting people who have come to a country that is not theirs is not wrong so long as it is done fairly and with kindness. also most of the people at least around here that are or were deported were coming directly out of our jails.

putting people in prison or deporting them is not the wrong , how we treat them when we put them in prison or deport them is wrong.
perhaps the reasons they are being deported may be an issue , but if you came to the US committed crimes against citizens deportation seems rather fair.

so it is mixed , like the soldiers asking Jesus what is your advice for us , his response don't abuse your authority , avoid violence when you can.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508387
11/21/25 12:17 PM
11/21/25 12:17 PM
Joined: Feb 2020
Indiana
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Indiana

So its the drug suppliers fault people chose to put drugs in their body? Blow up all the boats kill them on land will not stop the flow. They will adapt as long as there is demand and its profitable. They are just supplying what Americans want. Point your fingers outward becuse its easier to do the fix the problem at home.

I have trouble having any sympathy for drug addicts its self inflicted. I know thats hard for some here that have lost loved ones to drugs and are dealing with addicts now. But the truth is hard facts over ride feelings. I have had addicts in my family its tough. But its self inflicted their choice and we can't control their actions. Ultimately its the addicts driving the drug trade with demand.

Its more complex than we can stop them coming in. No we can't may slow it down temporarily and spike prices. but it won't stop. It will never stop as long as demand is there and money to be made. It will take a combined approach. Stop being soft on crime would be a good start.

The Philippines approach seems successful but the US doesn't have the stomach for it.

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Providence Farm] #8508405
11/21/25 12:53 PM
11/21/25 12:53 PM
Joined: May 2019
Saskatchewan
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Saskatchewan
Originally Posted by Providence Farm

So its the drug suppliers fault people chose to put drugs in their body? Blow up all the boats kill them on land will not stop the flow. They will adapt as long as there is demand and its profitable. They are just supplying what Americans want. Point your fingers outward becuse its easier to do the fix the problem at home.

I have trouble having any sympathy for drug addicts its self inflicted. I know thats hard for some here that have lost loved ones to drugs and are dealing with addicts now. But the truth is hard facts over ride feelings. I have had addicts in my family its tough. But its self inflicted their choice and we can't control their actions. Ultimately its the addicts driving the drug trade with demand.

Its more complex than we can stop them coming in. No we can't may slow it down temporarily and spike prices. but it won't stop. It will never stop as long as demand is there and money to be made. It will take a combined approach. Stop being soft on crime would be a good start.

The Philippines approach seems successful but the US doesn't have the stomach for it.


Very rational and truthful thoughts on the topic.

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: ] #8508407
11/21/25 01:01 PM
11/21/25 01:01 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Iowa
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Iowa
Originally Posted by Savell
Originally Posted by Dan Barnhurst
Are you trying to pick a fight with Jesus Savell, or just some of us sinners that believe in Him, and are trying to be better and live by his commandments? Jesus did not look at sin with the least bit of tolerance, but loved the sinners and provided a path for repentance and forgiveness.


…. Just loving my neighbors and enemies as commanded

… and fighting Jesus would be too easy … as he’d just keep turning the other cheek like glass Joe in Mike Tyson’s punch out

I think Jesus would kick your skinny butt.
One way to find out - Savell vs. Jesus in a pay per view cage match.


American Karens - not a fan
Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: rvsask] #8508422
11/21/25 01:18 PM
11/21/25 01:18 PM
Joined: Dec 2024
AR
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AR
Originally Posted by rvsask
Originally Posted by Providence Farm

So its the drug suppliers fault people chose to put drugs in their body? Blow up all the boats kill them on land will not stop the flow. They will adapt as long as there is demand and its profitable. They are just supplying what Americans want. Point your fingers outward becuse its easier to do the fix the problem at home.

I have trouble having any sympathy for drug addicts its self inflicted. I know thats hard for some here that have lost loved ones to drugs and are dealing with addicts now. But the truth is hard facts over ride feelings. I have had addicts in my family its tough. But its self inflicted their choice and we can't control their actions. Ultimately its the addicts driving the drug trade with demand.

Its more complex than we can stop them coming in. No we can't may slow it down temporarily and spike prices. but it won't stop. It will never stop as long as demand is there and money to be made. It will take a combined approach. Stop being soft on crime would be a good start.

The Philippines approach seems successful but the US doesn't have the stomach for it.


Very rational and truthful thoughts on the topic.

Perverts drive the sex trade, should we not attempt to stop the trafficker's? Even though we know it will never stop since there always be demand and money to be made.

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508448
11/21/25 01:50 PM
11/21/25 01:50 PM
Joined: May 2019
Saskatchewan
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Saskatchewan
Quote
Perverts drive the sex trade, should we not attempt to stop the trafficker's? Even though we know it will never stop since there always be demand and money to be made.

The ? is not should we, it is can we? And yes, it is about time those documents become fully public and all involved are punished, regardless of political affiliation.

Last edited by rvsask; 11/21/25 01:51 PM.
Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508531
11/21/25 05:16 PM
11/21/25 05:16 PM
Joined: Feb 2020
Indiana
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Indiana
J straton Did you miss the multi prong approach part. Also sex trafficking is different its not supplying someone a product they ask for thst may end up destroying them. On the other jhane many successful people also use drugs and dont end up destroyed. Many people you know and would never think would do drugs now and then.



Sex trafficking is actively harming a person for profit and another's individuals sick enjoyment.

Two very different things But you know that and prefer to mak an attempt to invalidate or gloss over my argument.

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508556
11/21/25 06:08 PM
11/21/25 06:08 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
PA
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PA
Addiction is a real thing. Sure, it's self inflicted, but it's no difficult than alcohol addiction, which inflicts a huge percentage of the population and just happens to be legal. I think being a pusher is worse than being an addict.


Right now I’m having amnesia and déjà vu at the same time. I think I’ve forgotten this before.
Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: ] #8508599
11/21/25 07:43 PM
11/21/25 07:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Virginia
5
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Virginia
Originally Posted by Savell
… Dan loves me you heathern!

Finally! Someone spelt 'heathern' right, just like Jesus did in the Bible...

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508610
11/21/25 08:08 PM
11/21/25 08:08 PM
Joined: May 2009
Champaign County, Ohio.
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Champaign County, Ohio.
Jesus is often referred to as the General of Armies. He is pictured as a war leader in both Joshua, where he is foretold and Revelations.

[Linked Image]

Keith

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508621
11/21/25 08:33 PM
11/21/25 08:33 PM
Joined: May 2009
Champaign County, Ohio.
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"And I saw the heaven opened; and behold, a white horse, and he that sat thereon called Faithful and True; and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. And his eyes are a flame of fire, and upon his head are many diadems; and he hath a name written which no one knoweth but he himself. And he is arrayed in a garment sprinkled with blood: and his name is called The Word of God. And the armies which are in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and pure. And out of his mouth proceedeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness of the wrath of God, the Almighty. And he hath on his garment and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS (Rev. 19:11-16 – ASV)."

Keith

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508623
11/21/25 08:38 PM
11/21/25 08:38 PM
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Champaign County, Ohio.
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"13 Now when Joshua was near Jericho, he looked up and saw a man standing in front of him with a drawn sword in his hand. Joshua went up to him and asked, “Are you for us or for our enemies?”

14 “Neither,” he replied, “but as commander of the army of the Lord I have now come.” Then Joshua fell facedown to the ground in reverence, and asked him, “What message does my Lord[a] have for his servant?”

15 The commander of the Lord’s army replied, “Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy.” And Joshua did so."

Keith

Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: yotetrapper30] #8508625
11/21/25 08:42 PM
11/21/25 08:42 PM
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Minnesota
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Minnesota
Originally Posted by yotetrapper30
Originally Posted by PAskinner
Jesus didn't say "love your enemies, except for..." there's no exception clause in there, as much as we would like there to be. "But, God, they did this terrible thing. " God: "Did I stutter?"


Also God:

Proclaim this among the nations: Consecrate for war; stir up the mighty men. Let all the men of war draw near; let them come up.

Amen


NRA and NTA Life Member
www.BackroadsRevised@etsy.com




Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: Dan Barnhurst] #8508626
11/21/25 08:43 PM
11/21/25 08:43 PM
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Minnesota
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Minnesota
"KeithC,
You don't have to hate your enemies as long as you can coldly kill them when the need arises, to protect your people. Many men can't kill without hate, because they run off of emotion, rather than logic, There's a flaw in them that they can't just kill when necessary. Logically they might know killing is the right thing to do, but their emotions reign them in from doing it, unless they can make hate the predominant emotion.

If it's necessary for my people's lives to continue, that someone else must die, I'll kill them without hate, because it's the right thing to do."

Keith
I like it cool


NRA and NTA Life Member
www.BackroadsRevised@etsy.com




Re: There but for the Grace of God go I [Re: PAskinner] #8508661
11/21/25 09:32 PM
11/21/25 09:32 PM
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Indiana
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Indiana
Originally Posted by PAskinner
Addiction is a real thing. Sure, it's self inflicted, but it's no difficult than alcohol addiction, which inflicts a huge percentage of the population and just happens to be legal. I think being a pusher is worse than being an addict.



So your more of an excuse and enabling type? Addiction is known people chose to make the choice but the dealers are the bad guys.

. I suspect if you lived in a 3 rd world country and making a low paying living and not having your family being murdered growing and processing drugs you would be growing and processing the drugs. Or you grew up in the geto and raised to see the dealers as positive roll models you would be a product of your environment.

Your just fine when a Dr is pushing the drugs . The so called opioid epidemic was done by doctors weighting script for them like they were pez dispenser In the 90s and early 2000s.. ..


Alcohol is legal becuse being illegal didnt work and gave birth to the mob. So if you want to make parallels based on history what has making drugs illegal done. The problem is wore than ever after what 2 otr 3 decads of the war on drugs. Cartels are armed and funded like small countries and expanded into human trafficking and more.
.
Drugs have won the war. Time to work a different approach. Maybe start with accountability instead of excuses.

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