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Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: IWM] #8644084
08/01/26 11:24 PM
08/01/26 11:24 PM
Joined: Sep 2016
MB
J
Jurassic Park Offline
trapper
Jurassic Park  Offline
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J

Joined: Sep 2016
MB
Originally Posted by IWM
SW,

Re-read my post...I said our research showed as much as a 60% contribution by the doe...50/50 is already understood.

I see you are an expert at trophy antler production as well as CWD in whitetails...I can tell by the pics of the bucks you post:)

Disregarding my 45 years as a deer biologist, I yield to your self-anointed expertise.




Yup.

Swamp Wolf, stay in your lane.


Cold as ice!

Clique non-member

100% Manly
Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644140
Yesterday at 08:31 AM
Yesterday at 08:31 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
MD
D
DaveP Offline
trapper
DaveP  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2007
MD
Have never really had decent browtines here.
And the little they have, are often busted off by gun season.

Been crazy dry here until about 2 weeks ago.

Been having up to.11 popping out together in a stunted corn.field most evenings


[Linked Image]

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644142
Yesterday at 08:38 AM
Yesterday at 08:38 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Pa
W
Wright Brothers Offline
trapper
Wright Brothers  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Dec 2006
Pa
How much are these trophies worth?
Tricky business, be careful.





Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644147
Yesterday at 08:59 AM
Yesterday at 08:59 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Rodney,Ohio
SNIPERBBB Offline
trapper
SNIPERBBB  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Rodney,Ohio
Sometimes you just have odd balls..if everything else is more or less the same, nothing wrong with the odd ball.



Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644151
Yesterday at 09:10 AM
Yesterday at 09:10 AM
Joined: Mar 2023
WI
WI Outdoors Offline
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WI Outdoors  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2023
WI
Look at the huge freak deer in the pens. You can give wild deer the same food, they won't become freaks. Genetics is key.

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: IWM] #8644185
Yesterday at 10:47 AM
Yesterday at 10:47 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Swamp Wolf Online happy
trapper
Swamp Wolf  Online Happy
trapper

Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Originally Posted by IWM
SW,

Re-read my post...I said our research showed as much as a 60% contribution by the doe...50/50 is already understood.

I see you are an expert at trophy antler production as well as CWD in whitetails...I can tell by the pics of the bucks you post:)

Disregarding my 45 years as a deer biologist, I yield to your self-anointed expertise.




IWM,

My experience is nearly all field level, hands-on from a 62 year lifespan in the deer woods of southern Georgia. I have only an associates degree in wildlife management from what was back then a junior college. Worked 27 years for Georgia DNR and have learned from what I saw and experienced from hundreds of properties, habitat types, and hunter interactions. I remain involved as a CWD sample collection contractor for the southern part of Georgia and on the statewide deer management planning committee.

I didn't learn what I know about whitetails from reading peer reviewed studies in the Wildlife Society's Journal.

My neck of the woods here along the Georgia-Florida line don't produce bucks like most parts of Texas, but the way to get bucks close to their potential remains the same. I'm no expert and don't claim to be just because I post pics of aa few bucks and post facts about CWD. It's not something I read and then repeated on an internet forum.


Thank God For Your Blessings!
Taste Your Words Before You Spit Them Out!

Resource Protection Service

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: Jurassic Park] #8644186
Yesterday at 10:50 AM
Yesterday at 10:50 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Swamp Wolf Online happy
trapper
Swamp Wolf  Online Happy
trapper

Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Originally Posted by Jurassic Park
Originally Posted by IWM
SW,

Re-read my post...I said our research showed as much as a 60% contribution by the doe...50/50 is already understood.

I see you are an expert at trophy antler production as well as CWD in whitetails...I can tell by the pics of the bucks you post:)

Disregarding my 45 years as a deer biologist, I yield to your self-anointed expertise.




Yup.

Swamp Wolf, stay in your lane.

Go mount a deer head.

From what you've posted in the past....your taxidermy is much better than your "selfie-posting, in the deer stand" hunting skills.


Thank God For Your Blessings!
Taste Your Words Before You Spit Them Out!

Resource Protection Service

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: jbyrd63] #8644188
Yesterday at 10:56 AM
Yesterday at 10:56 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Swamp Wolf Online happy
trapper
Swamp Wolf  Online Happy
trapper

Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Originally Posted by jbyrd63
one thing I believe in that can hurt antler growth is drought. Bucks around here have less mass across the board. Don't get started about EHD during those years .Lived it seen it... Plus age lets the buck get to his potential, but when he's 2.5 and a basket 8 he's still spreading his genes around. 2.5 year old bucks do most of the breeding . First more of them.. Second a mature deer will lock down on one doe while the teenagers are doing the nasty everywhere they can..

This^^^ I've noted many times over the years here in south Ga.


Thank God For Your Blessings!
Taste Your Words Before You Spit Them Out!

Resource Protection Service

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: Yes sir] #8644190
Yesterday at 10:59 AM
Yesterday at 10:59 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Swamp Wolf Online happy
trapper
Swamp Wolf  Online Happy
trapper

Joined: Apr 2009
South Ga - Almost Florida
Originally Posted by Yes sir

Age, genetics and good nutrition is what makes big antlers
I dont believe you can manage genetics in free range deer
Biggest thing most bucks lack is age
Most of the time when people think they are managing for big buck they think the nutrition they are providing for the deer is really helping but whats helping the most is they just stop shooting young bucks
Around here most of the time when someone kills a "management" buck it just means they didn't want to or couldn't hold out for a bigger buck.


Works like this^^^^ in Georgia, too.


Thank God For Your Blessings!
Taste Your Words Before You Spit Them Out!

Resource Protection Service

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644213
Yesterday at 12:51 PM
Yesterday at 12:51 PM
Joined: Sep 2012
Perry, NY
D
Dana I Offline
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Dana I  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2012
Perry, NY
Swamp Wolf,

My background, lifetime livestock farmer, Wildlife management major in college.

If you want to improve a herd, you do it by controlling whatever factors you can. The easiest way to do that in a wild population would be to control the bucks as that is the only factor that you can meaningfully assess. Even if the doe (which we have limited info on) has inferior genetics, breeding her to a superior quality buck will likely result in the offspring being better than her genetically. Over time this results in improving genetics in both the doe and buck populations. Would it be as productive as breeding the best bucks to the best does and culling the inferior ones? NO, but we have no way of doing that, do we. Your suggestion is basically saying its too hard so we will do nothing and complain about the results.

Its easier on the farm because we often know what we are working for on both ends but, guess what? We typically work with what we have, which means the cows we have get bred. Even the mediocre ones. then we bring in superior genetics on the sires side. Its no different as far as the strategy goes but easier because we have control over the whole population.

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644217
Yesterday at 01:04 PM
Yesterday at 01:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline
trapper
Yes sir  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
[Linked Image]

Im waiting to see these genetics show up again. What do you think the changes are of it happening again. His sire likely passed his genes on several times, his dam likely did also and he likely did too.

15" brow tine

Last edited by Yes sir; Yesterday at 01:05 PM.
Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644218
Yesterday at 01:06 PM
Yesterday at 01:06 PM
Joined: Jun 2026
Texas
ColdspringKidd Offline
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ColdspringKidd  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2026
Texas
[Linked Image]

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644219
Yesterday at 01:07 PM
Yesterday at 01:07 PM
Joined: Jul 2026
Ontario
S
Soap Offline
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Soap  Offline
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S

Joined: Jul 2026
Ontario
Too late

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644220
Yesterday at 01:09 PM
Yesterday at 01:09 PM
Joined: May 2019
Saskatchewan
R
rvsask Offline
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Joined: May 2019
Saskatchewan
Genetics……. For brow tines.

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644221
Yesterday at 01:12 PM
Yesterday at 01:12 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline
trapper
Yes sir  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Here's a good example of what a few years can change to a deer. In the first pic this deer would be a cull buck around here, large body, getting mature but a very small basket rack for his age. Me and the boys actually joked about it having such a small rack compared to his body size. Then a couple years later all of yes would be tickled to tag it.

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644223
Yesterday at 01:17 PM
Yesterday at 01:17 PM
Joined: Jul 2026
Ontario
S
Soap Offline
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Soap  Offline
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S

Joined: Jul 2026
Ontario
[Linked Image]
Genetics

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644229
Yesterday at 01:47 PM
Yesterday at 01:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Iowa
T
trapdog1 Offline
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trapdog1  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2015
Iowa
Guess I've never thought about genetics. Weather or not its in range is as deep as my thought process goes!


American Karens - not a fan
Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: trapdog1] #8644233
Yesterday at 02:06 PM
Yesterday at 02:06 PM
Joined: Sep 2012
Perry, NY
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Dana I Offline
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Dana I  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2012
Perry, NY
Originally Posted by trapdog1
Guess I've never thought about genetics. Weather or not its in range is as deep as my thought process goes!



There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. If that meets your goals and expectations that's great. That is how I mostly am. The thing that boggles my mind are the guys that preach about improving the herd but then only want to shoot the biggest bucks they can find. They are actively sabotaging their own stated goals. Genetics is the building block behind everything, nutrition, weather, predation, age, stress ect all impact growth and quality, but without genetics nothing is there for those factors to impact.

Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: Dana I] #8644234
Yesterday at 02:10 PM
Yesterday at 02:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline
trapper
Yes sir  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Originally Posted by Dana I
Originally Posted by trapdog1
Guess I've never thought about genetics. Weather or not its in range is as deep as my thought process goes!



There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. If that meets your goals and expectations that's great. That is how I mostly am. The thing that boggles my mind are the guys that preach about improving the herd but then only want to shoot the biggest bucks they can find. They are actively sabotaging their own stated goals. Genetics is the building block behind everything, nutrition, weather, predation, age, stress ect all impact growth and quality, but without genetics nothing is there for those factors to impact.

I have no ethical problems shooting the biggest buck i find but I do have a problem with guys that complaining about not enough mature bucks then shootinh young bucks.

Last edited by Yes sir; Yesterday at 02:12 PM.
Re: Brow tines, Nutrition or Genetics [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8644236
Yesterday at 02:16 PM
Yesterday at 02:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline
trapper
Yes sir  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Marion Kansas
From a nutrition standpoint, around here I think late winter is more impactful on antler growth than summer. Even in dryer summers we usually have plenty enough high quality forage for deer. But ive definitely seen bucks wear themselves down enough during rut then have a somewhat tougher winter and it effecting their antlers the next year.

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