Has anyone heard of (or experienced) this issue w/ trucks newer than 2014 pertaining to people that don't drive it much?: I have had a '24 half ton for 12 months & have been having a problem. I have 3,420 miles on it. I drive it 9 miles daily (round trip) to work & that's about it. ~6 times in the past year I have driven it to a nearby town about 15-30 minutes away, otherwise it's just to/from work. I live a couple miles from town & only have 2 stop lights on my 4 1/2 mile commute. It rarely gets much above 50 MPH for > than a minute. I 1st noticed the issue a few months ago when the check engine light came on & it said something about rich fuel. The engine light went off on it's own later that day, but the MPG got progressively worse the past several months, causing frustration that some friends blamed on it being winter, unbroken in & a lightly driven vehicle. Sunday I went to start it & the warning light was flashing & it went into reduced power mode. I didn't drive it & I called the dealer Monday & they had it towed to the shop. Monday I got an Onstar email saying the battery was concerningly low. I checked the battery & sure enough it was way low. Other than that, the sole apparent issue (other than the bad gas mileage, which is a result of the issues mentioned in this paragraph) has been gas getting into the cylinders (based on what I figured out Tuesday from the dealer). The dealer pulled the dipstick & could smell gas (& the level was high). Thus the dealer changed the oil Tuesday (after having done so only 400 miles ago). The dealer was able to get the trouble codes to go away but says the problem is 100% due to my driving style/usage. They said every 3rd day I need to start putting miles on it. Basically I learned Tuesday that I bought a truck that I can't use unless I drastically change my ways. Is it me or the truck or..? I offered to trade it in for 1 of their other makes but they said I will have this issue w/ any truck newer than '14 (when direct injection started being put in all trucks). Granted we all know short trips aren't good for vehicles, I had never heard of this issue w/ direct injection causing excess gas in the oil of vehicles. Thoughts? I'm aware it's winter (cold), but there must be some folks out there that drive like I do. Thanks

I’m guessing it’s messing with an o2 sensor by idling around.

I don't let it idle more than about the time it takes me to put on my hat/gloves & remove the windshield cover.

I should have mentioned that at least once/week I drive it to my neighbors house, less than 1/2 mile away.

The thing is your not driving hard to heat the o2 sensor up to keep it clean, or there’s an exhaust leak so there’s too much oxygen in the exhaust and it’s adding gas to compensate.

Hmmm.. I hadn't thought of that.

You need to take that truck out and let it get up to operating temperature and maintain highway speeds for a half hour or so, with all the sensors and everything on them now you can't drive them the way you are, you are destroying your truck by babying it. As the old timers around here used to say you have to blow the soot out of them every now and then, what they meant was every now and then you need to stomp that accelerator when you start and get up to highway speed as fast as possible to clean out the particulate in the engine and exhaust. I seriously doubt that most days your truck ever gets to operating temperature before you shut it down.

With your battery low

You're not running it long enough for the alternator to charge the battery.

More starts than miles.

I'm thinking you are onto something K9.


2 nights ago I started plugging in the block heater w/ a timer set to come on ~4 1/2 hrs before I head to work.

Also, I put cardboard on the grill Tuesday night (but then Wed my co-worker said my truck has automated louvers so I should remove the cardboard winter grille front).


I'm trying to get this figured out before I do long term damage.


Those of you that plan on upgrading to a truck 2014 or newer for you or a family member (or as a 2nd vehicle) that don't drive much might want to follow this thread & learn so you don't run into this issue that is bogging me down.

3 miles each way you need a bicycle. 20 minutes easy. drive the truck when you need to go somewhere.

Direct injection sucks. The fuel doesn't wash the intake valves like an older engine. That causes lots of carbon build up. Newer trucks suck unless you can afford to trade em in every 3 or 4 years.

What brand and engine?

Rev it up to about 4500 rpm for 3 minutes before you shut it off. Let it idle down then shut it off. If it has auto start on it turn it off each time you use it.

I'd burn or syphon the stale fuel out.
A trap line comes to mind.
If no help, burn that novel you typed and see
a different dealer. Tell them it's not right and that's all.
If they say blah blah tell them you want it gone.
You did not pay all this to drive a turd.

Dang puter sensored bleep bleeps lol.
Stale fuel.

Doesn’t it have a warranty? Running a vehicle with gas in the oil is like running honing oil.

Buy a hybrid and sell your truck. You would do better with an old beater even. 3,500 miles a year the truck is like mouse trapping with double longsprings.

Fifth of whiskey and a blacktop middle of the no where road. Drive it like you stole it and seat the rings.

Exactly!

Drive it like you stole it was never an induced state of mind for me..

Silverado 1500 2.7L Turbo.

I asked the dealer about trading it in for a different model GM too, and they said direct injection as it relates to my driving style is the issue, nothing to do w/ the model or engine type they said. Note: this dealer sells new Rams, Ford & Chevrolet. Large, established reputable dealership. That said, I'm not saying any dealer is perfect. I would be open to having another dealer look at it if the Check Engine light returns. I'm trying to change my driving style to avoid future problems.

Yes, I was able to get the warranty to cover it.

Actually, it has a Lifetime engine warranty.

The problem I've been having is that the gas is washing the combustion chamber.

I stated that wrong. It's the intake valves that don't get washed and get carboned up.

Silverado 1500 2.7L Turbo.

Yes, you are going to have to get that truck out at least once a week and let it get up to operating temperature and drive it that way at highway speeds for a while, those tiny turbo engines are not designed for a short commuter type application they are designed to be brought up to operating temperature and kept there for at least a half hour when they are ran. You bought an engine designed for a long distance commuter/delivery type vehicle that is on the road and gets relatively high mileage in a larger vehicle. Not being mean, but you have had the truck a year and haven't driven it enough to actually break it in, it is in effect dry rotting.

Those engines have a redline of 6,000 RPM. That is how they are able to make such a small displacement engine move a full size truck.
I doubt that you ever push that engine much over 1,800 RPM. There's your trouble.
You don't need to drive it over a hundred miles an hour when you take it out, just see what your best time is from zero to whatever the speed limit is a number of times each trip.
That will get your RPM up to 5,000 and make the engine happy.

I won't rule anything out but I specifically asked the dealer Tuesday if I should trade in for a bigger engine & they said no, that that wouldn't help my direct injection issue because of my driving ~style.
Dealers don't always know everything, but I asked the Service Advisor Tuesday & that is what I was told.

2-strokes been doing it for years.

You're not driving far enough to thoroughly heat up everything. That will cause al lot of fuel dilution in your oil and low charge on the battery.

Best method: start the vehicle, do not sit and try to warm it up. Drive away afterno more than 30 seconds and drive far enough one way (6-9 miles) to get everything up to operating temperature.

Cold starts and short trips never allow the piston rings (or anything else) to reach proper operating temperature and SEAL correctly. This has all been proven by people in the oil business by doing various drive cycles and taking oil samples.

Cold starts and short drives will dilute the oil by as much as 40% more fuel than proper start up and getting everything up to temperature before stopping.

2 strokes run with oil in the gas, not gas in the oil.

Too bad the dealer didn’t ask about your driving habits before they sold you that truck. They may have found you a better match.

Most engines now are direct injection.

Find an old beater to drive in the winter, only use the truck for long trips. New vehicles suck, direct injection sucks. For many years I drove 4 miles round trip, if I left the heater off the engine would warm up each way, but I still needed to go for a longer drive every week to burn the gas out of the oil and did charge the battery at least once a month. Still driving that old beater, $8 a month for liability insurance, makes your truck last a lot longer too.

Had a flashing check engine light. Mechanic said most always its an ignition problem. Had it scanned and #3 coil was bad. Cost me $200.
just

It's almost certainly not washing past the rings. The high pressure fuel pump sits on top of/inside the valve cover and runs off of a lobe on the cam. When the leak, they leak internal to the engine, and spray a fine mist of fuel into the engine. This fine mist not only dilutes the oil, but it gets sucked up by the PCV system and burned. Because this extra fuel wasn't metered, it creates a rich condition, which is the cause of your rich codes. I'm kind of surprised the dealer didn't know this. I've done several high pressure fuel pumps for this exact issue on Chevy 4 cylinders. Is it under warranty? My guess is that it's an expensive job and they don't want to warranty it.

I been watching this thread and reading all the posts and finally someone posts the right answer. If your oil is getting overfilled with fuel it has to be leaking in internally. Those high pressure fuel pumps put out over 500 psi of pressure. There is no way your driving style is gonna make the engine spray that much fuel through the fuel injectors to wash down the cylinders and fill the oil in the crankcase with fuel. If that is what really is happening. The only other possible way would be a stuck open/ leaking fuel injector but then you would have a bad misfire/dead cylinder.

Either way the way you drive it has nothing to do with gas getting in your oil and filling the crankcase. The computer reads the coolant sensor and the oxygen sensors and gives the engine the right amount of fuel no matter if the engine is cold or hot. It adjust the amount accordingly.

In short, if your crankcase/oil is getting overfilled with fuel then there has to be a fuel leak going into the engine.

I did a massive amount of research prior to buying the truck, & never came across anything even remotely mentioning a concern related to the issue I'm having.
But Tuesday the dealership said this is a known issue among dealers pertaining to situations where a person drives a 2014 or newer truck that compares to my driving style.

The vehicle is under warranty.

You guys need to re-read what I posted. Until the motor in completely up to temperature, the piston RINGS are not sealing correctly. The fuel mixture is leaking past the rings.

I anyone wants the video I can find it and link you to it.

The battery not staying charged is a separate issue. Not enough drive time to charge. I've seen other Chevy/GMC truck owners with the same problem.

I'll save the response.

The guy wearing glasses is Lake Speed. He works for Total Sealed Piston rings. Has worked with Joe Gibbs racing, and also helped Valvoline formulate the Restore and Protect diesel oil that Valvoline sells.

Bingo. That paragraph is exactly what the Service Manager told me this week.

As for the part in bold, I've never once in the past year started it up just to let it idle, so that aspect isn't the problem with the truck in my driveway. The part in bold is my normal routine.

I started using the block heater Wednesday for the 1st time ever. It seems to be helping immensely, however GM's block heater chord comes with a built in thermostat so the block heater won't operate if the outside air temp is above 0°. We're in a stretch though where ~9 out of 10 nights have been below 0.

This is a good thread. Hopefully it also helps others avoid the problem I had/have.

Block heaters are a big plus.

The other night my cousin was at the local archery club & he said several guys were talking about their new trucks having battery issues.

It sure seems to be. Today I hit 205° only a half mile down the road. I had the block heater on a timer last night to turn on at 2:30 am. Also, I avoided running the heater/radio this AM & I charged the (very low) battery last night.

Too many electronics on board nowadays.

That was my thought too.

If it's cold, and I'm not going to drive my truck every day, I popped the hood and put the battery tender on it. You'll be surprised to probably see that the charge light comes on after driving it 40 miles. And, yes, my gages work.

Probably so. I have been trying to run it a litle more & I'm looking forward to getting setup so I can use my tender.

Man is it cold out tonight.

x2 get them warmed up good and use them often in the cold

I don't know whether or not the dealer knew about the part in bold. Likely they are aware of what you are describing. I didn't specifically ask them in those terms, and your description is perhaps more detailed than what a dealer would typically describe to customers.

They don't think there is a fuel leak in the engine, but I'll keep that possibilty in mind.

I got what might be considered a '2nd opinion' today by talking to the most knowledgeable unbiased engine guru I know--a vehicular genius basically. He said the dealer's diagnosis makes sense to him, though he didn't dig in & do a physical inspection.

I'm still researching the issue. It's been working good since I got it back from the dealer but that doesn't mean for sure that I've found a long term solution yet. I've been driving it more & using a block heater.

These below zero temps are getting kind of old but it is winter in Wi.

If the video was watched, the fuel dilution is caused during warm up before all metal components are up to temperature and dimensional size. Fuel is leaking past piston rings that are not yet sealing against the cylinder wall.

The fuel pump is just doing its job. If it's a Bosch CP4 pump, they are used on many different manufacturers engines and problems have occurred for every make.

Excess fuel has been getting into the engine when it's cold, correct. In that sense, I suppose one could loosely use the word "leak" to describe how it's getting in there

Cars, SUVs & vans too?

A cold start on any engine will have some kind of fuel leakage given it is a conternal combustion motor. There are tolerance for moving parts and heat expansion. Otherwise it would just cease to run. That said drive it like you stold it once and a wile and break it in.

Yeppers. Chsing the EPA's fuel economy mandates.

Look for a southern Chevy with the vortec 1999 to 2005

Most interesting article on this issue I've found yet and it just happened to appear on the Yahoo home page this morning:

https://autos.yahoo.com/no-probably-dont-warm-car-153600483.html

X2. Unfortunately the block heater only works below 0°. I used it the other night & plan to plugin the block heater again Sunday night based on the forecast.
Some nights I take a detour on my way home from work.
I watch the temperature gauge close to ensure it's warmed up before I shut it off.

Instead of a cab heater like the 1 in Lake Speed's video that 1 of you posted, I might buy a dash heater like this to help with my issue:
https://share.google/kADZDxWp4yiiM3oq3

New vehicles suck, direct injection sucks, small displacement turbo engines suck, the only thing better is they don’t seem to rust out so fast. They are designed to start, warm up a minute or two then drive long distances. Not everybody wants that, for 15years I drove 2 mile each way to work, had a 2003 Tacoma let warm up a few minutes drove to work and shut it off. The heater was completely off so the engine warmed up some, but tried to drive it on weekend longer to burn the gas up in the oil. I’m retired now, still have the truck but have spent probably a hundred hours welding on the frame to keep it going. Sorry this is happening AJE, I remember you researched the heck out of trucks before buying one.

I've been shopping for a safe/effective dash mounted heater/defroster that won't be a fire hazard or a battery drain.