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Re: Young cedars
[Re: run]
#7695221
10/18/22 07:12 PM
10/18/22 07:12 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Central Wisconsin
Craig S.
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jun 2009
Central Wisconsin
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I got the distinct feeling that we are talking about 2 different species of cedar. We have red cedar in my neighborhood. Nastiest weed tree on the planet so bad paper mills won't take it for pulp. I don't know much about white cedar. Somehow I think there's a difference. Just my 2 cents. Yes you are correct- two different trees entirely . northern white cedar is “arborvitae “ in Latin which translated to “ tree of life” . The needles of white cedar are high in vitamin c. Its said that is got its name tree of life as sailors who had went many months without fresh vegetables or fruits were able to boil a tea from the needles and save themselves from scurvy which is a disease caused by a lack of vitamin C. Eastern red cedar or “juniperis americanus “ and is altogether different from northern white cedar and western red cedar . It is actually a member of the juniper family and is not a true member of the cedar family in spite of its common name. Eastern Red cedar is considered a nuisance in the west as it is a moisture hog that outcompetes native grasses and can quickly take over pasture lands .
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: AJE]
#7695228
10/18/22 07:21 PM
10/18/22 07:21 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Central Wisconsin
Craig S.
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jun 2009
Central Wisconsin
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Well I looked it up and I stand corrected- what I meant to say above was arborvitae is another common name for Northern white cedar. The Latin or scientific name is actually “thuja occidentalis” And the scientific name for Eastern red cedar is juniperis Virginiana… two different species none the less. Dang I guess my memory ain’t quite what it once was.. 
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: AJE]
#7695378
10/18/22 09:37 PM
10/18/22 09:37 PM
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Joined: Feb 2012
SE NEBRASKA
NebrCatMan
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Feb 2012
SE NEBRASKA
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Here in my neck of the woods in SE Nebraska back in the late 1800s and very early 1900s the area my grandparents homesteaded was pretty void of eastern red cedar. So much as that my Grandpa and his brother in law drove a Model T truck.......(a 1917 model..., maybe wrong year) about 100 to 140 miles east and would get a truck load of cerdar seedlings out of the hills along the Missouri River. Came back and planted windbreaks and fence lines. Kinda cool Grandpa would tell me the story. Fast forward now 120 years. Red Cedar CAN be a noxious weed as it takes over pastures and anywhere else it grows and turns them into non producing junk acres. It's a constant fight trying to clear and keep clean pastures and fence lines, waterways, etc. They can be a good thing and can be just the opposite !!
Remember "Forbidden Fruit makes many Jams" NTA NRA RMEF NFH Born Again Believer
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: DWC]
#7695426
10/18/22 10:10 PM
10/18/22 10:10 PM
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Joined: Sep 2010
NC, Person Co.
QuietButDeadly
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Sep 2010
NC, Person Co.
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They used to pay farmers to remove them around here. Some giant scissors that attached to the front of a bobcat can take out a lot in a hurry. The place I turkey hunt in NE has had 1000’s taken out. Makes it easier to see the birds but also killed the sneak for us. Used to be able to sneak up on a strutter with some wind to cover you as you can get away with a ton of movement. Making a turkey to gobble from a few feet is a rush. The prairie pastures where I turkey hunted in NE had lots of cedars of all sizes. Not sure they are eastern reds though. Those trees had limbs starting at ground level and they were the longest with the next limbs shorter so the tree was shaped like a cone. They were great cover for us to be able to move on birds when we needed to. But the farmer clipped all the bigger ones with a bobcat and eventually piled and burned them. We helped with the little ones, chopping them off at ground level when we were out there turkey hunting. As long as they were less than an inch in diameter, they were fairly easy to deal with and they would not come back from the root. But the birds kept spreading seed from the mature trees in the big windbreak so it was a never ending job. And the folks that manage public land in NE and KS have cleared many acres of these invasive cedars over the years that we have hunted out there. Here is what we call an eastern red cedar and it is not the same as what we saw in NE and KS. ![[Linked Image]](https://trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2022/10/full-17165-154106-cedar.png)
Life Member: NCTA, VTA, NTA, TTFHA, MFTI
Member: FTA
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: run]
#7695524
10/18/22 11:37 PM
10/18/22 11:37 PM
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Joined: Jan 2016
WI - Wisconsin
AJE
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Jan 2016
WI - Wisconsin
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I got the distinct feeling that we are talking about 2 different species of cedar. We have red cedar in my neighborhood. Nastiest weed tree on the planet so bad paper mills won't take it for pulp. I don't know much about white cedar. Somehow I think there's a difference. Just my 2 cents. The cedar around here is prized, but hard to find. I think it's red cedar. They are so hard to grow that I think part of the reason people find them so neat is b/c of how rare they are. I'd say it might be a stretch to say that 1% of them survive the deer.
Last edited by AJE; 10/18/22 11:45 PM.
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: AJE]
#7696916
10/20/22 08:59 PM
10/20/22 08:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Greene County,Virginia
run
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2013
Greene County,Virginia
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Traditionally farmers in Virginia, at least in my area used locust posts for fencing. I am not sure our cedar grow big enough to make good fence posts. They look a bit sickly and they grow in acidic soil that has been neglected. I'm simply sharing my 2 cents not an authority by any stretch. I wish the deer would eat them up. The only use I have found is grinding them for poultry bedding. Carry on, I have enjoyed this thread so far.
wanna be goat farmer.
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: AJE]
#7696923
10/20/22 09:03 PM
10/20/22 09:03 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Greene County,Virginia
run
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2013
Greene County,Virginia
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I get confused when I read the Bible and it talks about the cedars of Lebanon. I think this juniper / eastern red cedar doesn't even make good firewood. The branches are so tight together, you waste a lot of time delimbing it.
wanna be goat farmer.
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: run]
#7698368
10/23/22 02:09 AM
10/23/22 02:09 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Southern Virginia, 50 yr old
VaBeagler
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2008
Southern Virginia, 50 yr old
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I got the distinct feeling that we are talking about 2 different species of cedar. We have red cedar in my neighborhood. Nastiest weed tree on the planet so bad paper mills won't take it for pulp. I don't know much about white cedar. Somehow I think there's a difference. Just my 2 cents. You are spot on. Red cedar here in southern virginia. Grows like a weed in crappy land unless you let it grow for 25 years for a fence post. Worthless.
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: run]
#7698369
10/23/22 02:11 AM
10/23/22 02:11 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Southern Virginia, 50 yr old
VaBeagler
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2008
Southern Virginia, 50 yr old
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I get confused when I read the Bible and it talks about the cedars of Lebanon. I think this juniper / eastern red cedar doesn't even make good firewood. The branches are so tight together, you waste a lot of time delimbing it. Our juniper is a ground running cedar that stays short but runs wide.
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: ozark trapper ia]
#7701743
10/27/22 01:18 AM
10/27/22 01:18 AM
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Joined: Jan 2016
WI - Wisconsin
AJE
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Jan 2016
WI - Wisconsin
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Red cedars .. They are great trees for wildlife in small patches scattered around. this seems to be what I've been observing on my property
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: QuietButDeadly]
#7707303
11/02/22 09:56 PM
11/02/22 09:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
MN
160user
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
MN
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They used to pay farmers to remove them around here. Some giant scissors that attached to the front of a bobcat can take out a lot in a hurry. The place I turkey hunt in NE has had 1000’s taken out. Makes it easier to see the birds but also killed the sneak for us. Used to be able to sneak up on a strutter with some wind to cover you as you can get away with a ton of movement. Making a turkey to gobble from a few feet is a rush. The prairie pastures where I turkey hunted in NE had lots of cedars of all sizes. Not sure they are eastern reds though. Those trees had limbs starting at ground level and they were the longest with the next limbs shorter so the tree was shaped like a cone. They were great cover for us to be able to move on birds when we needed to. But the farmer clipped all the bigger ones with a bobcat and eventually piled and burned them. We helped with the little ones, chopping them off at ground level when we were out there turkey hunting. As long as they were less than an inch in diameter, they were fairly easy to deal with and they would not come back from the root. But the birds kept spreading seed from the mature trees in the big windbreak so it was a never ending job. And the folks that manage public land in NE and KS have cleared many acres of these invasive cedars over the years that we have hunted out there. Here is what we call an eastern red cedar and it is not the same as what we saw in NE and KS. That appears to be a Western Red Cedar, a member of the Juniper family. The Eastern White Cedar is completely different and with the exception of idiots like me that raise, plant and fence them will be extinct where I like in 25 years. They are critical whitetail deer winter habitat and make BEAUTIFUL lumber that lasts forever. I have 100's of hours raising, planting and caging them.
I have nothing clever to put here.
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: VaBeagler]
#7707314
11/02/22 10:06 PM
11/02/22 10:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
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If you have cedars that is a sure Tell sign of shitty land. Land will not perk. Cedars thrive in pipeclay and crappy land Not so. While they do thrive on clay and alkaline soils that is because those soils often lie over impermeable chalk. But impermeable chalk can also promote deeper black muck prairie soils such as the black belt of Alabama that made cotton king. The difference between the two is fire. Fire burns off the cedar and builds soil. Take away fire and the soil degrades and cedar takes over.
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Re: Young cedars
[Re: run]
#7707320
11/02/22 10:14 PM
11/02/22 10:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
warrior
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Georgia
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I get confused when I read the Bible and it talks about the cedars of Lebanon. I think this juniper / eastern red cedar doesn't even make good firewood. The branches are so tight together, you waste a lot of time delimbing it. There are a wide range of conifers called cedar that are not true cedars, including both our white and red cedars. Neither of which are related to each other. Red cedar, the eastern one is a juniper and also unrelated to our western red cedar which is also not a true cedar. And you are correct eastern red is poor firewood though it does burn extremely well. It burns hot and fast.
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![[Linked Image]](8a3gq5-1.jpg)
