Hey not looking to get into a long discussion on politics but looking for some on the ground feedback. What's going on with the farmers in certain areas talking about losing there farms? Only get snippets of information about the American farming community in Canada.

This new or just normal get big or get out economics?

Once you get big enough to climb up over that threshold "too big to fail" you can't fail. The check from Uncle Sam is the mail. Cheap food is vote power!

Another part is government picked winners. To produce a gallon of milk 5 years ago was $6 to 10$ a gallon. But it $2 at the store. Government subsidiary to the big guys and that prices the little guys out of the industry. To get even more control the small farmers that developed direct to customer markets willing to pay $10 to 12$ a gallon the government steps in and says no you can't to that either your not government inspected in the name of saf that's been made illegal.

You know because the government knows best and the big factory farm is going to be clearer than the mom a d pop farm you can come visit and is feefmdint their own family out of what you are buying from them. Sure there will be some low class places but that's up to the customers to decide where to shop and what to feed their family.

It's not the government job to pick where you shop or eat.

Factory and big grain farms can not exist without added hormones, added antibiotics and chemicals.If you want that in your food, That is up to the customer to decide also.

and why people are willing to sign up and preorder willing to pay me $5 a lb last year for pasture raised chickens so $20-$28 per whole processed bird when they can get a whole cooked bird for around 8 at the store.

Still have some government bs. For example because I'm not a licensed processor I can't part out/ cut up my birds for my customers. I have limits on where I can sell them from. Delivery and directly off the farm and farmers markets are it. I can't sell to small local restaurants that. are expensive selling only locally sourced and grown food purchases from local farmers.

I can sell 20,000 birds from the farm and be fine but if I sell 20,001 I would have issues. Now I'm not selling obverse 500 so this is not an issue for me. If I even had a market half that I would not be working off the farm I would not have time or need to.

There's no way its costing that much to produce a Gallon of milk.

Some Farmers have gotten THEMSELVES into trouble. Equipment was going up in value so fast guys were buying all new equipment in the spring, 0% down, 0 payments for 6 months, they were then able to trade that equipment in at the end of the year for basically what they paid, they were essentially getting free leases and operating loans were 4%. Suddenly they went to trade in equipment now financed at 7%+ and found out they were going to be hundreds of thousands in the red on a single combine. Operating loans also went up to 7-8%. Suddenly their on the hook for Tens of Thousands of dollars in interest PER MONTH and grain prices fell from near all time highs to a more long term average. Everyone HATES taxes but farmers seem to hate them to the point they'll go broke to not pay them. When grain was high and operating cost lower they spent money like cowboys in a whorehouse, new bins, new buildings, etc. They should have enough to not bother with operating loans but they were to busy trying to outbid their neighbor on land that wouldn't cash flow at $10 bushel corn now its sitting at or under $5.

Locally many people who had cattle tore down the fencing and plowed the pastures when corn was up and cattle was down, now it's the opposite and it's to much money and work to rebuild the fences and they don't want cows, they killed their Cash Cow and now have no diversity on the farm.

Some of my Frugal neighbors bought a couple new used pieces of equipment, continued to work on the old stuff, didn't buy land that couldn't cash flow and I hope they end up in positron to take full advantage of others foolishness.

In the 80's there was a federal government buyout of dairy farms due to over-supply of milk. It was a bid-offer program. Some of the neighbors submitted outrageous offers, but the government accepted them all because only a small portion of the dairies submitted offers (like the current government employee buyout; not as many accepting as was hoped). The dairies were paid not to produce milk and were making more than the dairies still milking.
It goes all the way back to the Nixon days. A decision was made that big ag was more dependable and productive than small ag and if subsidies (government intervention) were needed to sustain that, then so be it. Abundant, cheap food supply was the goal. However, even before Nixon's ag policies, the American farmer has struggled for a century. There were huge numbers of small farmers leaving the farms in the 50's and 60's. Their farms were often bought up by other farmers at bargain prices. Markets, weather, bad decisions on slim margins, diseases, sometimes regulations, equipment prices relative to production; farming is a tough business.

I live in farm country. Many of the family farms have gone out of business because of the corporate farms. One corporate farm near me milks 1700 cows daily.

Taxes are going up in Illinois. Every year Ag land goes up 10% per year per acre. I'm on the Peoria County Ag Land Tax Assessment Review Committee - so I know this. I'm a director for the Peoria County Farm Bureau and represent Kickapoo Township. I am in charge of all Peoria County Farm Bureau Property and Ag in the Classroom that reaches 65,000 kids a year in our county.
Cost are going up like everything else.
Regular property tax is going up too- my house and the land it sets on went up 26% last year. Farmers have a lot of land and they pay a lot of tax.
This is why farmers are pulling out hedge rows and farming ditch to ditch. They have to. As a Farmer in Central Illinois I do not spend money like a ''cowboy in a whorehouse''. I cannot make enough to live on my farm due to paying so much on taxes. The last Dairy farm in Peoria County just stopped selling milk to the commercial dairy that picked it up from the farm. They sold all but 20 cattle and are now selling shares of cattle and selling milk for $10 a gallon. It does cost a lot - go buy some cows and a farm and equipment and then milk twice a day. I grew up working on a dairy farm so I know this. Feed the cows all year. I also make and sell hay so know this first hand also.
I get 3 or 4 calls and texts a month telling me my place is just what the realtor is looking for. Some of them sound pretty good to me. Why should I work all week and then bust my butt on the farm so someone driving by in his 80 thousand dollar pick up can say I'm a rich farmer?
Most of my equipment is more than 50 years old. I'm fencing in part of my deer woods for pasture this spring. I am using hedge posts I cut myself and buying fence for about $3,000.00. I am clearing the way for the posts right now- all on my own time by myself. I have a tractor and 25 year old skid steer. I am cutting each post myself, putting them in the ground, then putting up the woven wire alone and stretching alone with my tractor. I'm hoping to raise 6 more calves on this new pasture. Farming is not an income most years. It's close to half an income most years.
I make and sell hay, calves, chickens and guineas and eggs, fallow deer, and we have a market garden. I sell firewood and posts and timber too. You have to do it all - all the time to make enough to have a farm unless you are independently wealthy.
Last night I got our local Illinois Farm Bureau paper. On the front page there's an article titled '' Is farming worth it''. I haven't read it yet. Hoping to tomorrow night during the snow storm

PS. Sometimes when you see a new bin or building you have to realize that it might be also due to taxes. In business if you are going to have to pay a large amount of tax - you may be able to take advantage of the law as it is written and pay for a bin or building or equipment to offset the tax liability. Knowing the tax code and doing those thins can help you. Knowing the rules for your area and knowing how to get around some of them legally can be the difference between making it or losing it. Like our dairy farmer friend selling his raw milk for $10.00 a gallon. A lot of people are signing up for raw milk. He's the only one doing it. Maybe it will help him out. Time will tell.

My statements were general statements that don't apply to everyone. I've heard Illinois is pricing out farms due to taxes which is a shame. It just seems like the guys who are complaining the loudest are the ones who've made some really bad decisions when times were good and are completely caught off guard when things tightened up. I farm 280 acres, I often also wonder "is this worth it".

Are you talking in South Africa where the crooked government is stealing white Africans farms?

Donner- check this out- this is true - watch for fireworks;

The American Farm Bureau and Illinois Farm Bureau are at odds right now also. The American Farm Bureau is made of mostly Southern Farmers. Some are peanut farmers who doe not raise peanuts anymore and receive subsidies for not raising peanuts- but then they plant soybeans and harvest those and sell them- so there is now this controversy between the southern or American Farm Bureau and other state farm bureaus and when the American guys get questioned - the state farm bureau gets kicked out...The states think this is not farm to get paid for two crops but only grow one- since guys like me grow one and get paid for one- why do they get paid twice? This supports their farms and leaves others out- why not have a level playing field? And this is where we are today with DOGE.

Land theft is happening here right now- Look at Lahaina, LA, Paradise, ect.

Farming isn't going to get any easier, or more profitable, if a good chunk of the labor force is deported.

It will for all of us who don't have quasi slave labor! I have ICE on speed dial, all these huge dairies with Guatamaulans living in trailer houses and working 80 hours a week for $10 a hour and no OT can SUCK IT.

Barring a real catastrophe like the Great Depression, nuclear world war or Covid x3 event. Land will be THE best asset to have in the future and near future. What does America look like with 400 million people? How bout half a billion? Towns and cities ballon country side shrinks and wilderness vanishes. In the far future we humans will be very different from what we are now. Unless something changes we will overgrow our planet and live and subsist in very different ways. At times I relish the fact I will not see it.

I’m an in the trenches corn soybeans farmer and wannabe Daniel Boon. Geronimo is gone, the buffalo is gone, the family farm is gone, the dream is gone. Sleep tight

The guys that build fence for all of my neighbors and me are illegal. And hard workers. And good guys with good families. Not sure about slave labor--but I don't see any white guys or black guys showing up to do it.

Guys used to be able to actually own a farm and build their own fence, milk their own cows. Now huge operations using Illegals dominate agriculture and it's not from lack of others wanting to owner operate, they just cant compete with the giants and their quasi slave labor.

I build my own fence, Larry on here is building his own fence, why should we need to compete against the Illegals who are not even supposed to be here?

On the other hand, give me the number to your "good illegals", I have a fence that needs to be built as soon as the ICE melts.

LOL. They do good work. I farm part time. I am glad I have the resource. Mending is one thing (did that all weekend) but I don't have time to put in a half mile of fence these days.

You complain on one thread about tax money going to illegals, and on this one you're part of the problem.

Farm land here is being consolidated back into large chunks owned by one family.

What use to be 5 family owned 100acre farms are being bought up by large dairy farmers.

Then they,res what we call "gentlemen farmers" , guys with money who buy a farm for tax purposes and govt handouts for putting it into CRP.
(think, Oliver Douglas)

Ya who's gonna do all the crappy cheep jobs when u guys send them all back soon

Its legal to sell raw milk here now. Local guy with a few jersy's (lots of cream) is making some profit. Japan wants to buy ethanol. Trump is green lighting it. Should bode well for corn and milo prices. Farmers around here seem to be ok. Land prices are high for farm ground. Would be lots cheaper if no one was making money. Pasture is the same. Expensive. They all have nice vehicles etc. I dont know anybody relying on their garden like when I was a kid. People garden as a choice not a necessity. Everybody has running water and inside toilets. Most on a meter with a bill. Not wells.

You ought to be fined for hiring illegals Blaine. Its against the law and your an officer of the court. Time to enforce all those laws. I know two Americans with American employees, making a good living building fence.

X2
Un-American

While I agree with some of what you said I don't fully buy the "it will for all of us" past of your post. Throw a tariff on potash, metals, farm machinery, and get retaliatory ones on agricultural goods like soybeans and the idea that everyone will profit more is just simply not going to be accurate.

Anyone know how dairy imports work in Canada, or poultry or beef.

It was more of a long term outlook. Currently there is almost no hope for smaller farms to continue except as specialty farms catering to townies with $$$. I had a guy delivering hay here Sunday, 25 years old and runs a dairy with his dad, they milk 70 cows and want to expand as technology now would allow them to have more cows with 2 operators but they can't afford the land because Mega Farms buy or rent everything they can and use Illegals to run it. I'm more than happy to see the mega operators and their illegal labors suffer. We don't need the illegals, we just need to adopt the technology available and allow owner operators to make a fair income off their own labor on their own farms.

Specifically what exactly? I feel like I know the odd thing (not a farmer, but dad is, as are multiple family and friends)

You have any idea how farmers that hire migrants workers work around here? They submit paperwork to the government showing the need, housing meets requirements, and time frame from my understanding.

Housing is not a slave shack but heating ac, hot and cold water cable TV. I have stayed in hotels that are not as nice. Each year the same familys return. Not a single one Is Illegal or going to be deported and they are also paid well.

Is it allowed, are their tariffs, although I think you knew the answer.

OK I'm wrong I don't know small dary farmers and have not been to conferences where thsi gas been discussed.

The small farmers are marketing cheese and making a profit off that and thought ille sell raw milk for $10 a gallon when they have extra or at least did before I moved and quit buying it from them. Cow shares are how its got around buying raw milk now. Whwe're each customer leases a share of the cow so mnow they can get milk from their own cow without government intervention.

Rat, Is it allowed? LOL I know you're asking that rhetorically but I'm not sure you think what is actuality. Heck 10-20000 live US beef make it's way across the border to Alberta alone every month and then back again. Some live animals cross many times.
There are tariffs on 1% of US dairy exports into Canada. The USMCA your King highly touted when he was part of making it had Canada drop tariffs on US dairy completely up to a certain volume. Yes, Canada does limit the amount that comes in due to how the dairy industry is set up. (That's a different discussion)
Canada did not previously tariff US beef prior to the February retaliatory tariff. So, no.
Cabada did not previously tariff US poultry with the exception of certain of certain things like leg parts, again to reduce amount (again, another discussion) before the same retaliatory tariff.

I know that your favourite youtuber, or X personality or Facebook meme page is telling you other things but I'd go for what the National Cattleman's Beef Association has to say about the situation regarding importing/ex[porting beef as more of an authority on the topic.

Such insight in all the above post

High fuel prices and high interest rates are giving the farm community large and small heartburn. We can do both for a while but 4 years is really putting the hurt on a lot of farms.

Perhaps you aren't paying a decent wage. Plenty of American citizens here in SW Missouri building fence for money. I see fence companies working year around.
And yes, these legal fence builders, white guys as you call them, have families just like your illegals.

Here in central IL kids wet behind the ears want $20 an hour to build fence and bale hay. What's funny and a slap in their face is that guys that are 55 and retired want $10 an hour for the same work because they miss the farm and enjoy the work. I don't work anyone too hard and get twice the work out of the old geezers. The young ones get blisters and heat bothers them and cold bothers them and they want it all perfect. The older guys have fun no matter what because they love being on the farm and getting the fresh air. I got one guy that is a retired mailman who just loves to chop wood. I think he'd make a good trapper.

Currently, the generation has a short memory or lack of knowledge. American agriculture has always relied on migrant/immigrant labor to a large degree, some forced and some by choice. The difference is that most are Hispanic currently and they can walk across the border rather than coming on a boat.
If you're not old enough to understand what was meant when someone said "cotton-pickin'" it was used as a by-word akin to cursing. A cotton-picker worked long, hard hours for next to nothing; they were considered at the bottom of society and economically were at the bottom. My mother's people traveled picking cotton and other field tasks; I heard her say many times how hard the work was and how little they got paid dragging a cotton sack. They didn't get much education because the cotton field work required the whole family to participate in order to survive. The locals wanted them to do their task and move on.

Very well said!!!

In the last tarriff round that DJT started, with China they switched their soybean purchases to Brazil, and the USA has not been able to get this back.
Manitoba exports 3-4 million live piglet hogs and there is going to be a 25% tarriff on those.....so those southern barns are going to be MT this summer

LOL. These boys aren't on welfare. Illegals cannot get welfare. Or social security benefits or the ever popular social security disability (even though a lot of them pay into the system). This has been covered on here repeatedly.

I did learn from Danny that asylum seekers can and do get welfare--but they are not illegal. Cut that off.

4 years ago those seekers who crossed the border first and then asked for asylum would have been considered illegal.

Some land around here (irrigated) is taxed at $105/acre. I'm sure it's worse in the Midwest.
Omaha doctors and such own alot of land.

Many not factual info posts on here, but reviewing those can come at a later date and time. Farmers get picked upon a lot here but the vast majority of undocumented workers do not work in agriculture. It is that a lot of agriculture has gravitated to the usage of those labor sources as well as the food processing industries. In WI they estimate roughly 70K of undocumented workers of which about 10% are designated as ag labor.

As to cashflow and or farm financial troubles, yes that is true and one of the reasons the small farms are losing out is the larger farms have the leverage and equity to buy them out, even if they carry a lot of debt. They can work on very slim margins where smaller family sized farms can not continue to exist with narrow margins. Around here many small farmers are leasing their acres to these larger farms and those rental fees are allowing them to hold on to their farms and retire and or live quite a lot better than when they were running a smaller operation. We all want capitalism until it directly hits us. Our farm programs that were established for the most part in 1949 with several modifications works on bushels, tons and acres and that has always benefited those who have better yields and more acres.

Bryce

Farmers in the Sandhills are leasing pivots to Idaho potato farmers.

I have 130ish acres in crp and another 70 not enrolled and it's $3,500 a year in taxes. $105 a acre is brutal.

Bryce and Pawnee have the most accurate answers here.

Grain farmer myself, farm 800 acres of grain in a family operation, partnered with my uncle. We make a living, but have to keep a sharp pencil in a time of slim margins in grain farming.

When input prices increase ( seed, fertilizer, land rent, etc. ) it takes a lot for them to go back down. A bag of seed corn cost $400 +/- to plant 2.8 acres. Nitrogen is .50-.75 per pound of N. It cost a lot of money to plant an acre of corn.

Operating expenses are too high and grain prices aren’t high enough to get the return we need to operate comfortably. Ideally, operating expenses need to come down while grain prices remain relatively the same, because grain priced too high isn’t good for an economy ( trickle down to increase the price of a lot of foods, pork chicken etc.)

Large farmers can absorb a lot more than the smaller acreage farmers, and have the buying power to make them prevail over time.

Factors contributing to a down agricultural economy:
High interest rates
High land prices, most priced for recreation/hunting
High land rent
Low grain prices
Over Regulation
High operating expenses ( labor, equipment, seed , fertilizer)

This is for a new high school that provides charging stations for the cellphones. Yes, really. Crete, Nebraska

All the post on slave labor give me a chuckle. Do you guys realize we have to pay our white or Mexican cowboys from $20-$22 a hour with health insurance and other benefits. That’s $20 a hour for a guy with maybe or maybe not a high school education. And no we are not all going to starve to death if every last illegal is deported. That’s just a communist talking point

Does a high school education make for a better cowboy?

Here they do not farm for what the grain brings. It is the Government money that keeps them going.
https://farm.ewg.org/?fbclid=IwAR33_L1ZOVMFVBDjO0HxscfyNEkJruPQBOSbtfyc2aQzgGhFV2MTfc-YF_w

No I didn’t say it did. College education with a bachelor in Animal science helps tho

Government payments are for the most part nonexistent on growing crops. There are NRCS programs that will pay for enhanced conservation practices.

Any landowner can enroll acres in CRP , CREP . If it’s profitable go buy a bunch of land and get in on it. Sounds so easy

I am in Ward county ND. Look it up and tell that to my neighbors. They farm from the water to the road, it is odd conservation practices. I am told they are paid by the acre, and they farm what will not grow a crop, because it pays. The top 33 farm in my zip code 58718 drew seven digits or more from 1995-2023. That does not include cents, it is dollars. The top drew $1,053,113.15 It is all on there. many are listed more then once. Some in the farms name, some in their name, some in a trust or group, some in the Dads name.
The top drawing farm in ND drew $62,549,552 from 1995-2023, maybe more. I do not know if they are listed in other names, I do not know them.

Rural America is dieing off , small towns are dead , schools consolidating . The bigger is better approach has killed rural America . Hard to be a family farm or ranch when competing with farmers living large on govt subsidies , programs and the big one - federal crop insurance which is raped and abused with wild abandon . Theft by pen is still theft . And to top it off . Alot of these joker's get there debt forgiven when they completely overspend there selves into oblivion . Instead of being sold out to let a young producer get a opportunity they keep rolling , only to do it again . We need a major overhaul in the govt grain farming sector

I'll just comment on the labor side of this though I suspect it is a small drop in the bucket of bigger farming issues like land availability/costs, fuel and other chemical inputs.

I've got a fair amount of experience with the legalities of processing multiple types of visa paperwork. What PF states is basically a reference to the H2A visa that includes the ag arena. Most of us, myself included, often think that ag is extensively run on the labor of illegal immigrants and at one time it definitely was in many circumstances. But that isnt necessarily the current state of affairs at least depending where you are located and the particular ag sector. One reason is that over the last couple of decades migrants found more lucrative places to work and lots of the hard work required by ag sector was left high and dry. H2A visas provided a relief valve and they are about the simplest thing there is in the visa world. Every large ag employer in these parts utilizes the system. Those big mega farms that you think are running on illegal labor are likely not. Their staff will have legal papers and are fairly well compensated and staying in decent housing to boot. There are even businesses dedicated to processing migrants and visas specifically to contract them out to ag businesses. Around these parts they've been wondering when ICE is going to show up. What you are going to find when they arrive is that the big places sorta chuckle and shrug while pointing them down the road to the much smaller farms that they know are the ones actually using illegal migrants .

MJM I personally report and sign for over 10,000 acres plus my own. It maybe different in other states but I’ve been doing this for 30 years and our farm is lucky to get a check for $300 from the government. There were big payments under Trump in his first administration for the trade wars and yes there are CRP payments and NRCS payments. The last CRP I put in paid $30 an acre which covers the taxes and upkeep. I believe most folks confuse the amounts you posted with farmers getting paid per acre on crops. That’s not true! There are two programs at the FSA (farm service agency) PLC AND ARK they haven’t paid jack as long as I’ve been enrolled. I’d also point out the hundreds of non landowners I see hunting and trapping CRP acres so sportsmen should be careful on what they say on the web. I don’t belong to any farming forms and I always hope they don’t see threads like this.

Around here CRP is pretty good. Hill ground pays $120-$180 per acre. Bottom ground that is deemed wetlands pays $290. Just cannot believe the crop insurance scamming isn't cracked down upon. Maybe DOGE?

Another factor many don't realize is that in some if not many cases the amount one sees as federal subsidies includes all the federal crop insurance payments that the farmer recieved and are not direct subsidies but payments made do to lower crop prices, lower yields, drought emergencies etc. and the farmer does pay crop insurance premiums for those crop insurance dollars. Yes those premiums are subsidized at a certain percentage, Interestingly the federal crop insurance plans are sold in the private sector, so government workers are not hired to write the insurance plans. These types of programs were started about 3-4 farm bills ago to start to privatize the insuring of the crops and commodities. Somewhat like the advantage plans for Medicare that are actually private coverage plans.

Bryce

Farming is like any other business in that if you sell your product to someone who dictates the price to you your going to only make as much money as they let you.

Many farmers have figured out that selling direct to consumers and diversifying what you plant/grow is a solid way to make it in farming.



We buy all our Beef, pork and some chicken locally. It costs more but the quality is better and I like knowing I am supporting the farmer just down the road from me.

You’re right Dirty D, diversification has kept a lot of farms going. Growing barley or rye for a local brewery, growing grain for local cattle/hog/chicken growers , u-pick, selling on farm products etc. These are niche and don’t utilize a lot of acres.

We’re lucky to have a strong poultry presence in our area. So our corn basis is strong, usually .60-1.00 over. This helps support our corn price.

Hopefully the “farmers in trouble” pull through. A lot of hunting, trapping, fishing happen on farmers property. When they sell to housing development, solar companies, etc - all that recreation will come to a halt.

Thanks for the info those are crazy high CRP payments. What do you mean by insurance scamming. For a farmer that means years in the clink if caught and absolutely not worth it. I keep 7-10 years worth of every load corn, wheat, silage as proof of yield off every field and so does my crop insurance agency.

Is CRP one of the programs that is going to be affected by the funding freeze?
As a guy who watches acres and acres of habitat pushed over every year to grow more canola I am a believer that the CRP programs you guys have are terrific in general.
But I ask this because in the last day I’ve read countless articles about the USDA funding freeze for certain programs and conservation contracts. Has all USDA funding actually been frozen?

Last i saw reported government subsidies make up about 40% of net farm income for US farmers

It doesn't mater what they call the office or the payment it is all US tax dollar money. It doesn't mater if it comes is a dozen checks. As far as me talking about it on the web. Is it that the money was not paid to them or that they don't want the tax payer to know about it.

The largest farms locally have full time Grant Writers, they get plenty of tax money. Full disclosure, I'm supposed to be getting $10,000 grant this year, the state sent me an email regarding Bird Flu transmission to livestock and how to stop it, I suggested an idea and they are giving me $10,000 to implement it, I'll personally be spending an extra $15,000 to bring the idea to fruition.

https://farm.ewg.org/index.php

Click on your state then on your county to see who receives what.

I dont trespass or advocate it.

The law needs changed. If a landowner is getting subsidized by the public IMO that subsidized land should be open to public. Hunting fishing camping picnicing etc. All with the same laws that apply to BLM and National forest. No damage, no trash etc. Landowner has the right to farm run cattle live on it, pass it down to heirs.

X2

If you look, lots of names are on there more than once

When I have looked at land (not looking to buy) in W KS and E CO I have been pretty surprised at the CRP rental rates. Bottom ground without wetlands designation would be $180-$220 here. I had a 5 acre patch of bottom put into CRP. Great deer habitat problem was it was a constant job fighting tree sprouts. Took it out and it is still farmed. Around here a lot of operators farming several thousand acres participate in crop insurance scamming. The non-greedy keep it on a very small scale. Transfer grain from the field, claim a loss, take grain to bins owned by the operation, feed out or sell over time, leave a few select poor patches for proof if needed. Small scale but ripping off none the less. The greedy ones get caught. Huge producer in Gallatin, MO plead guilty. A couple of others have been caught but were greedy or not smart.

I did just complete some forest stand improvement for cost share. Was just submitted and will be interesting to see when the payment comes through. I will gladly take a delay in return for taking out the waste.

I would like to see crop insurance go completely private.

When I look this up locally the same farm under different names is #1 and #3 and also #20, why is the same farm operating under 3 different names?

Interesting site, Danny. I noticed the duplication among my neighbors too.

More money, I reckon.

Interesting stuff, a lot of money being thrown around.

There our very few small farmers any more!(making a living off farming)
My cousins farm 3000 acres ,and he told me that they take the place of 20 farmers in the 1970s

With a few limitations I agree with this. The public should get use from public money spent.

Lots of people making a living off 10 acres or less.
Look into all the people that have farm stores and sell at local farmer markets.


Had a neighbor that had 1/2 acre in raspberries. Had my kids and his picking berries to sell and also did U-pick.
He made over $3000 for 1/2 acre. He didn't put much effort into it, no pruning, fertilizing or any other work than picking and selling.
He did rotate a small chunk out every year and plant a new row tho.
He had all sorts of Raspberries, purple, red, yellow, black.

He could of done more work and gotten much better yields I'll bet but he didn't want to do the work.

Now look at Asparagus, pumpkins, Strawberries, and flowers.

Point is you have to sell direct to consumer, get rid of the middleman who's taking all the profits.

This thread is very interesting to read, way different happenings in the Eastern 2/3rds of the country vs the Western States that are largely owned by the Feds. Definitions of small vs large and being able to make a living off x number of acres is also different.

One thing I'll say is a lot of the labor for some of these operations is going the way of robotics especially in the dairy and confined feeding areas. There are several dairymen on Facebook show the robotics in their barns and have seen a 10,000 head ewe facility that used robots for several parts of the labor. Things are changing and most small farms I've been around are very inefficient .

I posted this link a few years ago. My neighbor got paid for tobacco thy never planted.

I also don't know of anyone who ever received 50,000.00 plus in foodstamps.

Both programs are funded with taxpayer money.

The problem with H2A program is that the farmers that bring the workers over are paying them.more..per govt instructions, than they pay the Americans that qork for thwm. And the H2A Program participant do not pay taxes(at least in wyoming)

The H2A guys that worked where Jerry did mde more money than he did. He made 600 to 700 less a check because he had to pay taxes.

It's BS.

H2A workers do pay federal income tax and state taxes if there are state taxes, unless the state does not collect on non residents.

Bryce

That does suck when it happens.

Farmers will be fine. Hopefully Japan buying ethanol will reduce the subsidies.

The vast majority of these payments are for CRP, CReP and conservation projects. Crop insurance subsidies are about 80$ an acre but I think there is a 50,000$ max, hence you will see different family names on the farms "seperate" fields. I dont consider a CRP payment a subsidy, more so rent.

That may be the case where you are but, there is very little CRP in my zip code area. I have plat maps of the area and know who farms what. They are my neighbors. It is planted crop or grazed pasture here for the most part. The closer to my house you get the less CRP there is.

None of the largest names locally on the list have CRP.

Only shows program payments , crp , disaster . Does not show crop insurance which is the big money maker

It shows commodity subsidies iam assuming that's crop insurance

Nope

Note the link crop insurance proceeds are reported

Bryce

https://farm.ewg.org/index.php

Here you go if you want to find out.

All i know for 100% fact is that H2A workers don't pay taxes in wyoming. Federal or state.

Also the employer is required to pay all the workers traveling expenses(air fare, food and hotels) to work and back home.

The guys would give jerrys bosses their expense receipts when they got to Wyoming and they'd get reimbursed.

The govt also requires special housing with craploads of inspections for the h2a guys but the Americans can sleep in a tent and the govt wouldn't care.

Jerry paid his own traveling expenses and was never in his 30 years there reimbursed.
( he worked with guys on the H2A program thenlastb10 years of his employment at the ranch so it wasn't a 1 and one..he knows and so do I from being with him, all about wyomings H2A program details..
(Id assume.since its a federal program all rules would be the same)

The BS is a good part of why he retired.

Who wants to work their butts off for 20 years and then have someone come in making more than you are and you're the ranch forman??

Pure BS.

Also they employer has to guarantee their contract..if they have a 6 month contract and wanna leave after 3 or get injured r wven fired,they get paid their entire 6 month contract( it happened on the ranch 3 tumes with different h2a workers.

It's a screwing for the American workers.

I know.americans don't wanna do those jobs but if the American employees were offered the same things the H2A workers got more Americans would do the work, imo.

There also required to.provide them with a vehicle..even on their off days..that never happened for Jerry.

They are enquired to provide all thw h2a workers boots and work clothes..gloves and all and that didn't happen foe Jerry either.

One time the bought all the h2a guys new 200.00 apair boots to work in and Jerry didn't get a pair..again..another show of the screwing.

The guys he worked with for the most part were had workers but it doesn't change the fact that our American govr would rather put foreigners to work than their fellow americans.

I know his employer could have done the same things for Jerry but thwy didn't because the country Jerry is a citizen of decided the contract workers are more important and d3serve special treatment.

BS.

And yall.can disagree all ya want..I know what I'm talking about.
Jerry lives it for 10 years.

I am not sure what the program was called or it is still running, but the Government paid half the wages of workers if they came from other countries. Here there is a lot of South Africans working around me on farms. They seem like good enough guys, but who would you hire? The guy you pay 50% or the full 100% guy.

I think there is sometimes a feeling that "If you don't support every farmer you hate farmers" and I don't think that's ever been the case. Most of my friends farm, I hunt on farmers land, I farm. I think the Govt for to long has had their hand on the scale and it's hurt a lot of us and we're sick of seeing things being lost because of it.

Of my many friends growing up who wanted to farm ONE made it into farming full time, he married the farmers daughter, smart lad. The rest of us work full time off the farm or run a business and dump all the money into our own farms hoping one day we can farm full time. I don't think it would be that way without someone's thumb on the scale giving Millions to a few big farms locally. Maybe I'm just resentful, I remember a time when it was all small farms and we all called each other for help, now the farmers live 20+ miles away and blow in a couple times a year with 6 million dollars in equipment and you've never shook their hand, never even saw them up close and they don't treat the community or the neighbors the same. Then you see their name multiple times on the list of subsidy recipients receiving Million + under each name, just frustrating.

Donnersurvior, it does make it hard to compete buying land when their subsidy every year is way more then you make. Ask how I know. I bid on some pasture against one high on the list. There was no end to what he was willing to pay. I ran it up enough the seller sent me a check and told me to take my wife to dinner. I was hoping I didn't get the land at the end of my bidding. It was three quarters less then two miles from my house.

Cathrn, no disrespect but why did Jerry put up with that so long?, or at least lean on the boss for equal treatment?, sounds like they had little regard for him...which would have whizzed me off if I was him....

Thats why they rent land, and cook the books

Thanks guys, sounds like a bunch of programs. Imagine the big guys have full time grant/subsidies writers on staff.

When he talked to twm about it at the end of the year thy told him they didn't need him anymore..that they were gonna go to all Peruvians.

They sent him a check for 10,000.00 as a severance deal.

Then covid hit and they couldn't get the H2A guys so they called him.and asked him to come back he went back for 2 years. If they hadn't Sen him the money he wouldn't have went back.

The real main reason he stayed was because they let him stop working end of Sept and he could trap in wyoming starting October first and they let him stay in the bunkhouse that month while he trapped and they didn't charge him anything..(he always gave them.money for the electric bill)

It was very upsetting to him but he'd put up with alot in order to be able to trap.

They still allow him to stay on the ranch when he's trapping in wyoming.