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Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228067
03/27/21 09:45 AM
03/27/21 09:45 AM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,872
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
trapper
Law Dog  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,872
Central, SD
I set all MJ traps for K-9s and many for cats for less time spent at the set the one hand setters are the ticket, just lay everything out and kneel once and your done and back in the truck.


Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228073
03/27/21 10:04 AM
03/27/21 10:04 AM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 613
Northern Missouri
Northmocats Offline
trapper
Northmocats  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 613
Northern Missouri
I set bare handed. Catch as many coyotes as I wanna Skin.. You wont beat a K-9 Nose... In and out fast is the best solution. With good bait on location. Short of having Skunk on your hands doesnt matter imo . You think your Gloves dont have any kind of Scent on the Material LOL.

Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228086
03/27/21 10:49 AM
03/27/21 10:49 AM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 60
NE Wyoming
G
grubbie Offline
trapper
grubbie  Offline
trapper
G

Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 60
NE Wyoming
I know most don't use anything and set bare handed. I have as well. Forgot my gloves one day this year and the bare handed sets did just as well as the gloved sets. However, I kind of figure why not try to minimize my scent? I am not paranoid about it but usually wear gloves and I am careful when handling traps when making wax dirt, dipping, waxing, etc.as well. Doesn't cost me any time or extra effort so I just figure why not, sure can't hurt.

Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228187
03/27/21 01:38 PM
03/27/21 01:38 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,587
NC, Orange Co.
QuietButDeadly Offline
trapper
QuietButDeadly  Offline
trapper

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,587
NC, Orange Co.
I use gloves to protect me but I avoid leather gloves. Leather absorbs and holds odor much more than gloves made of other material. I avoid leather boots for the same reason.

I am also a firm believer that most scent contamination around sets that cause refusals is caused by carelessness or folks not thinking about things like wearing the same shoes on the trap line and at the gas station. Every time you fuel up, you are most likely standing where someone has spilled fuel. Wear those same shoes on the line, you stink up the area around the trap. Same with gas nozzles, get gas or diesel smell on your hands and cross contaminate traps.

I do not believe these unnatural scents disburse as quickly as human odor.


Life Member: NCTA, VTA, NTA, TTFHA, MFTI
Member: FTA NRA NWTF
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228280
03/27/21 04:09 PM
03/27/21 04:09 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,454
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline
trapper
TEJAS  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,454
South Texas Brush Country

Originally Posted by Mac
How many guys use a ground cloth when setting for canines in order to cut down on human scent?
How many use gloves for setting canine traps?


I use a tarp and gloves.

A tarp can have a huge impact on your first night catch percentage.

I believe that the amount of pressure coyotes have been under often dictates what you can and can’t get away with as far a scent is concerned. The same applies with sets and smells.

You may be able to throw caution to the wind in an area that’s seen little to no pressure. In some places you might be able to bare hand your traps and set all dirt holes with the same bait or lure at every location. It’s easy to fool the kindergarten class.

Try those same tactics on high pressure ground and you will have created a coyote amusement park with free admission. Sloppy trapping creates educated coyotes.

You often times see trappers scoff at scent control. I’ve noticed that for the most part these folks move from location to location.

Skimming the cream and ADC trapping are two different animals with two different approaches.

I always hear the mantra “coyotes know you have been there”. If that was the case a hound with a much better nose than any coyote would be able to cold trail an animal days after it has passed. The best blood tracking dogs rarely work a trail after 24 hours.

As for the scent issue, I believe a strong human odor presents an immediate danger. A faint odor represents that a threat was in the area, but has long since gone. The strong odor is a red light. A faint odor is a caution light.




Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228301
03/27/21 05:02 PM
03/27/21 05:02 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,940
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County Offline
trapper
Blaine County  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,940
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
It's kind of like deer hunting. When I started I was kind of clueless about scent. I eventually went total paranoid crazy about scent control. I'm now somewhere and realistically in between.

Gloves, kneeling pad, rubber boots and different gloves for bait and lure.

This is an interesting discussion.

Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228361
03/27/21 06:03 PM
03/27/21 06:03 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 6,004
alabama
steeltraps Offline
trapper
steeltraps  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 6,004
alabama
A bllood hound can track a man for Days after a man has passed. Everyone that knows coyotes = Know there is Nothing you can do to keep your scent from them. Now the amount. Thats a different story. Their NOTHING you can so to keep a coyote from nowing you were their. Now. A faint smell. The coyote may tolerate. Hence the drop cloth may help with first night catches

988CEA62-54E4-41B5-ADEA-959269400629.jpeg
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228388
03/27/21 06:27 PM
03/27/21 06:27 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,587
NC, Orange Co.
QuietButDeadly Offline
trapper
QuietButDeadly  Offline
trapper

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,587
NC, Orange Co.
There are some folks in my neck of the woods that find deer a long time after 24 hours even after a hard rain. These dogs do it enough that I would not consider it rare by any means. Every situation is different and 24 hours may be a good rough number but is certainly not absolute.


Life Member: NCTA, VTA, NTA, TTFHA, MFTI
Member: FTA NRA NWTF
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: QuietButDeadly] #7228563
03/27/21 08:38 PM
03/27/21 08:38 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,719
Maine
M
Mac Offline OP
trapper
Mac  Offline OP
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,719
Maine
Really appreciate all the great posts.

Mac



Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228927
03/28/21 09:37 AM
03/28/21 09:37 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,497
PA
P
PAskinner Offline
trapper
PAskinner  Offline
trapper
P

Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,497
PA
I don't claim to be a great coyote trapper, but I do wear gloves when setting. Don't want lure on the trap or the trap bed. Other than that, I don't like to put my knees on the ground cause it's usually wet, so I squat, but that's getting more uncomfortable than it used to be. Some fox are skittish, some aren't. I would like to trap in a real dense population sometime to see if there is a difference. I think the biggest issue for me is traps dirtied by non-target catches. I had a set that caught coon this year dug up multiple times, probably by a grey fox, no matter where I put the trap. I should have put a fresh set in with a fresh trap, but I didn't. And if you think about it, your gloves carry that non-target animal smell onto all your new sets too. Grays love to dig. It's not usually an issue with reds.


Right now I’m having amnesia and déjà vu at the same time. I think I’ve forgotten this before.
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228940
03/28/21 09:55 AM
03/28/21 09:55 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,255
Port Republic South Jersey
N
Newt Offline
trapper
Newt  Offline
trapper
N

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,255
Port Republic South Jersey
Hip boots to keep dry,warmand for briar prection.
Gloves if its cold.But I take them off when setting traps or snares.
In-Out fast as I can. Gloves slow this down.


South Jersey Trapping and Snaring School
January 19-20-21 2024
NEWT -----------------OVER----------------









www.snareone.com
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7228969
03/28/21 10:12 AM
03/28/21 10:12 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,626
Flint, Michigan
bhugo Offline
trapper
bhugo  Offline
trapper

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,626
Flint, Michigan
While it’s true that you can’t avoid human scent contamination, I have found that simply trying to keep other foreign scent like lure or bait off the trap itself is important. That is the best reason to wear gloves. Either wear them when baiting or when planting the trap or different gloves for both. This keeps the focus on the post, hole or wherever you put the scent on purpose and never on the trap. It’s a simple precaution that is not onerous. As usual though, any evidence is purely anecdotal.


Member MTPCA, FTA and NTA
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7229105
03/28/21 01:53 PM
03/28/21 01:53 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,619
Nebraska
WadeRyan Offline
trapper
WadeRyan  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,619
Nebraska
I don't live in an area that's void of humans. Quite the opposite. I don't give scent anymore concern than the color of underwear I put on. Speed and repetition have been the ticket to success for me.

Gloves to keep my hands from getting any worse then they already are in the winter and a pad to keep my knees from screaming. Neither of which are used for scent purposes. I use the same gloves I filled up the gas mower with in the summer.

Last edited by WadeRyan; 03/28/21 01:55 PM.

Follow me on YouTube if you’re bored

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5Ulx1woYMmCN3IPLB0wwFw


Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: QuietButDeadly] #7229590
03/28/21 10:31 PM
03/28/21 10:31 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,454
South Texas Brush Country
TEJAS Offline
trapper
TEJAS  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,454
South Texas Brush Country

Originally Posted by QuietButDeadly
There are some folks in my neck of the woods that find deer a long time after 24 hours even after a hard rain. These dogs do it enough that I would not consider it rare by any means. Every situation is different and 24 hours may be a good rough number but is certainly not absolute.


That’s interesting QBD.

I know a couple of South Texas houndsmen that are as good as they get around these parts. They run between sixty to one hundred tracks each during a season.
I draw my conclusions from their expert opinions on canines and scent. There is a lot a coyote trapper can learn from these folks.

Just this morning I happened to speak with one of those men. He said he has only run a few tracks twenty-four hours or more. He went on to say for the most part he avoids taking up any trail over twenty-four hours. This year his top dog was successful on a trail that was 36 hours old. That is his oldest track to date. To give you an idea of the dog’s credentials, the owner was recently offered 30K for the hound and turned it down.

The point being, if a good hound often struggles with a blood trail outside twenty-four hours, then a coyote with less scenting capabilities is not likely to pick up on human scent within a smaller time frame.



Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7229702
03/29/21 01:41 AM
03/29/21 01:41 AM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,469
Idaho
B
bearcat2 Offline
trapper
bearcat2  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,469
Idaho
Tejas,
I am a houndman and I can tell you it all depends on conditions. I've seen when they couldn't trail an hour old track, and other times when conditions were right I've seen them sail out of there on a two day old track like it was red hot. But if you talk to those houndmen they will tell you that a good cold nosed dog will be able to smell places where the animal has been, particularly where they peed or laid up for days oftentimes. They can't trail it, the scent of the track itself has long since faded, but where the cat peed on a bush or laid up they can still smell. Same will go for coyotes, wolves, or I'm assuming fox. Here I notice that canines don't tend to be too bothered by human scent on the logging roads, but if you get off them much they get a lot more leery. I wear gloves for scent when setting canine traps, and use other gloves for lure or bait. I'm not too anal about scent, and wear leather boots, same ones I drive with and fill up at the gas station, etc. But they are trotting down my snowmobile trail, fourwheeler tracks, or truck tracks, they expect to smell those smells there. I'm not as fast as I should be setting traps, but I believe spending less time at a set is probably more helpful than trying to be scentfree and spending more time there. Still thin skintight gloves don't slow me down much and I'm sure help with scent. I'm not going to keep them from knowing tI was there the first couple nights, but I'd rather they didn't smell any stronger scent where the trap is than other places, or have scent linger on the trap while it has dissapated everywhere else.
Frankly wolves and coyotes both may not be back around for quite a while, a week or two for coyotes and possibly a month for wolves, so it is probably a lot more important to keep from reapplying human scent every trap check than it is to try and be scentfree when you set them.

And it depends on the type of human scent also. Heck I use my own urine to freshen up pee posts for wolves at times, and then think how it might be asinine that I make sure and use clean gloves when setting the trap, but again I don't want them to smell the trap itself, they should be smelling the attractant whether it be bait, lure or urine, not sniffing and paying attention to the trap bed.

Last edited by bearcat2; 03/29/21 01:43 AM.
Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: bearcat2] #7229729
03/29/21 05:50 AM
03/29/21 05:50 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,719
Maine
M
Mac Offline OP
trapper
Mac  Offline OP
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,719
Maine
Again, I must say a lot of good trappers have taken time to share their thoughts, and I appreciate it.
Very interesting to hear some of these trappers share information about hounds and trailing.
Very good information.
Thanks

Mac



Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7229787
03/29/21 08:40 AM
03/29/21 08:40 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,591
SW Pa
B
Bob Jameson Offline
trapper
Bob Jameson  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,591
SW Pa
i use whatever I have no real precautions on what smell I leave behind. Leather gloves, sometimes insulated sometimes not.

Bare hands at times in nice weather, wear gloves for keeping my hands from getting wet and too beat up over several months. Fingers get real sore at times from cracking so try to keep them in good shape.

I wear slip on rubber boots mainly in the later part of the season to keep my feet and legs somewhat dry. Dry weather short Gore-Tex hiker type boots when the weather is still mild. They are more comfortable then rubber boots.

Always have used some type of kneeling for comfort and knee protection.

Never worried about odor much except on equipment/traps and transfer contamination of lure and bait on things that could cause issues for you.

Years ago I think all of us old timers were ingrained with human odor paranoia until we learned it didn't matter much in most cases..

Many times I have had to relieve myself in the field. Just walked a piece away to a clear spot to keep from squatting on something uncomfortable and went about my business as usual. Caught fox, coyotes and cats at every such location. I took note of these spots to see what if any effect it would have on my catch. No worries.. Not a good idea to be too close to your catch circle. smile

Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7229926
03/29/21 01:22 PM
03/29/21 01:22 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,842
Northern Illinois
M
MChewk Offline
trapper
MChewk  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,842
Northern Illinois
I’d like to throw a question out for the guys that wear gloves. Are you using the same gloves for setting new sets out as you use for remakes? Think about that for a second regarding odors. That should also be considered regarding boots ....are you changing your boots when you’re making a fresh set AFTER you’ve just made a remake set. I like using a setting cloth/canvas but that can be also considered in my above questions....do you use a different setting cloth/canvas for remakes vs new sets? What about a skunk catch? We can drive ourselves crazy thinking about trying to stay scent free...

Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: Mac] #7229940
03/29/21 01:52 PM
03/29/21 01:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,104
Ks
Flint Hill fur Offline
trapper
Flint Hill fur  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,104
Ks
That's what drove me to just not worry about it mchewk. Mho rather than take any extra time trying to please myself im doing everything possible to reduce scent an use that time for extra sets. More sets equal more fur! No matter how careful each was set made.

Re: Canines, how careful do you need to be [Re: MChewk] #7229942
03/29/21 01:56 PM
03/29/21 01:56 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,587
NC, Orange Co.
QuietButDeadly Offline
trapper
QuietButDeadly  Offline
trapper

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,587
NC, Orange Co.
Originally Posted by MChewk
I’d like to throw a question out for the guys that wear gloves. Are you using the same gloves for setting new sets out as you use for remakes? Think about that for a second regarding odors. That should also be considered regarding boots ....are you changing your boots when you’re making a fresh set AFTER you’ve just made a remake set. I like using a setting cloth/canvas but that can be also considered in my above questions....do you use a different setting cloth/canvas for remakes vs new sets? What about a skunk catch? We can drive ourselves crazy thinking about trying to stay scent free...


I definitely agree with the part in bold.

The rest, I do not pay much attention to. New sets or remakes done the same way for me, same gloves, same tools, same pad, same shoes, etc..... And I firmly believe that a skunk catch improves the odds of catching a canine or cat.


Life Member: NCTA, VTA, NTA, TTFHA, MFTI
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